reasons for stereo micing acoustic guitar

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Phosphene

Phosphene

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When i want stereo acoustic guitar tracks, i usually just record 2 separate tracks. I like the slight variations and imperfections between the two that make them unique. So.....this is what
i am wondering....

I've read alot of posts on how to mic an acoustic guitar in stereo (x-y and other mic placemen techniques), but I don't get the exact point of it. I know you can get sightly different tones by micing in different positions, but how much different is it? Dont you risk phase problems? I think this question is more for digital recording people. When I copy one track of anything to another track to make it stereo, it sounds the same to me as if i just bumped the volume up on the original track. Am i on crack or am i right at all?

Like I said, I just do 2 (or more) tracks with one mic each. What are the advantages/differences that I might be missing out on by not stereo micing acoustic guitar?

hep me hep me

www.mp3.com/phosphene
 
The reason is to get a more defined intitial guitar tone, not neccasarily for stereo. I agree, it sounds better to do 2 seperate tracks with minor variations, but the idea is to do each of these tracks with 2 mics instead of one. It's just a way to get a fuller guitar sound, like recording an electric guitar by micing the amp and running direct. It's all about limitations.. why limit your takes if you have the resources to do a couple of tracks?
 
a lot of what i record is solo acoustic guitar, which needs to stand alone (or at least extremely prominent) in a track (sometimes along with vocals). i always stereo mic my guitar in this case.

i've got a martin d15 which records quite nicely (it's mahogany and not as boomy as the rosewood martins). i use a pair of mxl603's, and i position them as follows:

mic 1 goes about 6 or 8 inches off the fretboard, aimed somewhere around fret 10 or 12. this gives me a nice, round, almost "hollow" sound--as if you were playing on the neck.

mic 2 goes over the player's picking shoulder, parallel with the lower bout of the guitar, pointed straight down. the capsule of the mic is prolly right around even with the bridge of the guitar. this mic gives a pretty good representation of what you hear when playing the guitar (contrasted to what someone else hears from afar).

sometimes i'll stick a studio projects B1 up 4-6 feet away as a room mic. but not always.

WHY? b/c between the two 603's, i get a veritably huge sounding guitar out of one "pass" through the song i'm playing. neither mic gives me nearly as satisfying a sound on its own (in fact, they tend to sound either anemic or harsh when soloed), but together they sound spectacular. people i've played tracks for have commented that "it sounds like you're playing this now, in this room, right here in front of me". that's the goal entirely.

in a busy mix, this isn't at all what i'd do.....but for a song where the acoustic is the primary voice, it's the best way i've found to capture my guitar. sure i could record several passes and get minor variations to fill out the sound.....but that's not what i'm aiming for. what i want is one take with a huge sounding guitar.


wade
 
Phosphene said:
When i want stereo acoustic guitar tracks, i usually just record 2 separate tracks. I like the slight variations and imperfections between the two that make them unique. So.....this is what
i am wondering....

I've read alot of posts on how to mic an acoustic guitar in stereo (x-y and other mic placemen techniques), but I don't get the exact point of it. I know you can get sightly different tones by micing in different positions, but how much different is it? Dont you risk phase problems? I think this question is more for digital recording people. When I copy one track of anything to another track to make it stereo, it sounds the same to me as if i just bumped the volume up on the original track. Am i on crack or am i right at all?

Like I said, I just do 2 (or more) tracks with one mic each. What are the advantages/differences that I might be missing out on by not stereo micing acoustic guitar?

A true stereo guitar track (if done well) gives a more complete sound as if you were in the room. Panning and effects cannot duplicate this at all. The stereo miking picks up much more of the room sound which may not be a great thing if your room is acoustically bad.

hep me hep me

www.mp3.com/phosphene
Click to expand...
 
I tracked a singer/songwriter recently with just acoustic and voice. He did not want to double or do any thing other than just play the songs.

I put a MXL990 up close for vocals, put a Oktava MK012 and Nady D70 on the guitar, and another MK012 up near the ceiling about 4 feet in front of him.

I made sure that the mics on the guitar weren't having phase issues and we tracked like that. In mixing I panned them pretty hard and EQ'd a a little bringing them a little closer in tone.

It was a really neat effect and sounds huge. The condensor really got the pick attack and string noise while the cheap dynamic got a lot of bottom and midrange. After brightening it up At times it almost sounds like two guitars that just play REALLY well together.
 
good suggestions and tips, ill try it. i know about the 3:1 rule on eliminating phase problems, but what should i do with the mic on the 12th fret/over the shoulder method? just adjust them little by little until it sounds like phase isnt a problem? (hard to do when its just you) Just as long as they are the same distance from the guitars radiation points?
 
i haven't noticed any phase problems with that mic positioning, to be honest.

i just play and adjust the mics, all the while listening in the cans until it sounds good to me. if there's a phase problem, i haven't heard it.


wade
 
Phosphene said:
good suggestions and tips, ill try it. i know about the 3:1 rule on eliminating phase problems, but what should i do with the mic on the 12th fret/over the shoulder method? just adjust them little by little until it sounds like phase isnt a problem? (hard to do when its just you) Just as long as they are the same distance from the guitars radiation points?
Click to expand...


Put BOTH mics in mono and listen to the total guitar sound. You will have the exact placement when your mics combined have a strong, clean sound. There should be no "phase shifter" sound at all.
 
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