Raw Snake Cable

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MMHaus

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Can anybody offer some sources for raw snake cable. I keep looking at snakes already wired and can't seem to find just the right thing so it looks like the soldering gun and I are about to become good friends. I have a Full Compass catalog but wondered if there were some other discount places out there. Also if anyone would be kind enough to point me in the right direction for optimal wiring schemes I would be eternally grateful.

To give you an idea of what I am trying to wire together.....I have the following equipment:

Two (2) Tascam TM-D1000 mixers (XLR's on the first four and 1/4 Balanced on the first eight channels (i.e. redundant on the first four) Inserts on the first four and 4 group output/aux sends per mixer
MOTU 2408 system (8 unbalanced ins and 8 unbalanced outs - RCA's) feeding Digital Performer on a Mac to handle recording.
One MPX-100 processor and One dbx 166 compressor
although most processing is done internally in DP.
Quadra S4 and Proteus Modules and a Proteus MPS keyboard. (My own stuff, not necessarily even active when recording of other groups takes place.
I also have a 24 channel patch bay that I have never used for a lack of knowledge.

My intent is to build one snake for each of the mixers, probably twelve channels each with maybe 4 monitor sends per snake. These would have 4 XLR's and 8 balanced 1/4 jacks with 4 1/4 jacks for the sends.
Also I think a seperate snake for the 2408 with 8 ins and 8 outs wired down to 1/4 unbalanced ins/monitor outs at the other end. I think I can bus channels through DP to use the 2408 outs as monitor outs assuming little or no latency. Transfer between the mixers and the 2408 is by TDIF. Or can I somehow work the patch bay into this to reduce cabling.

My setup is less than optimal with my studio being in a second floor converted office/bedroom and my performance/ recording space being the first floor living/dining/sun rooms. I would run the snakes down through a cable chase I have created from the studio space down through a closet into the living room. Probably 50-75 feet per snake would get me everywhere I needed to go.

Wow this turned into a mind vomit. From suggestions for sourcing cable to an overall view of why I drive my wife crazy. Any suggestions/comments would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

Jonathan
 
Can anybody offer some sources for raw snake cable. I keep looking at snakes already wired and can't seem to find just the right thing so it looks like the soldering gun and I are about to become good friends.
Click to expand...

No sweat, have a look at these (cabling, connectors and patch bays):

http://www.redco.com/
http://www.cmh.net/catalog/Audio_Connectors_Adapters.html
http://www.belden.com/
http://www.gigcables.com/
http://www.canare.com/
http://www.hosatech.com/
http://home.flash.net/~motodata/patchbays/
http://www.neutrik.com/
http://proaudiodesign.com/parts_cables/bulkcable.php3
http://www.milestek.com/
http://www.switchcraft.com/
http://www.whirlwindusa.com/

Two (2) Tascam TM-D1000 mixers (XLR's on the first four and 1/4 Balanced on the first eight channels (i.e. redundant on the first four) Inserts on the first four and 4 group output/aux sends per mixer
Click to expand...

Yep, that makes sense. You might consider mounting a patch bay very close to your mixers (like right behind it) thus able to change which direct outs/busses you use on the fly. I can tell you from experience that anything you hard-wire, you will at one point need "one more line" that you won't have without a patch bay. Just sharing my exerience if I may.

My intent is to build one snake for each of the mixers, probably twelve channels each with maybe 4 monitor sends per snake. These would have 4 XLR's and 8 balanced 1/4 jacks with 4 1/4 jacks for the sends.
Click to expand...

You can buy a 48, 52, or 56 channel snake which is about 1.75" diameter, which might allow enough patching room for all your needs. You mount a patch bay behind your mixers, and wire it up with the snake to the other patch bay, which is near your instruments, if they are not scattered around your mixers. This way, you have built a simple snake, with many channels, and can use any jack for any purpose, as your needs change down the road. If you buy high quality cable, you won't have much, if any, cross talk between channels.

Remember to use low impedence cable for microphones (XLR) and "regular" cable for synths, effects, and other higher output devices.

My setup is less than optimal with my studio being in a second floor converted office/bedroom and my performance/ recording space being the first floor living/dining/sun rooms. I would run the snakes down through a cable chase I have created from the studio space down through a closet into the living room. Probably 50-75 feet per snake would get me everywhere I needed to go.
Click to expand...

In my recent move from CT to NJ, I gave up my studio/office/bedroom/storage/litter box arrangement in favor of a dedicated control room and sound booths. While I am just starting construction, the console room will be 15x18, with two 3x4' vocal booths against one side, and the "live" area will be the garage, with appropriate sound treatments for larger groups and/or band practices. The advantage of a converted garage, is I can put the car in it when done. Merely roll up the floor coverings etc. Not idea, but its much better than what I had in the old place.

Wow this turned into a mind vomit. From suggestions for sourcing cable to an overall view of why I drive my wife crazy. Any suggestions/comments would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

Don't vomit :) Remember to run a few extra cables, or a proportionally larger snake just to make sure you can expand and grow. I am more of a midi composer than live band kinda guy, so I have large quantities of vintage (and newer) synthesizers, outboards, etc, and I will have it all wired to patch bays. I've been acquiring used ADC patch bays (52 point, 1U) on e-bay for the last year or so in anticipation of this move, and have about 12 by now. This will enable me to connect up every jack on the mixers, outboards, and synths that have "L/R" out, as well as 1 thru 8 out, for maximum flexibility. Can never have too many audio jacks. Same goes for outlets. The way I'm wiring the studio electrically is everything is on one circuit, shares a common ground, and isolated from the rest of the house via a rack-mount UPS so that brownouts, AC line noise, is all filtered out in an attempt to minimize hum and other noise.

Since most raw snake cable is two conductor plus shield, I would recommend using TRS patch bays regardless if you need them in every case. This way if you do, you have them. Most effects and synths are unbalanced, so this is overkill. But one day that might change, or you may want to patch a direct out of channel 3 on your Tascam mixer, where your roland sampler was patched :)

A lot of planning ahead of time will save you the aggrevation of running cables across the floor later on.

Hope that helps,

Frederic
(midiguy732@hotmail.com)
 
Traditional cabling for snakes is heavy and bulky.My band did a cable TV show at a club where the snake was some kind of fibre-optical cable.It was pencil thin but it had more channels than our wrist-thick snake.If you are going to do the construction yourself,might as well check into modern alternatives.

Tom
 
I didn't mention it, but I will have a lightpipe snake in my studio as well. In fact, I finished melting toslink ends onto it last night. My akai DR8's, my adats, and my Triton rack all use lightpipe. Unfortunately, patch bays for this equipment is very expensive.

Unless one has experience snaking fiber optic cable, I strongly urge anyone requiring this to part with the funds to have a pro install it. Its fragile, and difficult to terminate unless you have been trained and have the kit to stick the connectors on.

Can't solder glass :)

I lucked out when I moved because it required me to clean up my basement, and I found a 24 strand fiber cable wrapped on the spool that I could use for my studio. Saved significant dollars!

Tom Hicks said:
Traditional cabling for snakes is heavy and bulky.My band did a cable TV show at a club where the snake was some kind of fibre-optical cable.It was pencil thin but it had more channels than our wrist-thick snake.If you are going to do the construction yourself,might as well check into modern alternatives.

Tom
Click to expand...
 
bdemenil said:
Isn't fiber-optic only usefull for digital signal?
Click to expand...

That is correct.

I remember seeing a 48 channel optical snake once, with the accompanying 48 A/D converters on one end, the the 48 D/A converters on the other. I was thinking to myself, what a waste of money for live sound!!!

You will find little benefit trying to wire a studio with optical, unless everything is in a digital state already.

MMHaus, your plan looks good. midiguy732 has given some very prudent insight too that you should consider having to do with expansion.

Have fun with the soldering. I wired a 48 channels, 3 split, transformer isolated audio snake once, complete with all the fan tails for all three legs! Global ground lifts on all three legs, etc.....

That was tons of fun....:(

Ed
 
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