Question about analog tape life...

[dpholmes]

I'm considering dipping into the analog, reel to reel world. I'd like to buy a 1/2" 8-track reel to reel, likely Otari or possibly a Tascam. I have two questions about tape.

• What is the average lifetime of a new tape? If I record a track, and the rewind and record again (either on the same track or a new one), how many times can I do this before losing quality?
• Where online can you buy new tape?

Thanks for your help!
-Doug

 

[briank]

Welcome to the analog world...

I'll leave the first question for more experienced tape guys...

As for the second question, there are two companies currently manufacturing new tape: RMGI and ATR Magnetics. You can check their websites for their dealer networks, though off the top of head, I know that US Recording sells both brands. RMG has several formulations but some users have reported quality control problems particularly a few years ago when it was still new on the market (not sure if this has improved of late as I haven't tried the RMGI tapes); ATR has one formulation and is highly regarded. What tape is right for you will depend some on your tastes and how you want to calibrate your machine, and some on what machine you end up with.

 

[sweetbeats]

As to the first question, new good quality analog tape will last a long, long time...digital storage medias with the exception of solid state are no better in terms of longevity so pick your poison without regard to the longevity aspect. Tape used on a machine with a good quality transport that is properly adjusted can take literally hundreds of passes before noticeable effects are realized.

I look forward to others chiming in as well.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

I have several tapes from the 60's that are still playing as well as the day they were recorded 40+ years ago and I am sure there are tons more tapes going back to the 50's which are also in equally good shape. Keep in mind all those classic albums that got transfered to CD all came from the original tape recording or safety copies from the same era.

Also, I'd say the number of times a tape can be played or recorded on could climb into the thousands if the tape is good and the machine running it is gentle and kept clean.

Cheers!

 

[daveski]

The quality and longevity really depend on storage practices, especially temperature.

 

[jpmorris]

As to the first question, new good quality analog tape will last a long, long time...digital storage medias with the exception of solid state are no better in terms of longevity so pick your poison without regard to the longevity aspect.

Analogue tape itself is far better than most of the others, even if it goes sticky it can be recovered. Digital tape is second best, though with the current bit densities I have to wonder how stable it is long-term.
Hard disks tend to freeze up if left and again, I worry about data retention.
Optical disks may suffer from dye fading problems - it's said that the rewritable ones are actually more stable than write-once types.

Do not - ever - use flash memory for long-term storage, as the internal charge decays. With single-layer flash made with a 90nm process, data should last around 10 years. With smaller processes this number goes way down and expect the retention life to be halved or a third for multi-layer MLC memories.
Current flash memories are being made on a 35nm process and are usually MLC because it's cheaper.

It has been estimated that 20nm MLC flash will be able to hold data correctly for somewhat less than a year. People developing it are looking at weird hacks like refreshing the data regularly while the machine is powered on, but this will itself reduce the lifespan of the memory (flash has a limited number of write cycles) and if you stick the disk on a shelf it won't happen anyway.

 

[dpholmes]

This is all really interesting and helpful, thank you all for your responses. Just to make sure I'm reading this correctly and my question was clear enough, I'm specifically focused on the short term recording and re-recording of the same section of tape (and less so with long-term storage, as I believe you folks have addressed that quite nicely). So, is it safe to say that if I'm rewinding and recording 100 or so bad takes over the same section of tape (or whatever worst case scenario you can dream up), I won't have any noticeable degradation?

Thanks again!

 

[Beck]

Potentially thousands of passes for modern tape (made mid ‘70s and later)… if the machine used is well maintained. That means regularly cleaned, demagnetized, proper tape tension for the tape used, etc. The machine should be free of flat spots from wear on the heads, guides and tape lifters. And as already mentioned the tape properly stored. In practical terms this means stored in a living area… a home or studio where the temperature and relative humidity is comfortable to you. Not in a garage where the climate can go from sub-zero to Louisiana bayou hot and sticky (As it does in Illinois where I live)

The above is the ideal environment for tape. If for example the tape path on your machine has a lot of sharp edges from wear, you’re going to see it deteriorate faster. Once a tape starts losing integrity you’ll notice more dropouts and popping sounds. At that point you don’t want to put anything serious on it, but you might use it for experimentation… goofing around, etc.

If your tape machine is in less than ideal condition and tape is not handled properly you can still expect hundreds of passes before audible deterioration. Tape is pretty resilient.

Only buy new tape and avoid certain tapes from late 1970’s – 1994 because of SSS (Sticky Shed Syndrome). Not all tape brands are affected. See the Sticky Shed Help Thread near the top of the main page of the Analog Forum.

 

[dpholmes]

Thanks again, this has been incredibly helpful. My fears and worries have subsided and I'm excited to take the plunge into the Reel world. I'll be on the lookout for a Tascam 38/48/58/TRS-8 or an Otari MX5050-MKIII in the near future, so if you're selling and you're in the mid-atlantic/New England area feel free to let me know. Cheers, thanks again!