Quality Control???

J

jmz93

New member
Background:
I'm new at mixing and mastering, and I don't have much experience with hip hop.
I'm in my mid-30's, and the last time I seriously paid attention to "rap" was Public Enemy, NWA, early Ice Cube etc. the stuff that was big just before the rules on sampling changed, and that sound collage approach went away.

Anyway, fast-forward to 2011, and someone contacts me to "mix" their hip hop.

they send me low bitrate mp3's, one consisting of everything except the vocal - beat, synth pads, sound effects, everything, and already compressed to hell. We're talking -10dB RMS here, and sounding like a cassette recorded too hot.

the second mp3 contained their vocal, not time aligned to the backing track, and clearly recorded in front of their speakers. Headphone bleed is one thing and I'm used to it, but this was severe.

How common is this in the genre?

I realize part of my job is communicating with clients, diplomatically trying to help, suggesting for example to record to wav files, keep the parts separate, wear headphones when recording vocals, etc. The client chose to ignore all of this advice.

Is this level of quality really common?
I realize that many people are on tight budgets, doing this for the first time on their laptop etc. That's fine. I just want to know what to expect to receive from folks.

IN this particular case, I struggled a lot to try and get the vocal to sound like it belonged on top of that already mixed/overcompressed backing, and since the vocal drifted somehow, I was highlighting vocal phrases and moving them around, all the while hoping that what I was doing is what the client wanted.

That's another thing... I would listen to the monitor bleed on the vocal and line the part of the backing track I heard up perfectly with the copy I had, but by the chorus or the end of the first verse, the vocal would be wildly out of sync again.
Can things actually get warped like this by mp3 conversion?

I know this probably sounds critical, and I don't mean it to be. I need to know where to speak up when it comes to quality control issues. For example, this guy said things like "people keep telling me to use wav, but mp3 sounds good enough". Ok fine, but there's a limit to what I can do if given really rough tracks.
I can't undo overcompression/peak limiting, for example.

So, when should I speak up and when should I just shut up, do my best, and hope they blow up huge?

Last but not least, I need to know who to listen to for excellence in this genre. Is Dre still the man? *mutters something about those awful headphones* I'm just talking about the overall sound here, not the lyrical content.

Thanks for any opinions, constructive criticism, tips etc.

Chris
 
I was in a similar situation, although not as extreme, and I told them straight up that I couldn't work with that. I apologized to them for the inconvenience, and I gave them suggestions on how they can improve the recordings before they get them to me. Fortunately, we were able to work things out. But from what he said, "people keep telling me to use wav, but mp3 sounds good enough".. I'm not sure how much he would be willing to work with you.

Personally, I work with sample based, and original composition based Hip-Hop. In my opinion a song with layered samples is more difficult to mix. If I'm understanding this correctly, he gave you 2 files. The vocals and the music. That really limits what you can do, without having the individual wav files of everything.

What I would suggest is, cut the vocals where you need to in order to get them to sync up to the song. Give it to him and tell him some tips on how to get his music to sound better. People always look at situations like, what's in it for me? So explain to him how he can improve in order to get a better end result.

I'm ashamed to say, as a big Hip-Hop fan, that the most ignorant people I meet(in general, or when it comes to music) are the local aspiring rappers and producers. But all you can really do is try to teach them, and help them out. I consider that part of my job too. However, I wouldn't say that it's common to this genre because I know plenty of knowledgeable and talented people doing pretty well. There is a market for that grimy, underground style, but most people don't realize the difference between unpolished, and amateur, at least when it comes to their own music lol

There is an over abundance of Hip-Hop available to listen to for reference. The problem is the genre is so diverse, and it really depends on what that person is going for. You mentioned synth pads, so I'm assuming a more glossy sound is what the guy wants, and no offence to your skills whatsoever, but I don't think you'll be able to deliver, based on what you've said about what you were given to work with.

I hope this helps and good luck dude.
 
Thanks. I appreciate your thoughts on this. I actually haven't heard from him either way, pro or con ... so i'm going to just consider it a "teachable moment". :) I'm glad my original post didn't come off as me sounding like a jerk - I just care about how things are when they leave my hands/DAW. :)
 
I say shut up and take their money they're figure it out eventually.

You aren't a thug, you're just poor, how can you rap about how ghetto you are in one verse and then about how you drop thousands of dollars every weekend at the club on gorgeous women the next?
 
You need to tell them what your standards are and they need to know that you can't polish shit and make it shiny. If they're sending you MP3's they don't know what they're doing and need to be educated. You can tell them in a polite way, 'If you want the best out of this you need to make sure you send me wavs etc....'
 
Dude u cant do anything with that crap...just let em know....even trying will just tarnish your name by them telling all their friends they got a track "mixed and mastered" then paying some bullshit that sounds like it was recorded using a home karaoke machine !!!
 
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