Putting compression on the finished mix

  • Thread starter Thread starter JonPaulP
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I can't listen to your track right now, but I can tell you the 'louder is better' attitude about compression and limiting on the whole mix is going to kill the dynamics of your music and leave you with a lot of distortion. Using it sparingly will bring up your percieved volume, but that's not always a good thing either. Believe it or not, at louder volumes, the ear fatigue will actually make the listener turn it off rather than listen to the whole thing. You would be better off just making a good song, tracking it correctly, and mixing it without the artificial loudness.
 
Yes Jon P, even the most dynamic mixes will have at least some compression added to the final mix. I normally always mix to a compressor inserted across the master. As Rokket says though, a compressor across the final mix isn't really about trying to get the mix loud, although it helps...it's more about evening the track out. Making the soft bits louder and the loud bits softer. One of the main uses for this I find is when playing my music in my car. Without compression, I have to turn up and then turn it down again as I drive which is never a good thing.

Anyway...enough of that as I'm sure people of fed up of this debate. I think you have the compression about right on your song Jon P though I'd consider dropping the db down abit on the bass...it sounds a little artificial. You have a great voice though my friend...really enjoyed the song(especially compared to the Whitney version ;) )

Mart.
 
JonPaulP said:
Does anyone put compression on the finished mix? Is this typically done.

I wanted a way to make the mix louder while preventing the high points from clipping.

Here's a track I used compression on: http://soundclick.com/share?songid=7540892

Does it sound alright?

Thanks! :D
Click to expand...

'I Will Always Love You '? Very nice! It actually still has dynamics, don't hear the obvious effect or artifacts of compression' which is a treat these days but for the vocal getting pulled down on the crescendos, and again by (or against) the rhythm section towards the end. (Perhaps intentional though?)
Whether that constitutes 'too much' for the genre I'll stay out of.
 
JonPaulP said:
Does anyone put compression on the finished mix? Is this typically done.

I wanted a way to make the mix louder while preventing the high points from clipping.

Here's a track I used compression on: http://soundclick.com/share?songid=7540892

Does it sound alright?

Thanks! :D
Click to expand...

Never during mixdown, and never afterwards if you're sending your work to a mastering engineer. Well, never say never, but probably not.

If you're not sending it off to be mastered, then yes, in a pinch compression, limiting, and normalization will get your track up to the level of a mastered CD. There's a lot more to mastering than this, but (and mastering guys, please don't hurt me! :p) this will at least get the volume up closer to a mastered product.
 
Rokket said:
I can't listen to your track right now, but I can tell you the 'louder is better' attitude about compression and limiting on the whole mix is going to kill the dynamics of your music and leave you with a lot of distortion. Using it sparingly will bring up your percieved volume, but that's not always a good thing either. Believe it or not, at louder volumes, the ear fatigue will actually make the listener turn it off rather than listen to the whole thing. You would be better off just making a good song, tracking it correctly, and mixing it without the artificial loudness.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input Rokket!! :D I was thinking about the dynamics too, that's why I was a little unsure if compression was something typically used for this sort of thing

Mart[1001] said:
Yes Jon P, even the most dynamic mixes will have at least some compression added to the final mix. I normally always mix to a compressor inserted across the master. As Rokket says though, a compressor across the final mix isn't really about trying to get the mix loud, although it helps...it's more about evening the track out. Making the soft bits louder and the loud bits softer. One of the main uses for this I find is when playing my music in my car. Without compression, I have to turn up and then turn it down again as I drive which is never a good thing.

Anyway...enough of that as I'm sure people of fed up of this debate. I think you have the compression about right on your song Jon P though I'd consider dropping the db down abit on the bass...it sounds a little artificial. You have a great voice though my friend...really enjoyed the song(especially compared to the Whitney version ;) )

Mart.
Click to expand...

Thanks Mart! Great to hear that you think the compression sounds about right and thanks a lot for the song comments! :D I lowered the bass in the current version. I hope it's a little better now.

SouthSIDE Glen said:
If you have to ask, you've got the wrong hobby. ;)

A far better question is whether it sounds OK to you.

G.
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Hey, I'm still new at this! :D

mixsit said:
'I Will Always Love You '? Very nice! It actually still has dynamics, don't hear the obvious effect or artifacts of compression' which is a treat these days but for the vocal getting pulled down on the crescendos, and again by (or against) the rhythm section towards the end. (Perhaps intentional though?)
Whether that constitutes 'too much' for the genre I'll stay out of.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot mixsit!! :D Great to hear that you think the dynamics have been retained and glad you like the song. I didn't notice the vocals getting pulled down, so it's not intentional, haha. Which part is it?

DrewPeterson7 said:
Never during mixdown, and never afterwards if you're sending your work to a mastering engineer. Well, never say never, but probably not.

If you're not sending it off to be mastered, then yes, in a pinch compression, limiting, and normalization will get your track up to the level of a mastered CD. There's a lot more to mastering than this, but (and mastering guys, please don't hurt me! :p) this will at least get the volume up closer to a mastered product.
Click to expand...

I don't plan on sending it off to be mastered just yet, so I guess this will have to do for now. :D
 
JonPaulP said:
Thanks a lot mixsit!! :D Great to hear that you think the dynamics have been retained and glad you like the song. I didn't notice the vocals getting pulled down, so it's not intentional, haha. Which part is it?..
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Second listen tonight. By about 2:20 on out the vocal seems recessed relative to the backing. But more interesting is 50-55 (and possibly 35-38), it seems the backing (low end?) may be modulating the vocal- That could also be that is simply your inflections. But if it is compression -on the two symptoms put together, I think I just did a flip flop. :)
 
mixsit said:
Second listen tonight. By about 2:20 on out the vocal seems recessed relative to the backing. But more interesting is 50-55 (and possibly 35-38), it seems the backing (low end?) may be modulating the vocal- That could also be that is simply your inflections. But if it is compression -on the two symptoms put together, I think I just did a flip flop. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for taking a second listen mixsit! I listened to 35-38 and 50-55, and I think that's just my vocal vibrato.

Compression can actually modulate the vocal? That's cool, how does it work? :) Does compression create a certain sound as I've heard people saying how adding too much makes it evident that there's compression (I'm such a newbie, haha).

Thanks again!
 
JonPaulP said:
Does anyone put compression on the finished mix?
Click to expand...

Lately...I've been experimenting with a MBC on my final bus, and using it almost like an EQ to make my final mix...for lack of a better term...pop.

Just as an aside...for all of my mixes...I add a stereo bus in my DAW, and have all tracks/buses output there...I then output this final bus to the master. So any final tweaking, as in the case of the use of an MBC, is done here.

Is this typically done.
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On my tracks it is. :)
 
JonPaulP said:
..Compression can actually modulate the vocal? That's cool, how does it work?
Click to expand...
This would essentially be a form of 'ducking'- one signal overriding another. Typically ducking would be one signal fed to the side chain input (the compressor's trigger/detector input), to cause the second compressed signal to reduce when the other signal is present.
The other way to get there is on mixed material where you have a vocal for example going along not triggering much reduction and then one or more instruments are rather ‘hot in the mix come along and cause more reduction. Everything gets pulled down together, but now the vocal is reduced from its previous ‘normal level.
What I am hearing seems to conincide with the whole or half note down beats on the backing tracks. -quarter second duration 'ducks, quite a bit slower than vibrato. :)
 
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BenignVanilla said:
Lately...I've been experimenting with a MBC on my final bus, and using it almost like an EQ to make my final mix...for lack of a better term...pop.

Just as an aside...for all of my mixes...I add a stereo bus in my DAW, and have all tracks/buses output there...I then output this final bus to the master. So any final tweaking, as in the case of the use of an MBC, is done here.


On my tracks it is. :)
Click to expand...

What's an "MBC"?

mixsit said:
This would essentially be a form of 'ducking'- one signal overriding another. Typically ducking would be one signal fed to the side chain input (the compressor's trigger/detector input), to cause the second compressed signal to reduce when the other signal is present.
The other way to get there is on mixed material where you have a vocal for example going along not triggering much reduction and then one or more instruments are rather ‘hot in the mix come along and cause more reduction. Everything gets pulled down together, but now the vocal is reduced from its previous ‘normal level.
Click to expand...

Oh, I see. Thanks for the explanation!
 
The beauty of an MBC is that you can compress with a more focused approach, so if your drummer is pounding the kick at one point, but the vocals are not screaming, you can compress the frequency range of the kick and not affect the vocals. Over simplified description, but I think it gets the point across.
 
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