Properly multitrack recording for drums?

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jhxkcd

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hello all,

I'm wondering how one might go about properly recording/multitracking drums? As of now, I've got a Tascam US-1800 audio interface with 8 xlr mic inputs.

Now, I'm confused as to where mixer's come into play here, and I know there's a ton to consider like the number of channels, mic inputs, line inputs, preamps, etc... so I'm slightly overwhelmed. I'm not sure if my audio interface is enough for REAL quality recording, or if I should purchase a mixer as well, if solely just to use for mic preamps.

Can anyone help me figure out whether or not a mixer could be beneficial AT ALL in recording drums properly, and if so what to look for in said mixer?

What are the advantages of using a mixer in tandem with an audio interface, how drastically does a quality mixer improve final sound quality, and for my purposes:


  • record mic'd guitar/bass/synth amp and vox
  • record a mic'd drum set (4-6 mics simultaneously)
  • possibly connect to an analog compressor (dbx 165a)

what model/brand might be a good fit?

side question, what's the best way to use an analog compressor in all of this?

I'll be using ableton, FYI. I'm budgeted around $1000 USD or so.

Sorry to overwhelm with questions!
 
Your interface is more than capable.
Putting a mixer in front of it is not really going to be beneficial.

If you plan to use a mixer to mix to stereo live, then you really limit your options later on.
If you're planning to use it for discreet channels, you've only got 4 line inputs available on the tascam.

If you needed 12 mic preamps then sure, a small mixer would be a great add on, but as it stands I wouldn't bother.

For analog compression you can always route stuff out of your daw and into a compressor after recording is done, and take the compressor output back in to a new stereo track in your daw.
The same way you'd re-amp a dry guitar track.

Maybe you don't need the compressor at all?
I don't imagine it has anything to offer that you can't do in the box.

jhxkcd said:
how drastically does a quality mixer improve final sound quality, and for my purposes:
Click to expand...
It's not a given that a mixer will improve sound quality.
If the mixer has better preamps than the tascam and direct outs per channel, then there's an argument for it, but if that was the goal I'd just be shopping for some standalone preamps.
If you're tracking discreetly to digital, I guess there won't be much analog 'mixing' going on; You're more just using a mixer as preamps.

Hope that's useful.
 
Your best bet, like Steen explained, is to forget the mixer. Plug straight into your interface, it's a very adequate interface.

And, just for the sake of argument, even if you had the best mixer in the world, going through a bad sounding interface (which the US-1800 is NOT) would defeat the purpose and still sound bad.

Your drum recording sound quality will depend WAAAAYYYYY more on your actual drum sound, your mic placement and your playing than it will on the interface.
 
RAMI said:
Your best bet, like Steen explained, is to forget the mixer. Plug straight into your interface, it's a very adequate interface.

And, just for the sake of argument, even if you had the best mixer in the world, going through a bad sounding interface (which the US-1800 is NOT) would defeat the purpose and still sound bad.

Your drum recording sound quality will depend WAAAAYYYYY more on your actual drum sound, your mic placement and your playing than it will on the interface.
Click to expand...

thanks RAMI, over the last few hours I've largely come to the same conclusion. I can tweak mic placement no worries, and I'll be getting new heads etc...

I'm also thinking about getting some diffusers and bass traps. Any mic recommendations?
 
Welcome!

I'm in a similar situation but I think I may be a week or two ahead of you on this one. I was lookin at the Tascam US-1800 for recording my drumset. I ended up with the Presonus, but that's neither here nor there.

In my snooping around I found a couple of ways to mic your kit. The one that I'm going to start with is a 4 mic setup, that I've heard refered to as the Glynn Johns method. What you do is: 1 for the kick, 1 for the snare, and 2 for stereo overheads. The kick and snare mics are pretty self explanitory but the overheads are what get the most interesting to me at this point.

The position and angle of the mics makes a huge difference in what they will pick up. For example if the mics are positioned towards the outside of the kit and angled in towards the center of the kit like \ / they will have a tendancy to pick up more of the kick and snare than if you bring the mics closer together above the drummers head and then angle them outwards like / \.

This is because a mic will pick up whatever is in front of it, so even if it's aiming at the hi-hats but the snare happens to be in line with the hats, you will get a strong amount of snare. If the mic is angled to point away from the inside of the kit to the outside of the kit, you will get better rejection of the stuff you don't want. It will all bleed, but by positioning you will be able to affect just how much bleed you're getting.

Interesting stuff. For me this is all textbook knowledge and not practical experience as much, as I just picked up me Presonus 1818vsl 2 days ago. This weekend however, is going to be "Drum Weekend" where I piss off my neighbors as I try and figure out the basics of drum mic'ing. After I've done the 4 mic thing a couple of times, I'll start bringing in tom mics and a hi-hat, or room mic. Gotta crawl before you can run.

Like with anything else, just keep experimenting. That's what I'm planning on doing for the next couple of years. :thumbs up:
 
Good stuff, I'll try that config out and work from there. Let me know if you find anything ridiculous (tried to PM, but I don't know if it sent properly or not).

Looking for a really snappy snare if you stumble onto that, something like:

www dot youtube dot com/watch?v=scnZ5JcJDUo

www dot youtube dot com/watch?v=b6eTP7W1CM8

send me a PM if you see this!
 
If you book him he will come:
Oh wait, maybe Jim said that about other people? IDK.
 
jimmys69 from Denver? I'll hit him up if I run into issues. Though I think my PM's are fucked.
 
I would be Jimmy. Howdy! :)

I use the US1800 plus a bunch of other preamps to run the other channels, including 15/16. No use for a mixer here. The Tascam's preamps are quite clean and have 60dB of gain.

I can tell you exactly what I use if you like. There are samples of stuff done with the interface, on my webby in my sig.


Welcome to the forum!
 
haha hey! it's incredible you showed up, I would be stupid to think my first foray into recording will go without flaw... I am going to try to experiment a bit with microphone choices... as of right now I will want to run an analog compressor through the tascam to do some post-recording compression, etc... not really sure how/what i need?

Steenamaroo said:
Why so? I got your PMs and replied.
Click to expand...

yeah you did, I'm dumb.
 
Not sure about how to set up in Ableton, but you just need to create an output bus, using outputs 3 or 4 on the 1800 (both for stereo). Run that to the compressor, then back into a line in (or two for L/R) on the Tascam.
 
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