Preamps. What mic preamps are you using? Discuss them.

Scott Baxendale

Scott Baxendale

Active member
IMG_2172.jpegIMG_2173.jpegI’m a sucker for API gear, especially their mic preamps. I lived in the tascam world for years but when I first got a API 3124 rack unit I never looked back.
I have some other pres, such as a LA610 MK2, Tab Funkenwerks V78, and some vintage RCA pres, but I always come back to the API’s
 
I love the gear, so many preamps tasted and bought and sold... I always wanted a ISA 430 mk1 (with in and out transformer) and got one when it was $650 or something on CL.
But for my ears and channel strips I liked the old joemeek stuff,ted fletcher, it not only is able to make sounds and 60'svibe, its often found really cheap when someones
just unloading or doesnt use it. My guess is when someone goes ITB, the gear gets sold/dumped. Ive done that anyway...ITB!!! everything goes! oh? now I want a couple good pieces back...repeat. lol

A favorite swiss knife pre is the ISA One which can be a super deal on a given day at low prices. They seemed to become super popular with the rise of the SM7abdbxz...
but then Cloudlifters seemed to do it cheaper and then now the SM7db has its own Clouddesigned boost, gain machine.

At times I think of having my dream preamp built, DIY or pay someone ...it would be transformer in/out, probably discreet, ..it might wind up similar to a WARM ToneBeast though. Never owned one of those yet.

I see the LA610 in your rack, I went through several of those, revisiting, even had the rare 500qty made special! one...the old vs MkII....it was ok, I expected too much of it, as if it would alone make my mic sound like Sun Studios... it didnt. I wasnt over blown with the build, reading the decals rub off, and I had some crackling knobs.

For my small usage HR experience seems transformer stuff just lasts and is hassle free. My ISA430 EQ is gorgeous, the preamp is fine, the comp is kind of colorless blah..but it has a gate which is nice in my noisy room...it has a digital card I have zero interest in whats the point of analog outboard if we convert it 65 times?
Really the EQ is the stuff on this one.
 
Maybe I’m the Luddite of the bunch, but I’m totally happy with my stock focusrite pro 40 preamps and my Tascam m520 preamps. No reason for me to get anything else.
It’s not like I’m gonna do a Grammy nominated album in this lifetime:D

So the rest of you go spend your money on expensive toys chasing that ‘superior’ sound . Me I’m doing just fine. :D
 
RFR said:
Maybe I’m the Luddite of the bunch, but I’m totally happy with my stock focusrite pro 40 preamps and my Tascam m520 preamps. No reason for me to get anything else.
It’s not like I’m gonna do a Grammy nominated album in this lifetime:D

So the rest of you go spend your money on expensive toys chasing that ‘superior’ sound . Me I’m doing just fine. :D
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I lived in the tascam world of +10 & cheap preamps for years and the day I inserted a API 3124 in my rack I could instantly hear the difference and could never go back to consumer level gear. This type of gear holds it value so in ten years it’ll still be worth close to what I paid. I think in the long run I spend less money trying to chase sounds, other than my gear hoarding disease…..lol.
 
Scott Baxendale said:
I lived in the tascam world of +10 & cheap preamps for years and the day I inserted a API 3124 in my rack I could instantly hear the difference and could never go back to consumer level gear. This type of gear holds it value so in ten years it’ll still be worth close to what I paid. I think in the long run I spend less money trying to chase sounds, other than my gear hoarding disease…..lol.
Click to expand...
Good for you. (zero sarcasm on my part)

But as my daddy told me a long time ago….. that’s why they have different ice cream flavors. So you get what you want. :D
I’m happy with what I’ve got. You’re happy with what you’ve got….. good, we’re all happy.
 
I think its more a gearlust thing too, having some ice cream analogy is true, what is it a person likes about one over the other , if the sound is not noticeably different or its subtle or can be tweaked with a plugin or its the money ROI?

That M2600 is a beauty, why would you need anything else! Its full channel strip x24. That would be a fast tracking machine, plug in and go, no mouse required.
The API setup is a lot of power in preamp there.. you pay for quality parts and name brands keep the investment solid it seems, API probably sounds and works amazing.

Just using the interface preamps began the ITB.... I was too young for the Reel to Reel days, but did the HR cassettes, MD, DAT, ADAT and eventually DAW, Interface.
When Todd Rundgren 2008 did a solo, entire album with Apple sys, one mic 87, Line6UX8 interface and plugins called ARENA and it was interface preamps from a dude producer musician and wizard writer...whose worked in all the studios going back to 60's...long list of bands he produced...wow...
His ARENA album showed how a pro can make an album with interface only (but for me it didn't sound nearly as good as his famous albums Something Anything etc..)
For me that was a turning point and confirmation solo, album with plugins, mix and mastered by a very seasoned pro would do. (he used the Line6UX8 only because his ProTool unit was broken...Line6 dropped out of the interface pro-competition and well we know where Pro Tools went...)

I still find the interface preamps weak, needing max gain at times, so anything seems a bit better and easier, using a booster, Cloudlifter to DMP3 to ISA or all the others going into Line In. But as someone posted, if you're adding a preamp might as well get a channel strip and have some tone/color/compression /gate available.
Channel strips was for the HR head who couldn't afford or need a SSL 40000 console or Neve console...really cool invention imo, channel strips.

How many here are recording bands and clients? I'm curious if ITB works for that or is it easier having a outboard console to the Interface Line In?
For a solo scratch demo tracking having one or two preamps outboard is plenty ...
 
I have had great results with the preamps in my two Steinberg UR824's. I do use a Vintech Audio X73i as my sweet channel for basically everything that gets tracked after drums. And use it on snare when recording a whole kit.

I also have used a Behri ADA8000 to get to 24 tracks if needed while tracking for talkback mics. That only happened once and didn't care about the quality of sound for that.
 
CoolCat said:
How many here are recording bands and clients? I'm curious if ITB works for that or is it easier having a outboard console to the Interface Line In?
For a solo scratch demo tracking having one or two preamps outboard is plenty ...
Click to expand...
That is mostly all I do in my studio is record other peoples broken dreams. LOL! I kid...

I often play drums, bass or triangle when needed. Have been rehearsing with my band members from my 90's rock band. Hope to record some new stuff and some things that were never recorded correctly. Kinda tough though when your singer was murdered. May change the band name cuz it will never be the same... The magic that we had as a band 38 years ago is still there so exited to play out again. Blah blah blah...
 
CoolCat said:
I think its more a gearlust thing too, having some ice cream analogy is true, what is it a person likes about one over the other , if the sound is not noticeably different or its subtle or can be tweaked with a plugin or its the money ROI?

That M2600 is a beauty, why would you need anything else! Its full channel strip x24. That would be a fast tracking machine, plug in and go, no mouse required.
The API setup is a lot of power in preamp there.. you pay for quality parts and name brands keep the investment solid it seems, API probably sounds and works amazing.

Just using the interface preamps began the ITB.... I was too young for the Reel to Reel days, but did the HR cassettes, MD, DAT, ADAT and eventually DAW, Interface.
When Todd Rundgren 2008 did a solo, entire album with Apple sys, one mic 87, Line6UX8 interface and plugins called ARENA and it was interface preamps from a dude producer musician and wizard writer...whose worked in all the studios going back to 60's...long list of bands he produced...wow...
His ARENA album showed how a pro can make an album with interface only (but for me it didn't sound nearly as good as his famous albums Something Anything etc..)
For me that was a turning point and confirmation solo, album with plugins, mix and mastered by a very seasoned pro would do. (he used the Line6UX8 only because his ProTool unit was broken...Line6 dropped out of the interface pro-competition and well we know where Pro Tools went...)

I still find the interface preamps weak, needing max gain at times, so anything seems a bit better and easier, using a booster, Cloudlifter to DMP3 to ISA or all the others going into Line In. But as someone posted, if you're adding a preamp might as well get a channel strip and have some tone/color/compression /gate available.
Channel strips was for the HR head who couldn't afford or need a SSL 40000 console or Neve console...really cool invention imo, channel strips.

How many here are recording bands and clients? I'm curious if ITB works for that or is it easier having a outboard console to the Interface Line In?
For a solo scratch demo tracking having one or two preamps outboard is plenty ...
Click to expand...
I owned a Tascam m2600 console and the first thing I did to make it sound better was to bypass the $2 preamps in the channels. At first I used some Aphex 104 preamps, and then I used some old Allen and Heath preamps before upgrading to API discreet preamps. It’s all about the headroom. With cheap board preamps there is no headroom and with the APIs there is seemingly unlimited headroom.
 
Scott Baxendale said:
I owned a Tascam m2600 console and the first thing I did to make it sound better was to bypass the $2 preamps in the channels. At first I used some Aphex 104 preamps, and then I used some old Allen and Heath preamps before upgrading to API discreet preamps. It’s all about the headroom. With cheap board preamps there is no headroom and with the APIs there is seemingly unlimited headroom.
Click to expand...
Tascam has never made a preamp I cared for. Good transient response was never part of their design.
 
I do not belong to that esoteric world above but to me "booteek" mic pres belong on the same plane as "Cryo NOS" gitamp valves, funny coloured capacitors and that huge ripoff/con, Russ Andrews "interconnects".
Thousands of words are written about it all but NEVER do we get a properly conducted before and after recorded comparison!

There are two sorts of pre amp as fa as I am concerned. Those that have very low noise and virtually undetectable distortion over a wide dynamic range* and the rest that have some form of desirable "attitude" or "mojo" AKA "distortion". I just want the former. Attitude can be added later but it can never be taken away!

*That includes a good many mid priced interfaces now.
And a word or three about "transient response"? This is a term like "damping factor" for power amplifiers that is often bandied but rarely well understood.
The 'TR' of a system is completely described by its bandwidth. If an audio channel has a response to 20kHz then its rise time is more than adequate to follow the excursions of a music signal (bats need not apply|)
A system can have a poor TR due to "ringing" but this implies a resonance and that implies a reactance of some sort. In a mechanical system such as a car suspension strut that is mass and for the best performance wheel mass is minimized to the extreme of going for inflammable but light Magnesium rims!

In electronics such 'mass storage' would be poorly placed capacitors but what pre amp designer in their right mind is going to include a resonant CR circuit? They are even more unlikely to chuck lumps of inductance in there!

You CAN investigate the transient performance of an electronic device with square waves but great care is needed in the execution of the test and experience in interpreting the results.

"Ocam's razor is in play here...if two pre amps on the same source sound different from each other, one or both are faulty!


Dave.
 
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ecc83 said:
I do not belong to that esoteric world above but to me "booteek" mic pres belong on the same plane as "Cryo NOS" gitamp valves, funny coloured capacitors and that huge ripoff/con, Russ Andrews "interconnects".
Thousands of words are written about it all but NEVER do we get a properly conducted before and after recorded comparison!

There are two sorts of pre amp as fa as I am concerned. Those that have very low noise and virtually undetectable distortion over a wide dynamic range* and the rest that have some form of desirable "attitude" or "mojo" AKA "distortion". I just want the former. Attitude can be added later but it can never be taken away!

*That includes a good many mid priced interfaces now.
And a word or three about "transient response"? This is a term like "damping factor" for power amplifiers that is often bandied but rarely well understood.
The 'TR' of a system is completely described by its bandwidth. If an audio channel has a response to 20kHz then its rise time is more than adequate to follow the excursions of a music signal (bats need not apply|)
A system can have a poor TR due to "ringing" but this implies a resonance and that implies a reactance of some sort. In a mechanical system such as a car suspension strut that is mass and for the best performance wheel mass is minimized to the extreme of going for inflammable but light Magnesium rims!

In electronics such 'mass storage' would be poorly placed capacitors but what pre amp designer in their right mind is going to include a resonant CR circuit? They are even more unlikely to chuck lumps of inductance in there!

You CAN investigate the transient performance of an electronic device with square waves but great care is needed in the execution of the test and experience in interpreting the results.

"Ocam's razor is in play here...if two pre amps on the same source sound different from each other, one or both are faulty!


Dave.
Click to expand...
Preamps are like mics and like guitars and each different one has its own thing. Just like a Strat vs a Les Paul they both do the same thing but they are different as well. My thing was that when I made the jump from ‘consumer’ gear to professional gear it changed everything about how I approach recording and how my recordings sound.

In my case neither would be faulty.
 
Scott Baxendale said:
Preamps are like mics and like guitars and each different one has its own thing. Just like a Strat vs a Les Paul they both do the same thing but they are different as well. My thing was that when I made the jump from ‘consumer’ gear to professional gear it changed everything about how I approach recording and how my recordings sound.

In my case neither would be faulty.
Click to expand...
Show me.

Dave.
 
Scott, I hate say this, but the second two have so much distortion that I don't know if I'm listening to the preamps or what/how you were recording. Vocals sound distorted, guitars are heavily distorted, drums sound distorted. This is exactly the sound that I DON'T want in my recordings.

Of the three recordings, the 2nd one is probably my favorite, simply because it is the most natural sounding.

This is an example of what I try to get, especially with acoustic guitar/vocal stuff. It was all done with a Tascam 16x08, a Rode NT1 for vocals and M5s for the guitar. Guitar was my Taylor 310ce and I did all the vocals. Recording and mixing in Reaper.

View attachment Find The Cost Of Freedom final Mix B.mp3
 
Hopefully my new Cranbourne Audio Camden 500 Mic Pre shows up in the mail today... I should check that tracking # to make sure. :)
 
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