Popping between punches

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sasmfb

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I do 4 track stereo recordings (Home Audio 9) which I mix down into part-predominant recordings for singers to use to learn songs.
Because note and word and interpretation accuracy is so important I go back and fix lots of things on each track using the punch out feature. Even though I try to avoid starting the clip in the middle of a hard consonant or something like that, I still end up with a few very loud pops or clicks at the transition between original clips and the punch outs. I've been using the 3 decibel adjustment feature to try and level the volume of the clips and that helps a little. They also get less noticeable as I mix the tracks down; however, they are still noticeable on the completed track.

Any suggestions as to how to get rid of these pops? How about suggestions on leveling the volume for the whole track without going up or down a few decibels for each clip or punch out that is too loud or too soft?
 
Not sure that I fully understand what you are doing. Are you punching in new material over older material from an entirely different source?

To start, it is nearly impossible to get a clean punch-in punch-out unless you locate them in silent sections (e.g., when the singer takes a breath, or where there is nothing being sung). Otherwise it is fairly normal that the "punch" will be audible. It helps if you punch at a zero crossing - but the only real solution is to punch into silence.

Secondly, it the problem is simply different volume levels due to the fact that the sources are different, you need to adjust your recording levels somewhat.

Lastly, even when you have the same singer punching in on the same mic with the same settings, you can have some volume issues resulting form how close he stands to the mic, or how loud he sings the part. These, however, can normally be handled with clip volume envelopes. Put a clip envelope on the newly punched in part, and adjust the volumes as needed. Placing the nodes in the right place you can even make adjustments specific to certain syllables.

Did I understand the problem correctly? If not, please elaborate.(BTW, I've never worked on Home Audio, but I assume it has envelope features like Pro Audio.)
 
Remove the POPPING spot by highlighting just that tiny area, and just by a hair on each side of the pop....... clear that area out...

Now you should have a tiny, tiny spot of silence, except each edge of that silence might pop, so throw in a cross fade, that overlaps that silent spot by about 5 hairs on each side........


(Sorry for the untechnical terms, but im trying to make this easy to follow in case your a beginner...)

Joe
 
To dachay2tnr, I guess you could say that I'm punching in new material over old material but from the same source. You are correct that punching into silence works best. I was hoping for some way to compensate for having to punch sound into sound.
The same singer, different volume, different distance from the mic problem is the biggest thing I deal with. We've just tried to learn to be consistant where we stand and how we sing. Not always an easy thing to do.

To VOXVENDOR or Joe:
This is more in line with what I was hoping for but even though you've simplified your terms, I'm afraid it was still a 'fly by'. How about once again for the truly uneducated. :)
 
Ok....I'll try

You can see on your edit screen where it is popping right??

highlight an area slightly bigger than the pop that centers over the pop and clear it.. (get rid of it...)

Now your gonna have a little silent space.....

Put a crossfade in there, but make sure both sides of the cross fade, are a tad bigger.....

I will try and draw a diagram, to help you....
Check back in a bit and you will see an attachment on the bottom of my next post........:)
 
This is what I do to avoid Pops when punching; just wait for a 'similar' sound, depends on how the pop sounds like.
If you know that it's some kinda 'click', then make the pop on the right place as for example a rhythm click, or a snare drum.
If it's more a 'bass-pop' (yeah!) then make sure the pop it on the same time as a bassdrum or something.
 
sasmfb - I haven't figured out a way to punch directly into a wave, without the punch being audible. Usually with singing, I just start the punch a little earlier (or end it a little later) to get into a silent area. Generally there is enough silence with singing (you have to take a breath sometime) to give you mutiple punch points.

I do have the problem you are describing though with accoustic guitar stumming. There really aren't many "silent" parts to a track where you are stumming chords. It makes it really difficult to correct mistakes, without having to redo half the song.

Perhaps, voxvendor's crossfade technique will work. My guess, though is that the punch will still be audible. It might get rid of the click sound of the punch, but I'll bet you can still tell it's a punch in. Just doesn't sound natural.

As for the issues with distance from mic, etc. - I've found you can handle them with the volume envelopes I described above. What's more bothersome, though, is when the singer has a different timbre to his voice each time you record him. There ain't much you can do with that, except hope you're the only one who notices it.
 
dachay2tnr writes:

"What's more bothersome, though, is when the singer has a different timbre to his voice each time you record him. There ain't much you can do with that, except hope you're the only one who notices it."

Exactly! I can do allot by adjusting the volume from clip to clip even though it's time consuming but when it sounds as if two totally different people were singing from clip to clip, there is very little that can be done.

Does anyone happen to know if Home Studio 9 has the same envelope features as Pro Audio?
 
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