Please Help me!!!

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kca419

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I just got a tascam 424 mkIII for christmas and I need some advice. I play guitar, bass and drums but my main focus is on guitar. I also have friends who play, one is a drummer, and one plays bass. We get together and jam alot and just kick stuff out. I would like to be able to record our little group using only a couple of mics in the room to capture the overall mix. What kinda mic's would be good for this (i have a limited budget) and what kinda mic'ing techniques should I use. I was thinking about a couple of SM57's but you guys would know best. Would a condenser mic be more suited to this situation? I am by no means striving for a polished recording, I like a raw sound. To give you an idea here are some of my favorite bands, Melvins, Kyuss, the Stooges, QOTSA, and of course Nirvana. I have a Sonor drum kit, and my main guitar amp is a peavey classic 50 4x10, the bass player has a mid sized combo amp. Any advice is appreciated.
Thanks....
 
There are a bunch of different ways to do it. Without a separate mixer and a slew of mics, I'd recommend getting 4 decent dynamics - SM57's would be great. Drop one in the center of the room, one on the kick, one on the PA, and do a take to see what else needs it's own track (probably guitar, unless your bass-player is real quiet).

Another option, if your room sounds decent, is to drop 2 mics for a more stereo sound. Drop the other 2 where needed (probably kick for one).

A buddy of mine has the same recorder and records his blues gigs with it - actually sounds pretty good.
 
I uzed to do this. i would go w/57's, i would put one behing the drums ,one on the guitar amp , and get a direct box for the bass. i am sure you can get 2 57's and di for about $200.
 
I would recomend using condenser mics- I recently bought a pair of Oktava mics (brand new $200 for both) and its the best $200 ive ever spent on recording equipment. If you have more than 2, put one near (not directly on) each instrument so as to have some control on mix down- for vocals either skip the PA and wire your vocal mic directly into the recorder or maybe thru the PA at a low volume (so you dont get alot in the other mics) and run patch from the PA to the recorder. Dabble and have fun - but definatly condesors for room micing.
 
if you go that route, just make sure they're not LD condensers - I don't think they'd be able to handle the SPL's of a full band in a small room.
 
Well first of all, your unit won't provide phantom power so most condensor mics are out of the question unless you use a condensor that will run on batteries or get an external mic preamp that will provide phantom power or a phantom power inserter. 57's would be my choice but that's just my opinion.
Seanmorse my friend, no slam but depending on the mic, LDCs can take enormous amounts of SPL. I routinely use LDCs out in front of kick drums and bass amp cabinets.
 
Track Rat- Didnt think abou the phantom power- so i would agree with the 57- do you have any opinion or alternative to handling vocals in a live mix such as our case at hand? Whenever I want something real quick I record all the instuments together and overdub the vocals seperatly. I've had problems with vocals sounding distant in a live mix (the metal lunch box effect)
 
If you get a pair of those oktavas, getting the omni capsules for them might be a good idea. They'll be great cheap room mics.
edit: you can get one of those phantom power units for not too much on ebay to power two of the oktavas.
 
TrackRat, I stand corrected. I've had some erratic results with Oktava 219s and 319s (both the GC variety) with micing loud instruments. I'm definitely not a mic expert, that comment was just from personal experience, realizing now that it may have been caused from something else.
 
In all fairness, I've had the exact same experience with the 319. It's one of my favorite vocal mics but it sucked on guitar cabs for me. It was OK on over heads but didn't like it out in front of a kit.
 
kremitmusic, where do you track your vocals at? If you're in a very reverberant room like a concrete basement, it's hard to get the room out ofthe mic. Try hanging some blankets or carpet on the walls. This is a low bucks approach to treating your recording space. To do it right takes a little more thought and money. It depends on how far you want to take it. Get your self a foam pop filter that will fit which ever dynamic mic you go with and put it on the mic when you do vocals and stay close on the mic. working close to the mic, you can back the preamp gain a bit and with some acoustic treatment will tighten the vocal sound up. Be careful of P's and S's working close to the mic. The next level up would be to add a compressor. This will go a long way towards helping to level out a vocal allowing it to "set"in the mix. A decent compressor can be had for a little over $100.
 
I can achieve really good results from the set i have- recording to computer throught delta sound card (very simple- only two tracks at a time). I've got a rack full of stuff- 2 channel compressor, lexicon digital effects, Dual Channel Art TPS tube preamp, dual 31 band EQ, and a little Berhinger mixer that does the trick- this is all fine for multitrack recording- our room is spot treated with carpet- temporary- my new studio is almost finished in a house im remodeling- BUT for a live set up recording everything at once in the same room- vocal seem to be the only tricky part- I have no problem at all overdubbing the vocals they sound fine.. in short if I want quick results I'll set up the band- sans the singer and record everything with room mics then overdub the singer later- if im looking for more polished I'll do each instrument individually on its of track(s) for max control of the finished product. So back the orginal topic of this fellas 4 track tape, I'm pointing out a potential problem he may have (its the biggest problem Ive had) Anyway- appreciate all of youre guys responces. Thanks
 
I hope all of our discussion is helping KCA419- we havent heard back from him since his original post
 
thanks alot guys that helps. i just got back to check the thread. I We usually dont have a singer when were playing so thats not a problem. I can track that later, but thanks for the tips. I guess i will go with sm57's i dont want to mess with condenser mics cause the tascam doesnt have phantom power and all. The recomendation for a compressor sounds like a good idea. Hopefully this will get me on the right path to recording.
 
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