Noobs and equipment

[Armistice]

Why are you guys so worried about how any of these "newbs" spend their money. What's the difference? If you don't want to be helpful and respond to their posts then don't. It won't break their hearts to see that some jerk wad didn't lecture them about how "when i was a kid i used to walk uphill, 5 miles, in the snow both ways too and from school... you kids these days and your school buses..."
Get over yourselves. These people try to find answers to their specific questions. If it's a dumb question, ignore it.

Forums are a very valuable resource. I use them to answer a lot of the questions I have. I tend to do a search first, but you know what i find more and more of? Threads that might have a chance to answer my question but fail because some blow hard starts lecturing someone and all his buddies chime in and it gets off topic OR it's off topic to begin with and instead of deleting or moving the thread the moderators leave it up for everyone to click on and see that it was in fact "off topic".

Answer the question or don't. Don't troll the playground (newb forum?) looking for kids to beat up. I'm sure you can find a better way to spend your time.

Yeah, we get that you're bitter and twisted about this forum from your other posts... so why are you still here?

The vast majority of advice handed out in the newbs forum in particular is well meant and accurate, and not delivered by blowhards and jerkwads - however being a public forum, people can come on and say whatever they want to - sometimes you just have to work out who knows what and sort through it - such is life in a forum - so don't tar the very helpful people who consistently, day in and day out, provide useful information to a variety of newbs with your sad brush...

And moderators are all unpaid people who like helping out and give generously of their time in doing so - they don't, and can't, and shouldn't vet every post - like you didn't know that.

 

[fritsthegirl]

Why are you guys so worried about how any of these "newbs" spend their money. What's the difference? If you don't want to be helpful and respond to their posts then don't. It won't break their hearts to see that some jerk wad didn't lecture them about how "when i was a kid i used to walk uphill, 5 miles, in the snow both ways too and from school... you kids these days and your school buses..."
Get over yourselves. These people try to find answers to their specific questions. If it's a dumb question, ignore it.

Forums are a very valuable resource. I use them to answer a lot of the questions I have. I tend to do a search first, but you know what i find more and more of? Threads that might have a chance to answer my question but fail because some blow hard starts lecturing someone and all his buddies chime in and it gets off topic OR it's off topic to begin with and instead of deleting or moving the thread the moderators leave it up for everyone to click on and see that it was in fact "off topic".

Answer the question or don't. Don't troll the playground (newb forum?) looking for kids to beat up. I'm sure you can find a better way to spend your time.

Yo, it was just an observation, and this thread isn't off topic so I don't know why you're bringing your problems about that in here. I'm a noob incase you did't catch that from my post.

There's nothing wrong with me and other people making an observation and having an opinion, it's a free world and it's how we learn. As a beginner I lap discussions like this up, makes me feel good to know people that have been around doing this a lot longer than I have started out humble, and got really good using the basic gear they had. I wanted to share this with other people in my position. Not everyone has £2000 to blow on a kitting out a studio at home. All I was saying is that it doesn't mean you can't have fun and get something out of it. You just need to get on it and focus on learning and making the best of what you have.

I don't like people spending money when they don't need to, or for the sake of it, no. It uses resources we're running out of & creates waste we have too much of.

I wasn't dissing noob questions at all by the way, I have had a few dumb ones too. I put up with the flack I get for my own stupidity as best I can and work with it. I might add that I haven't actually received any negative responses on this forum from any posts I have made. Ever. Until now.

I do know this, and it's got nothing to do with being experienced or a beginner. If you don't know what you're buying, don't buy it. If you've bought something you can't work, don't buy something else to make up for it. My suggestion was simply to spend more time learning and less time buying. I wouldn't buy a new guitar because I couldn't work my current one now, would I?

 

[fritsthegirl]

D'OH!

I wanted to edit my post and I somehow deleted the whole thing.

I don't even know how I managed that.


No big woop....I was just rambling.

Awww. Luckily DM60 immortalised your words so I still got to read your ramblings, which I thought were pretty bang on.

 

[fritsthegirl]

But with the volume of people who cycle through here, if there is a 1-10 that somebody listens (1-100 isn't bad), then I think it is still positive. After all, those who want it easy won't last, those who want it, will work for it. Which, regardless of what is out there, you still have to put in the work. Craft the sound, compose the material, record the sound, etc. No matter how easy they make it, it still requires work.

The consumer generation will just have to work through it. Many will, most won't.

Yeh, some newbs do read everything and take most of it in. I haven't treated my room yet, but then I only just bought my first mic, so ya know....definitely going to go for leopard skin blankets when the time comes though. Not really. Egg cartons, I mean foam...LOL.

 

[ecc83]

"I don't like people spending money when they don't need to, or for the sake of it, no. It uses resources we're running out of & creates waste we have too much of."

Those are points well made.
It is possible for example to make very, very low noise mic pre amps by various techniques such as multiple input devices and high power consumption (keeps resistor values low).

But the use of such amplifiers cannot be justified everywhere. A 48channel mixer, even of the highest quality would not use such pre amps because it would need its own 2kW AC to cool it! So, a top line studio might have 1/2 dozen or so of such pres for special duty and jack them in as needed.

GOOD engineering is about cost/energy effective use of resources.

Dave.

 

[jonny deep]

If you don't know what you're buying, don't buy it. If you've bought something you can't work, don't buy something else to make up for it.

I read some good advice like this when I was looking at plugins and wondering if I needed better, more expensive ones. The advice was basically along the lines of "if you don't know what problem the plugin is going to solve, then you probably don't need it (yet, at least)". Seems apt.

 

[c7sus]

 

[fritsthegirl]

This should be sticky.

Hey cool, is in the main window after the update.



Couldn't have asked for a more fantastic start to the weekend.

 

[JimmyS1969]

View attachment 83337

I must share this with friends.

 

[Rod Norman]

Rant answer

The answer is simple: yes. The problem can be traced back to the automobile. Of all the technology we have at our disposal, the automobile is the most simple to operate. You want to go faster? Spend more money. You want to look cooler? Spend more money. You want to outdo your neighbors? Spend more money. They are all the same. Just spend more money. Now look at designer labels and celebrity endorsements. Why do they work? If I wear the same clothes or use the same equipment, I will be as good as the endorser is. So when people who think they can do it spend more money to buy the same things the pros use, they think they will get the same results. None of them even know how to hold a microphone. I can't tell you how many times I have had to tell speakers at festivals to place the edge of the ball against their chin and speak over the mic. They all still mive it around and get feedback. Singers often are no better and many of them do not have their own microphone. So when they get all this equipment and try to hook it up, they do it wrong. They also know nothing about gain staging, clipping, audio chains or distortion. They use the wrong mic for the wrong sounds and wonder why it sucks. I no longer answer the questions that I have answered so many times before. That is simply because those questions mean they have not even looked to see if their question has already been answered. They want us to do it for them and make it work. They would be better off to have taken that money and gone into a professional studio...oh...that's right. There aren't anymore hometown studios.

Starts rant....

Is it just me, or have there been more than the usual amount of questions/problems in the last couple of weeks about buying and not being able to work expensive microphones, software, interfaces, preamps...?

I don't get how people can have so much difficulty with the stuff they buy. I purposefully stop myself from buying anything that might further complicate my already over-heated brain. I flat line when something technical doesn't work, I have to keep it REAL simple.

I learned so much using the most basic & shit gear I had at the start though. That was Audacity, an acoustic guitar and a £10 headphone mic. I soon discovered that was really bad. But in the process of recording with it, I learned why what I had would never give me the results I wanted. It wasn't the guitar, and not even the software. That came a bit later...

I reckon some noobs really over-think things before just recording with what they've got. That really gives you the best indication of what the missing pieces are.

I keep reading about starters that have bought expensive stuff they're unhappy with or don't know how to work. Worse yet, thinking about buying expensive kit they don't really understand the function of.

I wonder if it's because people think that by spending money they'll be sorted to make awesome recordings. But without a purpose, no amount of money you throw at it will really make sense. That's in my view and very limited experience anyway. I guess people just like to buy shit. Stop it I say. Get a headphone mic & record something with free software. You'll soon figure out what to plug in where and what you should be spending your moola on to make it better.

...end of rant.

Quite keen to hear what you guys started out with on your home recording journey. Think it's good for us freshies to hear that other people started out with the basics before they got into what they have now. I just think the fun of home recording is making do with what you have. It's the fact that I know people on here aren't necessarily using state of the art equipment that makes what I listen to all the more enjoyable and impressive.

 

[homestudioguy]

Keep it Simple, for now......

One of my "favorite" comments made to "Newbies" that I see here quite often is "You, FIRST, need to buy a Tractor Trailer Load Acoustic Material and install it in your Home Studio with Precision Engineering or your results will be horrific! "

Or it's "FIRST, you need this and that and the other because without it, this or that won't do this or that and then your results will be horrific! "

Of course, I exaggerate.
Somewhat.

I (as many here do) suggest that one should purchase just enough equipment to record with, learn to do basic recording functions with just a few items (voice/amps/instrument) using your recording software or hardware, learn in more detail what your software or hardware allows for or provides, expand the realm of what you record and then research, read and ask questions before you begin adding studio upgrades.

As "frits" says :"Get a headphone mic & record something with free software. You'll soon figure out what to plug in where and what you should be spending your moola on to make it better". thumbs up:

ALSO:
When you ask questions on a forum, you need to FIRST let people here know specifically what your current recording set-up is (software, hardware, mics, etc), what program material (Music, Narration, Karaoke, etc) and Style (Rock, Jazz, Orchestral, Hip-Hop, Bollywood, etc) , you plan on recording, what your goal is in regards to what you are recording and when it comes to equipment? PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE tell us how much money you REALLY plan to or can spend and perhaps give an idea of what you see yourself doing with your studio in the next year or 2.
Bob G.
PS- Am I wearing Lycra right now????

 

[c7sus]

Half a tractor-trailer load of Knauf will suffice.

 

[homestudioguy]

Half a tractor-trailer load of Knauf will suffice.

And the other half filled with a Neve Console!

 

[wannaknow]

A little over three years ago a friend and I decided to make an album strictly for our own amusement. We had jammed together and played a few charity events. We put a cheap dynamic mic in the middle of the floor going straight into Audacity and hit record. The result was so bad I was stunned. I knew we sounded much better live, so I did some research and discovered there was a lot more to recording than I had ever imagined. I decided to take a basic recording class. I'm ex- military, so I had some funding available to me. Due to circumstances beyond my control the only training I could take was a full degree course. Now at 61 years of age I have a degree with a major in Music Technology, and I'm only marginally better at recording than I was three years ago. The difference being that I can now look cool while producing inferior recordings Also I'm having sooo much fun. Thanks to this forum and the people on it I was encouraged to go forward. In the beginning I didn't own a computer and had no desire to have one. I had no idea a DAW or interface existed. I now have a modest set-up and I have a realistic view of what I'm willing to work toward achieving. I see that it's going to take a little longer to record that album than thought and I'm going to have a lot more fun doing it than I thought. Thanks again to all the good people on this forum.

 

[JimmyS1969]

A little over three years ago a friend and I decided to make an album strictly for our own amusement. We had jammed together and played a few charity events. We put a cheap dynamic mic in the middle of the floor going straight into Audacity and hit record. The result was so bad I was stunned. I knew we sounded much better live, so I did some research and discovered there was a lot more to recording than I had ever imagined. I decided to take a basic recording class. I'm ex- military, so I had some funding available to me. Due to circumstances beyond my control the only training I could take was a full degree course. Now at 61 years of age I have a degree with a major in Music Technology, and I'm only marginally better at recording than I was three years ago. The difference being that I can now look cool while producing inferior recordings Also I'm having sooo much fun. Thanks to this forum and the people on it I was encouraged to go forward. In the beginning I didn't own a computer and had no desire to have one. I had no idea a DAW or interface existed. I now have a modest set-up and I have a realistic view of what I'm willing to work toward achieving. I see that it's going to take a little longer to record that album than thought and I'm going to have a lot more fun doing it than I thought. Thanks again to all the good people on this forum.

First off, I thank you for the service you gave to your country. Much admired Sir!

There is much to be said about learning by doing. I can't even put in words how much I have learned by being a member of this community.

At least 85% of on topic advice here is correct. The other 15% is either corrected by members with more experience, or it turns into a 20 page argument over personal preference via experience. Then it comes down to the fact that no one way is correct, so maybe 50% is actually right for everyone. It is up to any member to decide what is right for themselves based upon members posts of experience/use/application of whatever...

That is the beauty of a forum like this. No one person is right always. Every individual has their own way of doing things in their own personal situation, recording environment, experience, $$ amount of gear, and desire to make recordings. Not to mention the differences in genre of music any member is working with.

Some members here share great recordings with minimal gear. Some have more money in gear than we have in our mortgages. Still, we continue to share here in the hopes of learning from each other.

There is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to do anything really. Only an opportunity to learn from others experiences or failures.

THO-and a big one-those with more experience can give a wealth of information to those that have not had the time to spend with multiple mic's/gear/situations, regardless of genre. There are many members here with 'way' more experience than I have. I still struggle to find the 'Holy Grail' myself and likely I never will....

I have learned however, the MOST important part in any recording, is the performer. Nothing can replace that. What you do to treat the room, purchase better interface, monitors, mics, mood lighting, etc, means nothing if the performance isn't there. That doesn't mean that those new to playing do not deserve to find ways to make themselves better. That is why we are all here. We try to make the best of what we have ourselves, with the support of others who may be in the same place or not...


We keep on doing what we love, and improving by learning from each other...

That is what this forum is about in my mind.

 

[BroKen_H]

I haven't been doing this all that long (meaning the number of hours, not the number of years). When I started in the 90's I was using Cakewalk with a Sound Blaster card that used "sound fonts". Anybody remember those? Actually I still use some of them!

My SB card and my piano had midi in/out and that was enough to write soundtracks for people in the church to sing along with. Over the years, I've switched to Record/Reason and added a huge amount of live to my recordings. But one of the most integral, important aspects to my learning and the sound I get now was spending more than I could afford on the best studio monitors I could afford at the time. If I could give one word of advice to all the noobs that frequent this and any other site, it would be exactly that. Blow the budget on your monitors.

A pair of SM57s and a cheap MXL condenser mic are still getting me by for mics, but it doesn't matter how good your equipment is if you can't "hear" what you've recorded.

 

[robgreen]

It's been cheap equipment all the way for me - was when I started off and nothing's much more expensive now. I dunno, maybe it shows through in the end products, but I feel like I know how to use the stuff I've got pretty well, it generally does what I want it to (eventually) and so I see no real impetus to change it. I'd rather have a bunch of cheaper equipment that I know inside out than more expensive things that I've no idea how to use.

I also think your limitations are as much a determinant of your sound as your abilities/resources. Like if you have an untreated space that's not ideal for recording, then you may tend to mic tracks closer than you otherwise would and that changes how your music sounds. Or if you've got equipment that doesn't always record a take properly, then you end up doing a lot more takes than you otherwise you would - and so you by the time you do get a good take, then that part may have evolved into something better than if you'd nailed it first time.

...or maybe I'm just self-justifying making do with what I've got...

That's why I like cycling too. You know, I often pull up to the lights next to some overweight douche bag on a titanium frame with all the expensive lycra in the world clinging to his balls. I've got my humble bike loaded up with 15kg of shopping. When the light go green I wonder what he'll do but it's obvious. He thinks he's going to be faster because he's got all the right gear. I let him think he's a hero and stay on his tail for a minute before I get bored and pass his sorry ass. I guess the moral of the story is, it's not what you wear or what you ride. It's how you ride it. LOL.

I cycled coast to coast with some friends a few years back on the cheapest, crappiest bike you could imagine. Damn thing weighed about as much as I did, which made cycling over the Pennines a complete fucking nightmare. Think the achievement felt better after it though - plenty of folks do it on awesome bikes, but to manage to hulk that crappy lump of lead from one side of the country made it even sweeter.

I bought a better bike since (one that allows me to flick up puddles in the face of noobs like you as I'm whizzing by frits ), but I feel like I've earned the right to, after doing my time on something not as good. No lycra though.