noise spikes

[andyguk]

Hey guys hope you are all well

I have a random problem while recording mixes from my CDJs and mixer. Whilst I don't hear anything untoward while mixing the set.... when it comes to listening back to it, I sometimes notice unwanted noise spikes. Upon looking at the waveform in an editor, they stand out like a sore thumb. The problem has been occuring randomly for the last 9-10 months and apart from switching from XP to Vista, nothing had changed with my setup when it first started. I have since switched back to XP to test, and the same problem is occuring. I am at my wits end as I have spent time and money these last 9-10 months trying to troubleshoot the problem. Here is what I have tried so far,

new audio wires
new shielded audio wires
new connectors
new surge protected extension socket for plugs
new soundcard (had Audigy2 ZS Platinum, now I have M-Audio Audiophile 2496)
moving soundcard to different PCI slots (it was sharing IRQ, but now has it's own)
reinstalling OS numerous times
older drivers
new drivers
updating motherboard BIOS
changing OS back to XP

I've probably missed something out, but non of the above has seemed to make a difference as I made a recording this afternoon and got a noise spike. I've uploaded it incase someone has heard them before and knows of a fix,

The only thing I haven't tried is changing my motherboard. However I've aready spent enough troublshooting and would like to see if anyone has any ideas before I shell out yet more cash in hope of a fix

My PC spec is as follows,

Dual booting XP Home SP3 (32bit) and Vista Home Premium SP1 (32bit)
AMD Athlon 64 x2 3000 MHz 6000+
MSI K9N SLI Platinum motherboard (nForce 570 SLI chipset)
3GB Crucial DDR2 (3 x 1GB sticks)
nVidia GeForce 8600 GTS 256MB graphics card
M-Audio Audiophile 2496 soundcard

My CDJ setup is,

2 x Pioneer CDJ800
1 x KAM KCM400 mixer

hopefully someone will be able to help as I have no hair left to pull out

thanks in advance
Andy

 

[NYMorningstar]

Get an extra drive and dedicate it just for audio files, no programming.

 

[andyguk]

Get an extra drive and dedicate it just for audio files, no programming.

hey thanks for the reply. I knew I'd missed something from the list of things I'd tried....

I did actually buy a 250GB SATA harddrive to dedicate to recording but this made no difference

I tried having the OS on that drive and recording to a folder, and also having the OS on a different drive while recording to the new empty drive

 

[gecko zzed]

Have you checked that you've got no other programs (maybe running in background) that are intermittently hijacking your CPU? These could be wanted applications (e.g. virus checkers) or unwanted (e.g. viruses etc.).

Have you checked your system information to see if there are any 'problem devices'?

Is your System Interrupt Controller behaving?

 

[andyguk]

Have you checked that you've got no other programs (maybe running in background) that are intermittently hijacking your CPU? These could be wanted applications (e.g. virus checkers) or unwanted (e.g. viruses etc.).

Have you checked your system information to see if there are any 'problem devices'?

Is your System Interrupt Controller behaving?

hey

yes I've tried with fresh installs of Vista and also XP Home with only the recording software intalled. I've tried with and without virus scanners running and also killed all unwanted services and programs running in the background. All drivers are uptodate (I've also tried with older drivers and fresh installs of the OS with new and old drivers etc, this includes motherboard drivers for the SI controller

The strange thing is this problem never used to be an issue about 10 months ago and back then I'd have multiple programs and services running, along with a virus scanner

I think my system is doomed. Maybe the motherboard is on it's way out but it isn't really that old (18 months maybe). I have no other problems with my system apart from this. It's great system and runs very well... until I record these days.

I've been looking at this little gadget

http://www.ikey-audio.com/ikey.htm

maybe I'd get some joy from that? It is rather expensive, however if I bought an £80 motherboard and that didn't fix the problem then I'd kick myself for spending the money. I think I'd be happier spending money on something I know is going to work. But first I must continue troubleshooting

 

[legionserial]

Have you tried increasing your buffer slightly in the ASIO settings?

 

[andyguk]

Have you tried increasing your buffer slightly in the ASIO settings?

ah this is one thing I haven't tried. I understand the basic concept of ASIO but have never wanted to mess about with the buffers or other settings in the maudio control panel.

at the moment it's on 256, so would you advise moving it up one notch? I can't remember what number it goes to when you move it up 1, 2, 3 notches etc. How high can you go with this? does a higher buffer have an adverse effect on other settings? and visa versa, does a lower setting have any adverse effects?

 

[legionserial]

A higher buffer will increase your latency, which isn't great, but usually you can find a happy balance. If you have your buffer too low, you can get pops and clicks etc. If you have it too high, you'll get too much latency. Sometimes it's worth having different buffer settings for mixing to what you have for recording. Your latency probably doesn't neccessarily need to be as low during mixing as during recording (this is circumstantial).

What sort of latency do you get at the moment? Could it stand to be raised a little to push your buffer up?

All in all I'd just say try it out. You won't break anything.

 

[andyguk]

A higher buffer will increase your latency, which isn't great, but usually you can find a happy balance. If you have your buffer too low, you can get pops and clicks etc. If you have it too high, you'll get too much latency. Sometimes it's worth having different buffer settings for mixing to what you have for recording. Your latency probably doesn't neccessarily need to be as low during mixing as during recording (this is circumstantial).

What sort of latency do you get at the moment? Could it stand to be raised a little to push your buffer up?

All in all I'd just say try it out. You won't break anything.

this sounds promising. Well I hope I don't sound dumb but how do I find out what latency I am getting at the moment?

 

[andyguk]

ok just as an update I upped the buffer from 256 to 512 and recorded the same bit of audio. No spikes but it sounded quite grainy. I guess that's a mild latency effect?

I got the ASIO4ALL drivers and installed those. They allow me to get smaller increments when increasing/decreasing buffer size. MAudio panel has only 1 step inbetween 256 and 512.

I'm now trying 320 to see how that goes. I think this may be a long process as the spikes are pretty random, sometimes they happened and other times I could record clean mix. Once I find a buffer that is higher than 256 but doesnt sound grainy I'll make multiple recordings and see if I can reproduce a spike

thanks for the help so far

 

[legionserial]

this sounds promising. Well I hope I don't sound dumb but how do I find out what latency I am getting at the moment?

I usually find it in the software I'm using. I'm not sure what software you're using. I could tell you how to find out in Cubase but I'm not sure if that would be any help.

the other thing to look at is if you're using a lot of VST's or effects or whatever. A lot at once can put abit of a strain on the CPU and it will have that effect.

 

[Bristol Posse]

Could even be the nForce chipset on the MOBO. They are well known to be poorly executed for audio as they are geared toward Gamers who want to SLI graphics cards for high performace gaming (some audio manufactureres specifically state that their gear may not perform properly with Nvidea chipsets)

Try turning off any hardware accelaration yo have (graphics etc) they may be a cause.

If the spikes are showing up on the waveform it means they are being recorded as a part of the session, it could even be a short or something within your recording chain or computer/soundcard itself

 

[andyguk]

I usually find it in the software I'm using. I'm not sure what software you're using. I could tell you how to find out in Cubase but I'm not sure if that would be any help.

the other thing to look at is if you're using a lot of VST's or effects or whatever. A lot at once can put abit of a strain on the CPU and it will have that effect.

I'm using soundforge here to record while I'm stood in another room mixing on my CDJs, so there's no VST or effects coming into play.

I think I see the latency now as I change the buffer with ASIO4ALL the number 'ms' changes also. So with 256 it was 5ms and with 320 now it's 7ms. 512 was 11ms

thanks for help guys, I'm learning

 

[andyguk]

Could even be the nForce chipset on the MOBO. They are well known to be poorly executed for audio as they are geared toward Gamers who want to SLI graphics cards for high performace gaming (some audio manufactureres specifically state that their gear may not perform properly with Nvidea chipsets)

Try turning off any hardware accelaration yo have (graphics etc) they may be a cause.

If the spikes are showing up on the waveform it means they are being recorded as a part of the session, it could even be a short or something within your recording chain or computer/soundcard itself

hmmm interesting. I shall read up on these nforce chipsets. And I'll try the hardware acceleration etc. Come to think of it, I may have bought my graphics card around the time this all started....... anybody heard of nvidia PCI-E graphics cards causing audio problems?

 

[andyguk]

well.... I've come across this forum,

http://forum.cockos.com/archive/index.php/t-8047.html

and it mentions the Nforce chipset problems, and in particular using them with high end graphics cards..... hmmmmmmmm I think we might be onto something here. Maybe a new motherboard without the nforce chipset maybe the answer here.

still making test recordings here in the meantime