No drum feel...........

[Dioxide]

After listening countless number of times to this recording and tweeking and tweeking I still notice the drums seem really dry,especially the snare. Yet when I try and put verb on them I feel like stuff gets lost in it, is there a good reverb that anybody recommends.Or maybe its just something to do w/ my mix .heres the track.

 

[sean maru]

I can’t tell exactly what kind of sound you are going for but in general I usually first EQ as best I can first. For snares the first thing I do is go into Soundforges parametric (or paragraphic) EQ and bring the run the spectrum analysis and see the file. You will see where on the left side there is a point where the meat of the signal drops off as the frequency gets lower. I usually set my low cutoff at that point. I do the same for the high pass cutoff. In doing this you have already gotten narrowed your focus. You have gotten rid of the stuff you KNOW you don’t want. After that I listen to what I have if the sound is still muddy I look at the curve to see which frequencies are still ballooning. I also (and others may disagree with this) look at the “prominent frequency” that soundforge provides in the spectrum analysis window. I will divide the prominent frequency in halves, fourths, etc. until I get a number I know to be in the mud range for a snare drum (usually below 100hz) from that range using a narrow Q setting. This is probably unorthodox and may not even be valid but it seems to work. After that I compress using a 4:1 ration or so. I usually don’t want the sound to be over compressed. Although I am using freeware plugins so I don’t want to hear the compressor. If you have a nice compressor, that is a different story. Lastly, I would add reverb. I usually like a kind of short plate setting. I try to time the ms decay setting so it is a fraction of the beat 1/32, etc. As for the mix, if you want to keep the drums up from but give them a little body listen very closely and just when you start to hear the reverb cut it back a touch. In general head phones are not something to mix through but close ear phones help me tweak reverb settings (because I am not hearing my rooms reverb to boot). Well hope this helps. The stuff I have written is my quirky method, others may disagree but ultimately we all find our own way to do things for better or for worse. Good luck.
-sean maru

 

[Farview]

Try plaing with the pre-delay on the verb. set it so it is in time with the track (1/8th note, 1/16th, etc...) This will get it out of the way of the initial hit. Also set the decay time for 1.5 seconds at the longest. See if that helps.

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

My technique leaves the close mics dry, and instead put reverb on either overheads or room mics (if I have them). Room mics are most preferrable.

Try putting the reverb *before* the compressor. Let's the drums have a lot of space to them and doesn't push them to far in the back.

Try 150ms of pre-delay as well. Gives a very 'off the back of the club' type of feel to the ambiance.

 

[LRosario]

When I started as an intern, there was one carreer enhancing motto I learned that still holds true to this day.

"Recording: Dry, Down the middle, and Center that bitch"

What this means, in basic terms is: "Don't do anything to it during the recording process".

Alot of these sound issues amazingly start at the begginging, with the simplest parts being ignored. I, for example, never EQ unless I have to. Instruments have thier own characteristics naturally and the second you touch that EQ nob, something is going to get lost.


That sounds like whats happening to your sound.

My best advice would be to have you re record the drums again, but without any EQ settings at all, just straight down the middle. Try to find the best place for your mics. If you can get isolated tracks, even better.

Once you hear your "barebones" track, you can start tweaking from there. By tweaking I mean "just a tap of the nob"; subtle changes. With some light reverb on the entire set, you should be able to get a more accurate and more 3 dimensional sound.

Hope that helps.

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

Myself I don't like to mess around with stuff during mixing that much. If you want a particular type of sound you have to capture it at the SOURCE from the first minute go. Otherwise you'll be messing around with a snare drum trying to get that 'crack' you failed to capture by EQ'ing and compressing like nuts.

If I need a little EQ or compresion on something to get what I know I want, I'll do that. One less thing to mess with later.

If you are suspicious that you may not want that sound, print a dry track of it at the same time and save it for a rainy day.

Stuff like reverb, delay, etc etc I will never print thru. Too risky.

 

[Sonixx]

I think it sounds great just the way it is... I'd leave it alone.

Else, maybe...

leave the toms alone... leave the kick alone... leave the overheads alone or put the overheads in a Tiled Room

add reverb just to the snare... with a healthy pre delay and a long tail... but don't put it in another universe. another thought, put the snare on another track, EQ the bottom away and wash this in reverb. move it forward or backward... see if positioning it in time helps.

how did you record the guitars? sounds somewhat like Tools first CD

-keith-

 

[tsl92802]

Bus in the reverb instead of applying it right to the drums (which is what it sounds like you're doing). Compression will tighten things up. Start with a 20ms attack and 1 ms release (or as close as your comp will allow you). 4:1 on the kick and snare as a starting point...maybe 2:1 on the toms since they're a fair amount of tom work in the intro. Adding an exciter to the kick and snare will help them punch through a little more. I'd also play the whole song, and mix the drums to cut through the song, instead of sounding good on their own. I'm not really sure what techniques you used to mix, but I hope this helps.

 

[glimmer_doll]

Myself I don't like to mess around with stuff during mixing that much. If you want a particular type of sound you have to capture it at the SOURCE from the first minute go. Otherwise you'll be messing around with a snare drum trying to get that 'crack' you failed to capture by EQ'ing and compressing like nuts.

If I need a little EQ or compresion on something to get what I know I want, I'll do that. One less thing to mess with later.

that's fine for someone who really knows there equipment in and out and knows what they're doing, but for a lot of people it would be a mistake to work that way...imo

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

that's fine for someone who really knows there equipment in and out and knows what they're doing, but for a lot of people it would be a mistake to work that way...imo

Sad to admit, I do a lot of low-budget recording for bands that don't want to pay for you to mess with their sounds until it is perfect. They want decent, fast and without any confusion.

I've found for myself the quickest way to get those sounds is to commit to them fairly early on. It's a more old school approach that suprisingly works well. At first I was nervous to try it, but when you are working fast and dirty it keeps the momentum of the session going.

I've never had any complaints from clients and ultimately they are the judge of our work. Mine always have came back... enough so that I'm opening up my own place.

 

[AdrianFly]

When I started as an intern, there was one carreer enhancing motto I learned that still holds true to this day. "Recording: Dry, Down the middle, and Center that bitch" What this means, in basic terms is: "Don't do anything to it during the recording process". Alot of these sound issues amazingly start at the begginging, with the simplest parts being ignored. I, for example, never EQ unless I have to. Instruments have thier own characteristics naturally and the second you touch that EQ nob, something is going to get lost.

I couldn't agree with you more on this. I've read alot about people who do home mastering and use overkill on the Maximizers thus those components are often referred to as "bandaids".

When you record clean and clear at the start you are essentially eliminating the possibility of overuse of processing through the whole project. The seasoned vets around here are probably bored to death of hearing about this but beginners (such as myself) need these things drummed into them repeatedly.

Every untouched mix could use a little reverb here, EQ there, etc. The idea is to record clean and concise enough so that it sounds pretty darn good without a single tweak. It's been said before and I'll say it again.. I'll take a dry well mixed song over a poorly mastered 80's beer commercial sounding one.

 

[Dioxide]

how did you record the guitars? sounds somewhat like Tools first CD
-keith-

Well I must have done it through my collective unconscious, they are my Favorite band and that is my favorite cd from them. Other than that I' just tried and tried and tried untill I came up w/ something I was ok w/.

This is my band so I have all the time in the world to work on things and I thank you all for the advise and Ideas I am definetly looking into. This is my first real big project that I've had the chance to work on and I'm glad that I have a resource to go to and ask questions and opinions about.