next/most important step

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ilikejethrotull

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ive got around 2400 bucks to spend but do not intend to spend more than a thousand. preferably 750 tops. im basically just inquiring as to what a worthy investment would be for home recording. seems to me i could definitely afford to add to my mic collection and im fairly interested in studio monitors, but ive been very satisfied mixing on my logitech computer speakers and testing them in my car on a factory bose system. i slightly prefer the computer speakers, i like its subwoofer.

but my inquiry extends to anything and everything i could buy to give good recording and/or mixing results. im recording all manner of drums, keyboard, bass, guitars.

current equipment and setup are as follows:

recording through a tascam us-1800 (usb) into mixcraft pro studio six on an asus laptop. i have heard for a bit more money i could get an interface with better preamps - im pretty satisfied.

mics include:

1 shure sm57, 1 shure axs4, 1 shure beta52, a set of audio technica drum mics (i dont remember their price and dont know anything more about them), couple of shure sm58s, and an unidentified rode condenser that im about 75% sure is the nta1a

zero rack equipment, just vsts.

any 'must haves' or anything that jumps out at anyone i could use? seems to me i oughta just buy some more mics. i just dont really feel like dedicating 500-700 on one nice vocal condenser or something. a few sm57s, a nice stereo pair of condensers for overheads (or multi use ideally) and/or a nice vocal condenser for 3-400.

thanks in advance.
 
how much would i reasonably expect to pay to do at least a decent job?

as far as rooms go:

for vocals and guitars through amps im using my closet. its a closet that is probably about 12 feet high, 14 at most. only about four feet from the door to the wall which is literally clothesd off. its closer to 6-8 feet wide but has some shelves. even with a large bass speaker i can stand/perform FAIRLY comfortably. the door isnt sealed or anything. i have been pretty happy with the sound for the most part, but there is a little ring reflection. its just ive tried a deader closet and thought it sounded lousy/not as good as mine.

im using my bedroom to record most isolated instruments. acoustic guitar, congas, keyboard (direct), cymbals, etc.

drums are in the garage. i think its worth noting that this garage has some treatment, rugs over most of the floor, and is deadish for a garage. thats where ive played music most of my life, and its possible its better suited for recording most of these isolated instruments as well, but i havent just for comforts sake.



i wouldnt want to do a lot to my bedroom, as its a bedroom. if its some strips in corners or something id do that. the main problem with my room is the window. i wouldnt want to/couldnt do a lot about that though.

as far as the closet, ive pretty much dedicated it to recording, so if theres something that would make a huge difference in there and is fairly affordable id be down.

cant do too much to the garage.


this is a great idea and i dont mean to discount it, it also just doesnt seem all that practical given my conditions. basically i dont actually want to turn my bedroom into an actual home studio. if i could spend 300-500 dollars on any of the above and get great results, im very open to this suggestion. its just been my impression that to get real/significant results is out of my price range. i also have some memory foam i was considering cutting up, but having read up on it, doesnt sound like it would be effective.

thanks again!
 
Hello ILJT. :)

First off, I would mostly suggest treating the room you mix in. I assume that is your bedroom. You can build them to be quite attractive. Actually pleasing to me, though I pretty much live in my control room.

If the garage sounds good for drums, then leave it.

Recording in the closet, though seems to be working for you, would be the second thing I would treat IMO. You likely have a more 'boxy' sound in there than you realize. It is quite large for a closet, but you would be surprised how much better vocals sound in a larger/treated room. Not as much so for guitars when recorded with close mics. I record vocals in my fully treated control room (13X25'). Isolate guitars in a 8X8 semi-treated room, only when recording scratch tracks for drum recording. I record final guitars in the drum room later, as it is the same size as my control room, though treated in a different way (ceiling filled with 4" rockwool, and 5 2'X4'X4" panels). A much more live room, with concrete walls and no bass traps.

Up until a couple weeks ago, used the US1800/1641 for years without hearing issues. I did just upgrade to a much better/expensive interface, and there is a big difference in preamp and converter quality. But that was a $1600 investment, and I already have 3 well treated rooms. The biggest bang for the buck in my experience, is room treatment and decent monitors. You can't hear, if your room is screwing everything up.

You also do not mention what VST plugs you are using. But, everything comes down to the quality of the sound BEFORE recording. Then the environment it is recorded in. Then the mic. Then the preamp/conversion/interface. Then then the monitoring chain. What you do afterwords, can only help the previous. Each step has possible improvements, but getting it right on the way in, is where you will get the most out of your recordings.

I would say: "Make the room sound good first".

:)
 
And no, no foam is going to effectively give you the improvement you are looking for.
 
hi jimmy and thanks,

so what kind of treatment ought i look into? is there a particular site and/or a premade kit? what kinda price would i be looking at? from the relatively little i gathered when i was reading up on if memory foam would be effective it seemed like it essentially wouldnt be worth it unless i spent upwards of $2000 and thats just not happening. i also seemed to gather that i should leave it to a professional to analyze and/or do. and im assuming any bit of that may be wrong. i could certainly be inclined to do some treatment in the room, im sure it could look decorative and i doubt itd get in the way. especially if it improved recording acoustics.

it might be worth mentioning ive recorded at one 'major' recording studio twice and another giant warehouse studio (my first and only experience in recording vocals in a large and treated room and i did quite like it) with three different professionals so i have a hint of taste and experience. not trying to establish credibility as that doesnt even begin to mean i know what im doing, but i have some idea/ear for what im getting and my limitations. im definitely not married to recording in my closet, and ive no doubt theres a boxier sound than i realize, i just suspect it sounds better than my bedroom would sound. garage would probably actually sound better but i get a tish self conscious at the idea of neighbors overhearing :). i think i hate my rode mic though? for a while i recorded everything on a USB m-audio condenser and i really liked that on literally everything. the rode to me sounds too high and cheap. also i wanted to note i could easily be wrong on the measurements of my closet as i would definitely not consider it big. i feel like its a hair deeper and a tad wider than a janitors closet.

as for vsts, the daw came with the classics bundle, acousticas own vst bundle (both contain reverbs, delays, compressors, eqs, , a broadcast multiband compressor, ezq equalizer, FAT+ by g-sonique i believe, ferox tape emulator, fsq1964 transient vitaliser, gsnap pitch correction, gsxl4070 parametric equalizer, gtune guitar tuner, izotope mastering essentials, dubmaster liquid delay, mid-side envelope follower+, mid-side harmonic vitalizer+ and mid-side stereophase filter (all g-sonique), pultronic tube eq (probably my favorite), shred amp simulator (i like), tone boosters noise gate and parametric equalizer and plugin called time machine, twisthead vs-206 preamp (g-sonique), voxengo amp simulator, voxengo spectrum analyzer, and xbass 4000L bass enhancer (g-sonique). also a couple direct x plugs. most of those arent relevant to me, but i like to plug mixcraft for anyone interested. for the record, i mess with presets and ultimately end up dissatisfied. i have read up on the various equalizers and equalizing as well as compression extensively, but still have seemingly no ability to use them effectively.

anywho, thanks again
 
IMHO, the best first step would be to flatten out the bass response. You don't need to measure or test anything. In a small enclosed space you will have inconsistencies, bass trapping will help, and you will not be able to overdo it.

And it's pretty simple. Get as much rigid fiberglass or mineral wool into as many corners as you can without compromising your floor space beyond what you deem to be acceptable limits. Wall/wall corner traps don't have to take up too much space. Floor/wall traps make it tough to put things next to the walls, but maybe you can squeeze some in around and/or under things? Don't forget the Wall/ceiling corners, they can give you a whole lot of trapping without much ergonomic headache.

Then you'd ideally want to make a "reflection free zone" around your mix position. Hang a panel to either side of your head between you and the speakers, and get something on the ceiling above.

Then look at the area behind the speakers and behind your head and maybe put up a few panels to stop the first reflections there.

You could probably do all of this within the budget you stated above. Even $500 will make a huge difference. It's not quite as cool as a shiny new wizbang gizmo, but it will make your mixing experience a hell of a lot less frustrating.
 
I say the best idea is to just save your money until you find something you really want. You're obviously content with your recording environment and mixing abilities. If you're going to treat your room (which I don't think you should at this point), I would say treat the room you mix in first.
 
Room treatment - build some bass traps (see the threads in the Studio Building section of these forums) - you can move them around as needed. Also monitors - if you are using computer speakers now you are not hearing a true representation of your mixes.
 
I'll just second (or third or forth) the room treatment suggestion. Like Ashcat says:
You don't need to measure or test anything. In a small enclosed space you will have inconsistencies, bass trapping will help, and you will not be able to overdo it.
Click to expand...
All of that is so true.

It doesn't matter if you have the greatest studio monitors in the world. Your room is much more important. I'd rather have cheap home stereo speakers in a treated room than the best monitors in a room that's lying to me.
 
thanks everyone. im pretty sure i get the idea, surprised i can do it at a relatively inexpensive price. gotta research some of this as i have no real knowledge of these things and absolutely no diy skills :) .

its fine with me though that i ought not go buying a new toy. saves more money. just as a response, i am pretty content with my conditions, such as they are, because my recordings hardly have a fanbase, and ill be listening to them in two different settings primarily, which includes my computer speaker set up. thats why i see less urgency to it, which is not to dismiss the advice. i just mean, no matter how accurate my environment is, it IS the primary environment. thats why i dont mind mixing on computer speakers either.

however pretty quick here ill be designating this laptop strictly to recording and will probably mix on my computer, and the space and deskvery much lend themselves to treatment and i can already see where i could put some that would look cool. so i will be utilizing this advice where/as im able. may post some pictures with specific inquiries at the time. and thanks again for helping me not make a purchase with little point :)
 
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