Newbie Questions

[emomusician]

Hi,

I'm trying to build a decent home studio to mainly record my band, and some other local groups and do some solo stuff.

I've always went the "standalone recorder" route.. because I like to be able to turn knobs and slide faders.

I'm weighing my options on whether to go that route with a standalone recorder and do all my mixing and such via PC.

I hear all the rave about pc recording, so I wanted to know which would be most cost effective. multitrack recorder or pc recording.

if I went the multitracker route, I'd be getting either a 8-16 track recorder w/ hard drive and at least 4 simultaneous tracks of recording...don't really care what else it has as long as you can export to PC. I want one thats gonna deliver a pretty nice close to professional as I can get sound. I'll also be purchasing a pair of powered monitors.. most likely some truth monitors. I'll also be getting a couple of mics, one for vocals and one for instrument micing. IF I went this route.. would I need any other peripherals to actually make the multritracker sound good?

ok...

So lets say I went the pc route...My computer as it is right now.. is a windows XP machine with a 1 ghz processor, 512 mb ram, and a 80 gig hd. I don't have a good sound card so I'd have to get that. I need something I can record a drum kit with mainly. If I went this route I'd still be getting the same monitors/mics etc. I just need to know if my pc can handle recording, or would I have to wind up upgrading/buying a new system in order to go this route.

So far...

I'm looking at:
Multitrack recorder 400-800.00
monitors 300-400.00
Mics varying prices

which one is gonna be the most cost effective, with the best sound?

Thanks!

 

[Ed Dixon]

Where is all of this going to take place? What kind of room inprovements are in mind?

Ed

 

[emomusician]

ok..

I haven't put THAT much thought into it.. but I'd supposed its all gonna go in am empty bedroom in my house until further notice. The room is carpeted, and I would intend on hanging some egg crate foam to dampen it some, but other than that I'm not getting too fancy. I may build a small building in the back yard to put it all in later.. but thats down the road.

 

[fraserhutch]

I haven't put THAT much thought into it..

Better start now, before you start throwing money away, for example, like this:

The room is carpeted, and I would intend on hanging some egg crate foam to dampen it some, but other than that I'm not getting too fancy.

That's just throwing your money and time away.

If you're going to be recording a band, then room treatment is important. Check out the Studio Building section.

 

[Ed Dixon]

Let's start with the basics. With one room, the PC will be there too. PCs make noise and any good recorder will pick that up too. This is before you consider anything like insulation.

Most bedrooms are not big enough for drums and other gear, in addition to normal furniture.

Ideally you want two rooms. One for recording sounds and the second for recording gear.

Ed

 

[jonnyc]

Guys settle down, he's not releasing this on sony records or anything he wants to record his band, not worry about nodes, computer noise and what not. Yeah if you ever want to make money and get really good sounds the room is important but I personally know a guy that records in a 200 sq ft rectangle of a nightmare. Actually his recording room is 5ft by 7fh with 6.5ft ceilings, which is terrible for recording, especially drums yet his sounds are incredible. He can make everything sound damn close to commercial quality and works with absolute minimum gear. I think its more important for you to learn how to get a good mix and mic placement and so on before you start worrying about making your bedroom "good" sounding. Don't worry about eggcrates, they don't do anything really, just deal with what you have. For a good six months I recorded in an unfinished basement and still got decent recordings, good enough to make the bands say wow. IMO just wait to treat your room until you get good at mixing and mic placement, if you can get your songs to sound good with no acoustic treatment then you know you're on your way.

 

[emomusician]

Thank you!

Thanks, that was actually more of the information I was looking for. I'm not gonna spend tons of money sound treating a room when all I wanna do is get a decent recording. I've heard this millions of times, and it seems to be true.. that its not the gear but sometimes just the person running it that makes the sound.

I have BIG house and I can have the drums out in the hallway and everything else in the room. the room itself has no furniture in it.. and won't except for maybe a desk.

I just wanna know what GEAR I need.. I'm not concerned with room treatment.

 

[Kryptik]

What kind of music are you recording?

Either way, a general rule of thumb that I go by is your audio quality is only going to be as good as your best mic/pre/converter chain, so make sure it's a good one.

General production quality is going to be limited to how well you can manipulate the source and how you play. Ideally, you could set up the sources so that all you have to do is put the faders up and you have a good clear mix. It's not always practical and takes a long time to experiment enough to do that though.

Try and find the most important parts of the song and accent to them. Mold the sources around that.

Also, if your not going to treat your room and the acoustics turn out to be hostile, close micing is your friend. It may be a good idea to see what you have to deal with in that department before you go out buying gear. If the acoustics are at least good, you may be able to get away with just a couple of good mics and have the band play live in the room. That depends on the type of sound you are going for though and chances are there may be a little too much mud or cardboard or ssssissss, or etc.

Try to set a budget. And STICK to it. There is nothing that stinks worse than a bad case of G.A.S.

The best advice I've recieved was take that budget and put half into the recorder and the other half on a couple of good mics and a good mic pre. I recently tallied up how much I've spent on studio gear in the last year and quickly realized how much better sound I could've had if I put my priorities in the right places to begin with. I'd actually have better mics and pres and converters than most of the proffessional studios in the area. Or at least on par.

 

[Ed Dixon]

My preference is to use a multitrack recorder for basic recording and a PC for the mixdown process. That way you have regular sliders and control for recording and all the flexibility of a PC for the remaining tasks.

There are lots of different multitrack units. Key factor in most is how many total tracks they can handle and how many they can record at one time.

If you want to record an entire band at one time, then you’re dealing with 3+ instruments and usually 2+ vocals. If on the other hand you prefer to record each track separately (using a click track to keep them together), then it’s easier. For drums you may need a small mixer to combine multiple mics into a small number of recorder tracks.

For example, Fostex makes a MR8HD, which is a hard disk based 8 track recorder that can record up to 4 tracks at a time. Unit sells for less than $500. You’d be surprised at what you can do with that and a PC. Record some tracks, move to PC, and record more tracks. It’s easy to end up with 16 or more tracks using this approach, and each is digital quality and still separate tracks.

Shure SM-57 for instruments and SM-58 for vocals are good mics. Many more also exist. Lots of firms make monitors and others here are a better resource for good brands and models there.

Ed

 

[fraserhutch]

I've heard this millions of times, and it seems to be true.. that its not the gear but sometimes just the person running it that makes the sound.

I just wanna know what GEAR I need.. I'm not concerned with room treatment.

There is a certain amount of truth to that, but get this: your sound will suck if you're recording sounds that suck. The gear cannot save you then either if your original signal, which inlcudes the room, sucks. To a certain extent you can get around a bad sounding room by close miking everything, but only to an extent, Just be aware of this up front, and also realize that egg crates on your walls will do nothing for you, and is a waste of time.

Most of us put up with this fact and work around it. I was merely pointing out the the egg crates are useless, and it is worth your while to check out the studio building forum for tips and means of working with what you have rather than blindly throw money away.

 

[XLR]

all I wanna do is get a decent recording.

Me too, man.

Getting a clear, detailed and full sounding recording appears simpler than it really is though, IMO. If you record seriously for a few years you're likely to come to believe that the room's sound matters more than the gear. Of course skill is a baseline requirement.

Tim

 

[Ed Dixon]

One thing you can do is to record guitar and bass direct. POD gear or similar modeller will produce pretty good sound, and room setup is a non player. Same for bass.

Drums and vocals are harder, as room acoustics matter. Drums are probably easiest, as volume level is usually high.

Vocals can be harder, as good recorders can pickup chirping birds outside when vocalists are laying down tracks to previously recorded music. Your best option there is to find a time when little is going on outside, and then turn the A/C off before recording (or anything else that produces background noise).

Ed