New to Recording

[PaperMarch]

Hi,

I'm trying to create a basic working setup to mix and record my fiance's music. She is a singer/songwriter and plays guitar as well. Between the two of us, we have a mix of equipment we've collected over the years. Most of it is insufficient, but I thought I'd list it anyway. In addition to recording, she does gigs and I want to eventually be able to use our own equipment, so some multi-use could be in order.

Some of the items I've been looking at are as follows:
Mackie 24/8 or maybe the 32/8 (probably used),
Roland VS-2400cd, or a multitrack hard disk recorder. (looked at lots of these type recorders and am overwhelmed.)

One thing I've learned about the equipment I have and trying to do it all on computer is that I work much better when I can see a real board in front of me. It's a visual thing. I am also too limited by the U-8 because I could not even do her guitar (mic'd and direct) with her vocals because I don't have enough inputs.

Here's a list of what I have. I'd really like some input on how to progressively put together a setup to work with her music.

BTW - The music styles are: Bluegrass / Rock / Acoustic styles
Instruments to be recorded are: Guitar (acoustic & electric), Electric Bass, mandolin, drums, keyboards...

Equipment so far.

Roland U-8 with Cubase VST
Portastudio 424 mkIII (Tascam)
Portastudio (Porta 02)
Alesis Nanoverb 16-bit multi-effects unit
TEAC RW-CD22 CD Recorder
UltraPatch Pro 48-point patch bay
Alesis R100 Power Amp
Alesis Monitor One mkII near field monitors (2)
Misc cables, patch cables, mic cables.
Shure SM57s (3)
Shure SM58
Shure BG 4.0
Small mobile rack

Pentium 3 Computer with:
30 Gig hard drive, cd and cd-rw drives
Floppy drive

Sound Blaster Live! Platinum Card.

PS - I will be doing this in my home. Either a dining room, garage, or bedroom setup.

 

[SPINSTERWUN]

I would suggest this..........

Tascam DM-24

http://www.tascam.com/products/digital_mixers/dm24/index.php

MOTU 2408 mk3

http://www.motu.com/english/motuaudio/2408/index.html

I'm not sure about your budget, but these two pieces combined will set you back about $3,500.00 USD (2.4k for the DM-24 and 1k for the 2408mk3).

The DM-24 goes into the 2408mk3 and the 2408 goes into the computer. Cubase will be able to control the DM-24 and/or the DM-24 can control Cubase.

This setup will give you more than enough room to grow.

The set-up will give you 32 IN's. Plus, the AD/DA converters on the DM-24 and the 2408 are lightyears better than the ones on the SoundBlaster.

Peace...

spin

 

[chessparov]

Or how would you feel about these ideas?

1) Get a Tascam DA-38 or DA-88 MDM multi-track
Use the Tascam 424 until replaced with small mixer
Just use the computer for for mixing down

2) Get a Yamaha MD8 minidisc 8 track multitrack
If you want better portability/less expense
(again use computer for mixdown)

3) Two outboard (could be dual) mic pre's

In any case, I'd sell the;
Tascam Porta 02
All of the Alesis stuff (to be replaced with better gear)
Roland U8 (has latency issues with the faders BTW)

#1 priority IMHO is concentrating on getting the PERFORMANCE
captured as well as possible without puzzling over computer stuff
for most musicians. A simpler format would be better for this,
unless you wish to take the financial plunge with the last (excellent) post.

Chris

P.S. Do you have any condenser mikes for your acoustic
instruments and vocals?

 

[SPINSTERWUN]

Great post chessparov.

I suggested the fore-mentioned setup for the these following reasons....

1. The setup will give them room to grow.

2. The only things they will need to add to the setup will be monitors, mic-pre, stereo EQ, stereo compressor/limiter.

3. The setup is within their original price range.

4. They are already using Cubase, and they can continue to use Cubase.

.............................................................................................

The use of the Tascam DA-38 or DA-88 MDM multi-track will create an added expense (the price of the tapes and the cost of cleaning).

The Tascam 424 will not give them the sound they are looking for.......

I am in agreeance with you on the mic-pre's. I will suggest one, once we figure out what is their budget.

 

[PaperMarch]

DM-24 Setup with HD-24 or Sound Card?

Thanks to Spinsterwun and Chessparov for the helpful responses. I prefer the DM-24 setup for it's expandability and portability as both a recording and performance unit. I also like the interaction and automation possibilities. I'm a little unlcear on the reason so many people seem to be coupling this unit with either the Alesis HD-24 or the MX-2424 as opposed to going to the computer via the Motu 2408 mkIII. In another post, mastahnke (2/21/2003) says he uses the MD-24 with the Motu 2408 mkII and an alesis HD24. Isn't this duplication?

I'm also wondering about your reccommendations on the Mic Pres. I assume this is due to inadequacies in the onboard preamps?

Chris, yes, I have one good condensor mic.

As far as the other items, aren't some of them built into the DM-24?

Monitors - performance monitors / floor?
Mic-Pre -
Stereo EQ -
Stereo Compressor/limiter -

I'm also interested in the future ability to work with ProTools. I have connections with some guys who use it and would like that ability, but don't want to go down the Digi-001 or Digi-002 path because it seems too limiting for what I want to do.

As far as Cubase goes, though. I have it, but am not married to it or anything. Either way, would probably have to get a more updated version of that or another package.

One more thing on a note we haven't covered yet.
Drum machines! I've been looking at the Alesis SR-16, but know it's kind of an old model. Is the 16-bit sound in it too low to get a quality sound from? Eventually will do live drums, but probably will have to do that in a larger studio or way down the road.
Please advise.

Sorry it takes me so long to respond sometimes. I'm busy running by business during the day plus planning for a wedding and honeymoon, plus trying to raise my kids.

Oh yeah, one more thing. In my original post, I listed only one of my computers. In addition to the Pentium PC, I also have an IMAC and a G4 computer as well. It seems that my ProTools friends swear by Mac and some posts have cited different levels of service from Motu depending on whether your on PC or MAC. Hate even bring it up, but the PC/MAC war still rages. Anyway, I do have good Mac capabilities as well as PC.

Thanks again for all your help!!!

Andy (and Kelley)

 

[SPINSTERWUN]

Re: DM-24 Setup with HD-24 or Sound Card?

1. Thanks to Spinsterwun and Chessparov for the helpful responses.

2. I prefer the DM-24 setup for it's ........ portability as both a recording and performance unit. ......

3. I'm a little unlcear on the reason so many people seem to be coupling this unit with either the Alesis HD-24 or the MX-2424 as opposed to going to the computer via the Motu 2408 mkIII.

4. In another post, mastahnke (2/21/2003) says he uses the MD-24 with the Motu 2408 mkII and an alesis HD24. Isn't this duplication?

5. I'm also wondering about your reccommendations on the Mic Pres. I assume this is due to inadequacies in the onboard preamps?.......

As far as the other items, aren't some of them built into the DM-24?

6. Monitors - performance monitors / floor?

7. Mic-Pre -

8. Stereo EQ -

9. Stereo Compressor/limiter -

10. I'm also interested in the future ability to work with ProTools. I have connections with some guys who use it and would like that ability, but don't want to go down the Digi-001 or Digi-002 path because it seems too limiting for what I want to do.

11. As far as Cubase goes, though. I have it, but am not married to it or anything. Either way, would probably have to get a more updated version of that or another package.

12. One more thing on a note we haven't covered yet.
Drum machines! I've been looking at the Alesis SR-16, but know it's kind of an old model. Is the 16-bit sound in it too low to get a quality sound from? Eventually will do live drums, but probably will have to do that in a larger studio or way down the road.
Please advise........

1. You're welcome.
2. It's not a small unit.
3. Some peolple don't like to go the computer route. Some people would also prefer to keep the pieces together as the manufacturer has envisioned.
4. No. The 2408mk3 is a converter. The HD 24 is an hard drive.
5. They mic-pre's on the DM 24 are not shabby. Eventually, you will want to step the level on your front end.

http://www.lucidaudio.com/products/product_genx6-96_info.htm

http://www.apogeedigital.com/products/prod_ad16.html

http://www.avalondesign.com/vt737sp.html

http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/dualmono99.html

http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/masspass99.html

http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/voxbox99.html

http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/SLAM.html

http://www.marquetteaudiolabs.com/eli.html

6. No.
7. Yes.
8. Yes.
9. Yes.
10. I really don't want to get into the MAC/PC debate.
But a true ProTools setup will cost you about $50,000.00 USD
11. I agree on the update.
12. Get an MPC 4000

http://www.akaipro.com/defaultF.htm

Peace.....

spin