New Here and Seeking Advice

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nilman13
  • Start date Start date
N

Nilman13

New member
:) Hello.

Me and my band started recording some songs recently.

Our current setup consists of a three pack of Samson R21 microphones, we connect one to the computer with a Female XLR to 1/8 cord and record the individual instruments as wav's or mp3 clips. We lay them down in FL(Fruity Loops) Studio to mix it and it's where we can use a bunch of plugins to add any needed FX, compression and such; all with software. We record on a Dell Laptop thats about 2 years old or occasionaly a Compaq that is about 5 years old depending on where we are. The songs come out good, the sound quality isn't bad. These are my questions:

1. How can we plug in the other two mics? Two for stereo recording and three for drums maybe? I've tried using a headphone splitter but it dosn't seem to be effective.

2. Any way to record an acoustic guitar without having to plug the guitar into an amp? The mic dosnt pick up something that quiet.

3. Do you suggest any other ways (simple or complex, but relatively cheap) that we could improve on our setup? And why doing such things would make it better?

Thanks guys so much. I stumbled upon this forum and thought this would be the perfect place.
 
You need to get a preamp/mixer. There are a lot to choose from so depending on your need and budget you can stay simple or get pretty elaborate. You probably also need to upgrade your soundcard, stock soundcards are ok for playing games but aren't intended for use as a serious sound recorder. Better mics will help a lot too. For a quick course in gear and how it is used (prices too) do some reading here http://www.tweakheads.com/guide.htm Once we were all at the starting point, so don't hesitate to ask questions here. You may not always like the answers but chances are that they will be the right ones, some of the guys (and gals) here have very extensive recording studios and some are recording some decent stuff on some fairly simple set ups. How far you go is up to how much time and money you want to invest in it, but be advised...once you start, it's hard to stop.
 
Nilman13 said:
1. How can we plug in the other two mics? Two for stereo recording and three for drums maybe? I've tried using a headphone splitter but it dosn't seem to be effective.
Welcome to the nightmare, Nilman. It's not too late to turn around; you can escape now to the bliss of enjoying music through the simple pleasure of creating it. Or, if you're stupidly brave, you can continue on down the dark road of narcissisitic home recording from wheich there is no excape, and which will eat your time and money like locusts on a defensless farm field and leave you with far less pleasure than promised :o :eek: :rolleyes:

To answer your first question, there are two basic ways to handle that one. The first would be with a mixer to live mix your mics down to stereo and then record the stereo signal thorugh the sound card (or via USB or Firewire if you get a good enough mixer that has that ouutput option.)

The second would be to get a multi-I/O interface for your computer that has several mic preamps built into it (e.g. Tascam FW-1084, Presonus Firepod, etc.) that connects to your PC via Firewire interface. Then you'd be able to record all channels simultaneously and mix them on your computer with Fruity (or better, with the software that'll most likely come with your interface).

As Dani alluded to, you could also combine the two by having a mixer and a multi-channel interface, which many do. But I might recommend walking before running, getting one at a time (probably the interface) and getting acclimated to the environment and figuring out if you want to jump in the rest of the way after that.
Nilman13 said:
2. Any way to record an acoustic guitar without having to plug the guitar into an amp? The mic dosnt pick up something that quiet.
There is no problem recording an acoustic with a mic if one has the proper mic and preamp. in fact, this is the standard way of doing it. With your current mics and soundcard your results are going to be of limited quality, but the way to do it is to a) make sure the mic is plugged into the "Mic In" and not the "Line In", and b) go in your sound card mixer software and make sure you have the input level in the Mic In channel boosted enough (but not too high.)

If that still doesn't work for you, then wait for the interface described above, you'll be cooking with gas then.
Nilman13 said:
3. Do you suggest any other ways (simple or complex, but relatively cheap) that we could improve on our setup? And why doing such things would make it better?
Other than the above-mentioned stuff, read and study on the whole subject. You and your boys should go spend an afternoon down at your local Border's book store and hit the music section. You'll find at least a half-dozen excellent books on recording, mixing and mastering music, from home PC setups to the big Nashville studios. Take a handfull of those books over to the store's cafe, order a few sodas and kick back, passing these books to one another as you find neat ideas and things to know.

G.
 
Thanks alot :]

See I've read alot about mixers and interfaces and all that but I'm kind of intimidated by them if you know what I mean...

Are mixers too hard to operate? Is there a helpful manual or something lol and when you buy a mixer what do you need to buy with it or does it come with things to help connect and use it etc.

And how do mic preamps connect to the computer?

I ask alot of questions but I'm thinking I need a new computer to handle all this stuff, not just a new soundcard?

I've really been getting into recording and stuff.
 
Nilman13 said:
Are mixers too hard to operate? Is there a helpful manual or something lol and when you buy a mixer what do you need to buy with it or does it come with things to help connect and use it etc.

And how do mic preamps connect to the computer?

I ask alot of questions but I'm thinking I need a new computer to handle all this stuff, not just a new soundcard?
Mixers are like guitars; it's not that hard to get a sound out of them, but it takes practice to operate them well.

I'd think at your current knowledge and experience level that you might be best off holding off on the mixer and concentrating on doing your mixing "in the box" (meaning on the computer.) In that case you just need a decent interface with servicable microphone preamps on them. These interfaces connect to your computer very easily via either USB or FireWire port (depending upon the model and it's capacity.)

If your computer was built any time in the 21st century you probably won't need to change much, if anything, to get working with this stuff. As long as you have a free USB or FireWire port on your PC (depending on what your particular interface will use), you should be OK. If not, then you can add a combo USB/FW multiport card to your PC for probaly about $30. Possibly you might benefit a bit in performance down the road from a memory upgrade here or HD tweak there, but upgrading most likely will not be necessary at the outset to get going with one of these interfaces.

Don't take offense at this, this is serious advice: get yourself a copy of the book "Home Recording for Dummies". I'm not calling you a dummy :); this is actually a very good intro book into home recording gear and technique for someone like yourself just getting started; it will answer a LOT of these basic questions and take a lot of your nervousness away from you when you go to use this stuff. :)

G.
 
Awesome, thanks!

There are so many Dummy books, I never thought I would want to read any but this one is looking pretty attractive.
 
welcome to the world of recording. you are sucked in and you cant turn back now.

it's an expensive little world. and painful, and many headaches are to come.

you need some sort of interface, like the guys are telling you. mixers with usb/firewire options, a PCI soundcard, or a USB or Firewire interface. do a search on here for USB vs Firewire and you will learn of the difference.

and yes, you might need a new computer. if you are going the laptop route, beware, sometimes they just dont cut it. i learned that the hardway.. last august i got a top of the line Ibook G4, maxed out ram. it was almost useless with my Digi002 and protools. now i had to buy a new computer, an Imac G5, i got it used last month.

computer spendings = well over $2000 this year..
 
hey southside glen, do you know of any good books for working with plugins, ie, eq, limiting, compression (although you're tutorial was awesome!) and crap like that?

oh so maybe im looking for mixing/mastering for dummy's or something like that.
 
TragikRemix said:
hey southside glen, do you know of any good books for working with plugins, ie, eq, limiting, compression (although you're tutorial was awesome!) and crap like that?

oh so maybe im looking for mixing/mastering for dummy's or something like that.
Not yet ;).

G.
 
TragikRemix said:
ooh.. are you writing THE book??
Well, probably far from THE book, but at least A notebook (or maybe two.) It/they might not be exactly what you're looking for, but it/they will be similar in style and format to the compression notebook in that it/they will cover basic theory and technique more than it/they will cover advanced ninja shortcuts. The reason I say "it/they" is because I don't know yet if it will be one single notebook or two seperate ones, I'm going to wait to see how that plays out.

But as showin in my signature line the main topics will be critical listening and the 4-dimensional approach to mixing (the final title(s) are not set yet.) Included in the 4D Mixing stuff will be lots of information on the use of signal processing (EQ/compression/reverb/etc.) as part of this mixing technique.

These notebooks will be published online and will probably be accompanied soon after by a new website. With that new website the plan will be to have both the compression notebook and this new material become available for standard on-line browsing as well as the current downloadable format.

It probably won't be until sometime this fall that I have the new stuff ready. In the meantime, Borders has plenty of good books on mixing and mastering, including the "handbook" series by Bobby Owsinski and many others whose titles and authors are not coming to my mind as fast as they should on a Saturday morning :P.

G.
 
ooh, i cant wait!! are you going to charge for your new tutorial?
 
TragikRemix said:
ooh, i cant wait!! are you going to charge for your new tutorial?
I have no plans to at this time.

Contributions are always welcome though ;) :D.

G.
 
bumping my thread with more questions

http://www.samedaymusic.com/product--BEHUB1202

If i were to buy that, would I still need an audio interface?

How does a mixer connect to a computer? It connects to a computer right?

Oh and southside Glen i bought that book, it's very interesting so far.
 
Don't be afraid of mixers! A mixer is just another "tool." It's main purpose is to allow you to get the best mix (balance) before you send the signal to the recorder. A good mix to start with will make the rest of the process much easier.
 
Okay, well what if I bought a mic preamp? Do you still suggest investing in a mixer now or could i save it for later? What about a recorder? could I just record it straight to my computer?

Heres what my band has pulled off with our current equipment:

www.myspace.com/whosreallywinning

You Never Told Me - recorded all with a $2 computer microphone (no one knows what brand) that I got like two years ago. used FL Studio

Good Morning - Acoustic guitars recorded with the $2 computer mic, drums and bass recorded with a Samson R21 plugged into the 1/8 input on the computer

That's A Fox! -all recorded with Samson R21 (not the best song ever written)

live performance recorded with Samson R21
 
you need an interface and sequencer to go straight to computer. i have a tascam us 122 and im fairly new to this, but i like what you can do with it. And as for intimidating, well once you start recording music it becomes intimidating! Drums are a bitch to record no matter what gear you've got, try using midi for now or creating your own samples. Also, welcome to the forum, but as a general heads-up, some people are real dicks, you've got some real nice guys giving you advice though.
 
thanks for the welcome

As for samples and MIDI;
no, ive already made music using samples and soundfonts.

Southside Glen mentioned USB Mixers. I think that would be my best bet right now. After that, I think I'll get an A.R.T. tube preamp.

Any comments/suggestions?
 
well if you wanna record straight to your computer, you NEED a sequencer. Otherwise you're talking a digital 8 track, where you would only use your pc to bounce files back and forth. Basically a sequencer will have an on-board mixer; with firewire and a good sound card you could route multiple mics through multiple pre-amps in the card...and give each one their own track. Then your INTERNAL mixer, which will be a part of your sequencer, determines the volume, parameters etc. External mixers would be used for a 'Live' sound; not layering one track at a time. I have an audio card with 2 inputs; i could take a left and right line out from, ay an 8 channel mixer, and run it straight into my sequencer. This isn't really used for much other than micing a drum kit, as all your mixing has to be done externally and cant be augmented afterwards. So it seems to me you need to choose between computer recording (Cubase/Reason/Ableton and a sound card) or stand-alone
recording (Boss 16 track station). Hope this clears things up somewhat
 
sorry just saw southsides perfect explanation. what he said!
 
Back
Top