Never thought I'd see myself considering this

  • Thread starter Thread starter antispatula
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antispatula

antispatula

Active member
but I think I need to get into digital recording. I know that this doesn't directly link to mics, but since this subject is a pretty general topic about digital recording, I might as well post it here.

I've been using a 8 track reel to reel recorder. Problem is half the tracks don't work properly, and I've literaly put most likely a litte over 30 hours trying to isolate and fix it's problems. I've cleaned the heads, demagged the tape path, calibrated it, cleaned the pots and basically all contacts. I was thinking of replacing the filter caps and relays, but I doubt it's worth it for now, since I'm about to go insane. I can't bring it to a tech, I'm 17 and low on cash. I don't have the patience to get ANOTHER 8 track with 1/2" tape. I simply want to record. I used to really care that I was "all analog" but now it really doesn't matter to me. The idea of using a reliable recording medium that requires no maintenence sounds like absolute heaven to me!

So......uh......what do I need? :p I have no real clue about digital recording. So, I need a computer.....gathered that much. Ok why don't I make this more simple:

1.I have a computer that's pretty new. It has XP, 2.08 GHz Processor, 512 MB memory or whatever you call it and 120 GB hard drive. Does this sound like a decent computer to start recording on?

2. Is it a wise idea to get a new soundcard? What should I get? I use a 16 channel mixer. I only record 2 channels at a time max and can usually fit most songs into 8 tracks.

3. Software.....Give me a good brand. I DON'T need something super duper pro and complicated. Something decent and usuable. I don't need pro tools or anything. How much does this kind of software run?

4. Don't I need some sort of A/D converter? How much do they run?

Thanks!
 
A good starter system would be an Emu 0404 sound card (great converters) and then shareware software like Ntrack. No limit on the amount of tracks you can run, but it depends on the speed of the system. I'm using an AMD 2600+ system with 768MB of RAM and I can run more than 16 tracks.

www.fasoft.com

The more memory the better. At least 512MB, 1GB preferrable.

You could also buy Sonar from Adobe.
 
You could just buy a decent two-channel sound card. Something along the lines of an M-audio Audiophile or similar. That would give you two channels of decent a/d conversion for cheap.

Just go from the line outs or the channel inserts from your mixer in to that.

You could download a free copy of Audacity or Krystal, and that would be enough to get you started. Or you could try a demo version of something like Adobe Audition or N-Tracks. And if you like either of those, it wouldn't be too expensive to just pony up and activate it ($300 for Audition or $100 for N-track, I believe).
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try out your current sound card and see what you think. use an adapter cable to go from your mixer to your sound card's stereo line input (two mono inputs). that might be good enough for now so don't spend any money until you've tried it. if you decide you don't like it or just want to try something a little better, emu and m-audio both make 2 in / 2 out sound card's for $100. a/d and d/a conversion is handled by your sound card / interface.

software wise, Reaper is free: http://www.cockos.com/reaper/ i don't think it has midi support yet but you may not need that anyway. it's software under construction and when it hits version 1.0, you will have to buy it. as of now though, it's free so get it while you can. personally, i had terrible experiences with krystal and audacity. reaper is much better, imo. if you want something with more developement behind it, tracktion has a simple layout and runs $150. personally, i'd eat the learning curve and go for cubase though. it's stable, has alot of features, and once you get a grasp on the basics, it's not complicated to use.

also, some times you can find interface/software packages and save some money that way.
 
im selling my Terratec EWS88/MT 8 channel soundcard for $250....it comes with some demo software on the driver CD....Id have to dig it out to see what is there...
 
I think digital recording for us fun seekers is cool....I can lay something down and edit it very quickly. I have no real need for pro results, so my stuff can do way more than I am capable of. It keeps it fun, without spending an arm and leg, and is infinitely upgradeable as my ability improves.
 
http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

It's an open source app for you to record on. It's extremely useful for being free and doesn't complicate things at all. Your computer is more than enough to record on. Some people might boast that they have 2 gigs of RAM and can manage 64+ tracks at a time. My songs usually end up being about 12 tracks max due to individualized drum tracks. I can manage all of them on only 256mb of RAM. You have double me, you shouldn't have a problem.
 
hey thanks guys.

So if I wanted to use my analog mixer, I would need to get a 8 channel soundcard? Is that how it works? Are these expensive?
 
antispatula said:
hey thanks guys.

So if I wanted to use my analog mixer, I would need to get a 8 channel soundcard? Is that how it works? Are these expensive?
Click to expand...

Does your mixer have subs or aux outs? You need to route the signal out like you would to any recorder. Unless you used the direct channel outs, 1 to 1, 2 to 2, 3 to 3 etc. You'll need 2 tracks to patch the output of the card back in so that you can monitor it, unless the sound card supports live monitoring.
 
what mixer do you have?

if you want to be able to record 8 tracks at once, you would need a 8 input sound card. you said that you usually record 2 tracks at once and a stereo sound card would be fine for that. about the cheapest 8 in / 8 out card is the 1010lt, $200 and some times a little less. It works fine for my needs but it can be a pain in the ass to set it up for the first time.
 
I Think you were talking about mixing on your mixer. or did you want to mix in the software? if you wanted to mix on your mixer, you could get a soundcard that has 2 ins and say 8 outs.
 
thats exactly what I meant falken, thanks. I only need to record 2 channels at a time, but want to mix is WITH my mackie cr1604. So where do I find these soundcards with 2 ins and 8 outs?
 
If you were already set up to go the analog route, why not just look into a hard disk recorder like the Alesis HD24 or something, or even an older ADAT if you could find one in good shape?
 
antispatula said:
thats exactly what I meant falken, thanks. I only need to record 2 channels at a time, but want to mix is WITH my mackie cr1604. So where do I find these soundcards with 2 ins and 8 outs?
Click to expand...

If you mix "out of the box" using your mixer, you're gonna be putting all your tracks thru extra conversion stages. The advice I've been given is to mix "in the box" unless you have really nice converters and mixer. I would stay in the box considering your mixer and the level of sound card you're looking at.

if you stay in the box, your audio is converted to digital once when recorded. if you mix out of the box, it's converted once during recording, once when sending the tracks to your mixer, and again when rerecorded to your sound card. welcome to digital. :D

btw, you would still need an 8 input card if you mix out of the box and, you will be limited to 8 tracks.
 
antispatula said:
hey thanks guys.

So if I wanted to use my analog mixer, I would need to get a 8 channel soundcard? Is that how it works? Are these expensive?
Click to expand...


if you have a 16 channel mixer you can RECORD every channel you plug into.

if you out the mixer to your soundcard line in those 16 channels will be converted to 2 monos (stereo left and right)

I think the best thing for you would simply getting a 1/4 inch trs stereo to 1/8 inch trs stereo cable to go into your computer's line in. (or whatever out jack you have to an 1/8 in stereo trs)

a program i really like is ACID. There's two versions the Acid pro which is pretty pricey and then there's a 50 buck version that will do everything you'll want to do besides plugin automation. but really, if you've been analog, you're not going to be into crazy plugin automation.

This seems like the cheapest, best quality, and most fitting solution for you.
 
TravisinFlorida said:
If you mix "out of the box" using your mixer, you're gonna be putting all your tracks thru extra conversion stages. The advice I've been given is to mix "in the box" unless you have really nice converters and mixer. I would stay in the box considering your mixer and the level of sound card you're looking at.

if you stay in the box, your audio is converted to digital once when recorded. if you mix out of the box, it's converted once during recording, once when sending the tracks to your mixer, and again when rerecorded to your sound card. welcome to digital. :D

btw, you would still need an 8 input card if you mix out of the box and, you will be limited to 8 tracks.
Click to expand...

I'm in total agreement here. I used to mix on a board before going to a DAW. It is much easier, more power, flexible and versatile to mix on screen in software. With automated level controls and panning and with VST plugins for effects, not to mention you can mixdown and burn straight to a CD, I don't see the need to use a mixer for anything but input.

I may even go straight to the sound card from preamps and rack-mount channel strips. Why have all that extra signal path in the mixer to color the sound?
 
Ditch the mixer and buy a Presonus Firebox.

$300 - 6 in, 10 out AND Cubase LE software.

No point using the mixer, really.

Dirk
 
Hey Neighbor, how ya been? Did you ever go to that studio in South City?
So, you're actually considering coming over to the dark side of the force? Oh, there's a Tascam 80-8 over at Guitar Showcase' Swapshop right now for cheap.....don't know the condition, but it didn't say as-is. But really, I think once you take the digital plunge you'll be happy. Analog tape is great, but as a songwriter/arranger, you'll find the editing capabilities of a DAW are awesome, and adds greatly to your creativity in a way that tape just can't. The happy medium for you, eventually when you can afford it all, might be to record to a DAW, enjoy the non-linear editing, plugins, and virtual instruments, mix or at least sum on an analog desk, and mixdown to a half track reel to reel. Then you'll satisfy your analog side, and get to play with all the goodies that come with digital.

Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated. :eek:

Really, your'e gonna like working with a DAW. :)
 
Robert D said:
Hey Neighbor, how ya been? Did you ever go to that studio in South City?
So, you're actually considering coming over to the dark side of the force? Oh, there's a Tascam 80-8 over at Guitar Showcase' Swapshop right now for cheap.....don't know the condition, but it didn't say as-is. But really, I think once you take the digital plunge you'll be happy. Analog tape is great, but as a songwriter/arranger, you'll find the editing capabilities of a DAW are awesome, and adds greatly to your creativity in a way that tape just can't. The happy medium for you, eventually when you can afford it all, might be to record to a DAW, enjoy the non-linear editing, plugins, and virtual instruments, mix or at least sum on an analog desk, and mixdown to a half track reel to reel. Then you'll satisfy your analog side, and get to play with all the goodies that come with digital.

Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated. :eek:

Really, your'e gonna like working with a DAW. :)
Click to expand...

hey man, cool to see you again.

Haha yeah, I almoast feel like a traitor going into digital :rolleyes: :D

But yeah it sounds very easy and REALIABLE. That's all I really care about now. I never did go into the studio, I'm still trying to see if I can do it myself and stay sane :eek: ;)

So I know some software costs a LOT. I'm NOT looking for a bunch of expensive plugins and stuff. I'm pretty much a minimalist when it comes to recording. I want to be able to record it, then mix. That's it. As long as I can adjust the levels and eqs and maybe add a little reverb, that's fine with me, "state of the art" editing capabilities don't really phase me.

So here's an important question to me: When it comes to actuall audio quality before mixing it or editing it or anything, is there a difference between the sound with a 50 dollar program and a 500 dollar one? Thanks!
 
antispatula said:
hey man, cool to see you again.
So here's an important question to me: When it comes to actuall audio quality before mixing it or editing it or anything, is there a difference between the sound with a 50 dollar program and a 500 dollar one? Thanks!
Click to expand...

Yes, but no.

Every audio engine will impart subtle differences, but will you hear the difference between tracks recorded in Audacity (free) as opposed to Logic 7 ($1K) or Nuendo 3 ($2K) ? Not likely.

Your hardware will have a much more significant impact than the audio software engine, especially if you don't have tens of thousands of dollars in your playback setup.
 
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