Need More Inputs for Recording - What Should I Do?

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Confusitron

Confusitron

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My band and I have plans on doing some recording in the upcoming weeks. I own a PreSonus Firepod. However, this time around, I'd like to expand upon individual micing of the drums. In the past we recorded each drum with only one microphone. The entire set-up was this...

1 (Audix OM-2) - Snare
1 (Audix OM-2) - Piccolo tom
1 (MXL MXL990) - High tom
1 (MXL MXL990) - Low tom
1 (Audio-Technica AT2020) - Bass drum
2 (MXL MXL991) - Overheads

At total of seven mics used on seven of the inputs of the Firepod.


The set-up that I'd LIKE to have for this next session with more mics would be...

1 - Snare top
1 - Snare bottom
1 - Piccolo tom
1 - High tom
1 - Low tom
1 - Bass drum resonant head
1 - Bass drum beater
2 - Overheads
1 - Hi-hats

A total of ten mics to be used with not enough inputs to accomodate them all on the Firepod. What should I do?

My options for additional inputs include buying other similar products to the Firepod and using them with the Firepod, or buying an entirely new product that supplies more inputs than the Firepod. What would be a good idea?

If I were to expand upon the already existing Firepod, I could buy the PreSonus Firebox, which would provide me with only EXACTLY the number of inputs I need, or I could go with the Behringer ADA8000, which would provide me with what I need and more and it would cost less.

If I were to buy an entirely new product that supplies more inputs than the Firepod, I could go with many products. I have been considering the mixer-like recording products that Alesis (Multimix series) and Phonic (Helix series) manufacture. They would not only work as recording devices, but could also serve as standard mixers. Also, the sliders they provide can be a very nice convenience when adjusting recording levels. Can these sliders, however, be used in the mixing process? That would be a great addition as mixing on-screen is an irritating process often times. I have read that these products do have semi-poor preamps. What is the story behind this?

What do you all think I should do? Do you have suggestions for other products?

Thanks for any help in advance.
 
Buy a two-channel preamp that has S/PDIF outputs and hook it to the FIREPOD's S/PDIF input, then record all ten channels?

Or, if you're using a Mac, just get a second audio interface, hook them up via S/PDIF, and set one to slave off the other. If you're using a PC... I think you can only (easily) do this with a second FIREPOD unless you don't use ASIO.
 
dgatwood said:
Buy a two-channel preamp that has S/PDIF outputs and hook it to the FIREPOD's S/PDIF input, then record all ten channels?

Or, if you're using a Mac, just get a second audio interface, hook them up via S/PDIF, and set one to slave off the other. If you're using a PC... I think you can only (easily) do this with a second FIREPOD unless you don't use ASIO.
Click to expand...
Well, the PreSonus Firebox, which I mentioned before, is a two-channel preamp. The PreSonus Firebox is $299.99 new. The Behringer ADA8000, which supplies 8 channels, is $229.99 new. I think I would be familiar with the quality of the Firebox, as I own a Firepod, but can anyone vouch for the ADA8000? The ADA8000 would provide me with more inputs and cost less, so that is its advantage over the Firebox. The ADA8000, however, can only record at a max of 48 kHz at 24 bits, which is the case when using two Firepods together (they can only record at a max of 48 kHz at 24 bits).

I am running a PC (for sure) with ASIO drivers (not for sure).

Thanks.
 
could you get away with not mic up the toms for the basic beats record them and then mic up the toms and record them and punch them into the track?
 
axeman_ukl said:
could you get away with not mic up the toms for the basic beats record them and then mic up the toms and record them and punch them into the track?
Click to expand...
I did not consider that... Not only would it require fewer microphones to be purchased, but it would require fewer inputs... That could be an ultra saver! Great suggestion! I might try this out, but it depends on the drummer's comfort.

Then again, maybe I do not need to mic the bottom of the snare or the beater of the bass drum. Maybe I should just use some wise mic placement. However, I thought it would be a nice idea to up the ante/sound from the last recordings with more mics, which is not always the way to make things sound better.

Thanks for the responses so far. Keep them coming!
 
Confusitron said:
I did not consider that... Not only would it require fewer microphones to be purchased, but it would require fewer inputs... That could be an ultra saver! Great suggestion! I might try this out, but it depends on the drummer's comfort.
Click to expand...

*David turns his head to avoid watching as the drummer commits suicide.... :D*

If you have a mixer lying around, you could premix the toms down to a single stereo track with a mixer, and drop the hat mic, then adjust your overhead positioning to get more hat.
 
Confusitron said:
Well, the PreSonus Firebox, which I mentioned before, is a two-channel preamp. The PreSonus Firebox is $299.99 new. The Behringer ADA8000, which supplies 8 channels, is $229.99 new. I think I would be familiar with the quality of the Firebox, as I own a Firepod, but can anyone vouch for the ADA8000? The ADA8000 would provide me with more inputs and cost less, so that is its advantage over the Firebox. The ADA8000, however, can only record at a max of 48 kHz at 24 bits, which is the case when using two Firepods together (they can only record at a max of 48 kHz at 24 bits).

I am running a PC (for sure) with ASIO drivers (not for sure).

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I know of people that use the ADA8000 with great results....
SOme people on this forum uses it.
http://dpsworld.vibestudio.net/viewforum.php?f=1&sid=4dad9cb972e53626c19d361f5dee5530 :cool:
 
The ADA8000 wont work in your situation because it only outputs in adat, which the firepod doesnt have.


How did the AT2020 sound on the bass drum?
 
dgatwood said:
*David turns his head to avoid watching as the drummer commits suicide.... :D*
Click to expand...

Seppuku with a drumstick. :D

The FIREBOX isn't a standalone S/PDIF mic pre, BTW. According to the Presonus FAQ, you can't just plug mics into it and have it output S/PDIF. That probably precludes its use for adding extra inputs to a FIREPOD. From a quick Google search, some devices that would work (I think) include:

Presonus DigiTube
Aphex 230, 207D
DBX Pro
ART Digital MPA
ART DPX
 
Why not just buy another firepod and daisy chain them...voila 16 inputs (20 if using spdif)...If you dont want to spend the cash try to find someone selling one on here or on ebay.
 
Hi there:

I think that's the situation I'm facing at this moment too.

Someone will say 4 mics is enough, and you have no need to use 2 mics for the same amp. But is that what you want? I guess not.

You like to tweak the EQ of each mics particularly, since every mics have it's nature and it doesn't sound like the best sound if u don't eq it, when u did the eq, it's a personal setting and it represents your taste. However, ordinary mixer will provide little eq options if it's a 3 band. (much better if it's a 3 band with "sweepable" mid where u can set the start off point of the mid freq)

You will get the best result with a mixer that provide multiple out with multiple subgroup which allows u to record the sound of each mics individually for further processing. (That's what u'd like to do, right?) Also you will get a better result if the eq is more precise, so u should think about parametric eq, which let you to set the Q and the gain in terms of +/- 12 or 15dB usually. (Sometimes 17 on the quality ones)

I'm thinking about the possibility of wheter the digital mixer will do that for you.

I've posted a question up there few days ago with poor grammar, if u have the time, take a look at it.

if u like to read further about thos stuff I talked about in that post, go wo www.soundonsound.com and use it's search function to find those reviews. You can even go to those professional shops to ask those guys for help.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm a novice learner.

Kenoir
 
I don't know about your money situation at the moment but I'd have to agree that buying another Firepod all together would be better for now and in the long run.

I have an MAudio 1010 (which was a mistake...) and a Firepod working together with to other Maudio sound cards all wordclocked and spdif clocked so they work together.

I would love to sell some stuff and get a second firepod however to daisy chain the firewire and get rid of the output problem I have with the 1010. Cheap gear leads to future problems.

Retracking could cause sync problems in my opinion. Not sync with recording, but human sync problems.
 
Firepod
1010
Delta 44 (or 66... which ever one has that outbox with 4 trs... don't even remember anymore)
Audiophile 2496 or whatever that thing is

But yeah I don't even use the 44 anymore, the 2496 is purely to keep the 1010 in sync with the firepod now except i'll be using it for outputs for monitors now.

1010 I only use when recording live stuff. I think I might consider selling some stuff and getting another firepod though.
 
I come across a similar situation a few weeks ago. We just mic'd the drums without the bass mic, then went back and did a clean bass drum x2 take. Turned out decent, and gave some extra play when EQ'n the bass drum. As long as you have a willing and able drummer, that is.
 
i can vouch for that ada8000.

as long as the firepod has ADAT (i cant remember) its good.

really, its behringers best and most solid piece ever. mine is like 2 years old already, its perfect still.
 
o0Charlie0o said:
Firepod
1010
Delta 44 (or 66... which ever one has that outbox with 4 trs... don't even remember anymore)
Audiophile 2496 or whatever that thing is

But yeah I don't even use the 44 anymore, the 2496 is purely to keep the 1010 in sync with the firepod now except i'll be using it for outputs for monitors now.

1010 I only use when recording live stuff. I think I might consider selling some stuff and getting another firepod though.
Click to expand...

Hay if you want to get rid of the 1010, I take for one dollar! Ok? ;) ;) ;) ;) :D :D :D :D :D :D
 
btw, 10 mics is too much i think. you are going to have terrible phasing problems.

if you use some (better) mics, you might get different results.

990's for toms?

i have 57's all around, and on snare.
d112 for kick, c430's for overhead.

no condensors except the overheads in my setup for drums. i tried using a single MK319 as additional overhead and i hated the sound.
 
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