Need advice,input, on final setup.

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iproduce

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The following equipment and hardware is what we have in mind for our studio. Recording Studio, not Production. The studio is not a home studio. We already have a building and the construction will be finish by the end of January.

We are looking to compete with other studios in the downtown area of Nashville. Yes I know we have some "REAL GOOD STUDIOS" down here, but we're just starting out and will cater to Hiphop/R&b/and hopefully Live Bands.


Right now we have the following equipment.

Mackie Control
Behringer 32 Channel Mixer (Basically for the live recording)
Microphones
KRK Monitors
Headphones
(We purchased this earlier just to get a jump on things) Now we're about to purchase the following to put inside the control room at the moment. Please let me know what you think about it, and what do you think we are missing. Right now, this will come up to $15,000 and we're really capable of spending up to about $20k - $30k , BUT if we dont have to spend that much, we rather not.. although we are trying to compete with other studios.


4 Mackie Control Extenders w/ Mackie Control
A pair of Mackie HR824 Active Studio Monitors
VAIO RA828G Minitower (Computer)
23-inch LCD Display (maybe 30in)
MOTU 828 MKII FireWire I/O
MIDI Express 128 8x8 MIDI Interface
Sony PCM R-300 Professional-quality DAT recorder
AKG K271S Studio Reference Headphones
Focusrite Platinum Compounder


We will have 4 15in speakers put into the walls. We will also be using CuBase for tracking.


I know we will need extra mics for the live bands that will come in.. Please give us some insight on what mics.


We will have an engineer with college training and so on to come in for the recording part. But please help me out on our blank spots.
 
i wont comment further other than to say a VAIO would not be my choice.
check around the net for reasoning. i would have looked carefully at an amd 64 based "white box" system. just check with motu which amd motherboards and chipsets are recommended. as a serious studio i would have looked carefully at a different mixer (onyx ?, used trident ? used midas ?soundcraft ? allen and heath ? and i'll throw a ringer out - alice mixers are respected in several circles (alice.co.uk). and maybe some nice preamps like rane ms1b or fmr audio. just some ideas so - dont get antsy. happy new year !
 
we can set the behringer to the side. I actually looked a little bit more into it, about 2 months after buying and wished I would have turned another way. But oh well :)


Alright, ill check into some preamps and do further research on the computer. Don't really want to go with a Mac when I can find a very powerful PC.


Any more comments welcome
 
iproduce. how refreshing to hear your open minded.
so here goes...
in that case i would also check out symetrix preamps as well.
like the ranes you dont hear much about them - but they are well respected.
frankly one "golden" mic pre might be appropo. youll just have to demo a bunch. one hi end one (but expensive !!) used in europe is DACS.
but some say there are better lower priced choices. maybe hardy ? great river ?
on the pc - as i said amd 64. hard drives with 8 mb caches are good.
dont muck up the pc config with tv tuners, network cards and other "stuff".
you might also consider if this is to be a serious studio getting around some of the net "used gear" brokers for "deals" from big studios.
there are tons around on desks, mics (look at ev re mics !!), and various big studio effects units. you can get A LOT with your budget if you shop wisely.
one question - why the dat deck ? i dont like dats frankly.
you should read some old articles on dat tapes "leeching" over time.
scary stuff !!
in summary - i would look at a lot of used gear except for key peices like ada convertors, key lead track mics, new monitors, and pristine mic pre's.
just make sure you can get service on any used pieces you pick up cheap.
an interesting forum is prodigy-pro/forum
check it out sometime.peace.
 
alright thanks..

I'll look over everything you said and go into re-evaluating. I really don't know why I picked the DAT, I was thinking about doing something with the DAT that I could do with something else and just jotted it down. The big problem im having is actually finding things that should go on the Rack. Although some stuff might not be needed, alot of people have said "Appearance Sells" so you know, I want it to look like I have TONS of stuff and look like I spent Hundreds of thousands when I didn't ;)


Thanks.. anymore comments are welcome.
 
Well, if your budget can afford it, the best Power Mac G5 Apple makes will blow the socks off any PC in the market. Though that's my personal opinion.

I haven't used used Cubasis, but my experiences with PCs and any version of Sonar has not been pleasant (I've used them all!). It's a great package, but I can't tell you how many false takes we've ended up with! (We'd be armed and set to go, but for some reason recording would not happen! We could then try again, making no changes, and it would work.)

Let's not get into the megahurtz (or these days, gigahurtz) myth though.
 
alex. dont want to get into a pc/mac war. but in this computer engineers
opinion your wrong. problems people experience with pc is because they
have them not properly set up... bottom line.

iproduce. if you want the "look" of an expensive studio , i would seriously look at the used market, but before spending a LOT of money i would test market your local area and see what level of business you can expect.
many people ive known have been burned by buying lots of high end equipment only to find their local market cant generate sufficient revenue to support it.
a good way to test out computers - whether mac or pc is to do two things.
1. record track after track and see first hand which configuration "stutters"
first. this seperates the men from the boys in technology.
2. use a stopwatch and time how long key processes take to perform.
for example noise reduction is a good test. take a track and noise reduce it.
ive done this on a number of platforms, and the amd 64 beat everything.
have not had a chance to try dual opterons however which some folks claim
they get 180 tracks or so. but i think dual opterons is a pricey approach
given rapid tech changes. if were me i would look seriously as i said at amd 64.
just my 2 cdn cents.
 
Alexbt said:
Well, if your budget can afford it, the best Power Mac G5 Apple makes will blow the socks off any PC in the market. Though that's my personal opinion.

I haven't used used Cubasis, but my experiences with PCs and any version of Sonar has not been pleasant (I've used them all!). It's a great package, but I can't tell you how many false takes we've ended up with! (We'd be armed and set to go, but for some reason recording would not happen! We could then try again, making no changes, and it would work.)

Let's not get into the megahurtz (or these days, gigahurtz) myth though.
Click to expand...

Hmm, interesting. I'm running a PC with an Athlon 2100+, 1 gig of ram and WinXP professional. I had ZERO problems running Cubase SX3, and now have ZERO problems running Sonar 4. I had to spend a little time tweaking, but with the vast amount a resources on the net, I was able to get things running A-1. I think you'll find more problems with DAW's relating to user error, and simply not taking a little time to configure everything properly.

Apples are overpriced IMO and especially now that the AMD64's are becoming more popular. If I had any kind of budget I'd do my research first before assuming that the G5 will "blow the socks" off any PC on the market today. That could very well be a real myth.

That would be megahertz and gigahertz - and what myth are you talking about?
 
I was thinking about going with a Mac also but I just have more experience with PCs. Thinking that things would run much smoother knowning what to do on a PC then not knowing exactly what to do on the Mac. If that makes any since. I also forgot to list the specs of the PC.

Intel Pent 4 560 with HT Technology
3.6 GHz 800mhz bus
1 MB Cache
1 GB Ram PC3200 DDR
400GB Hard Drive
128MB Video Card

Well thats just the major specs of it. On the computer Im on now I dont have much I didnt have much problems running cubase sx 2. When I add an effect it sort of delayed a little bit and got to around only maybe 32 tracks. Its a pent 4 .. 1.6ghz 30gb hard drive laptop, 256 SDram. Anybody have any other advice Im always always open to it.
 
on the hard drives ip - i would get two.
one small one for windows and larger for your tracks. preferably with 8 mb cache. that p4 will do you nice BUT you might want to run an amd 64
thru the track test ringer and see how it performs by comparison with the p4.
i gave you some test ideas in the previous post. the reason why i like the amd 64 is because folks are reporting high track and plug in counts with them and low latency. but - do your own tests. also DONT SKIMP on the power supply. overspec it in case you add more "stuff" down the line.
and as i said keep the pci slots as free as possible except for the sound card interface if your going pci approach.peace.
 
iproduce said:
I was thinking about going with a Mac also but I just have more experience with PCs. Thinking that things would run much smoother knowning what to do on a PC then not knowing exactly what to do on the Mac. If that makes any since. I also forgot to list the specs of the PC.
Click to expand...

I'd agree with you here. If you're familiar with PC's, then go that way. You can get great performance from a well configured PC - as I stated above. That and you can save yourself some $$$

I would, as Manning1 stated, go with two drives as well. I have two Western Digital 8 meg cache drives - 120 gig - maybe a little overkill, but this works well for me. One drive has my OS, apps, other data - the other is used only for audio.
 
Manning1, I am just about to purchase a amd64 machine with 1gb of ram and 2x 160gb harddrives etc... would i need to do any configuring to this and if so what would i need to do. I will be running cubase SL2 and numerous plug ins. I have also noticed alot of talk about controllers such as RAID could you explain what these are used for and anything else I should look out for.


Cheers Dave
 
firedome. ive made many suggestions on amd 64. just search under my name. one key point is to use a dealer who knows his stuff in building lots of pc's if your going that route. another is OVERSPEC the power supply.
so that if you add more peripherals later on - there is no power supply strain.
there are many power supplies out there that dont meet rated spec.
amd.com have lots of info for you to read and recommendations.
ideally each hd should be on its own channel. and 8 mb cache hd's are good for audio tracks. i personally dont feel the need for raid.
i just back up my projects onto a second hard drive at periodic intervals. keeps things simple.
 
Also We were going to get surround sound maybe In the studio. Any tips or ideas on the best way to set this up.
 
My take....

1.) Sell the Behringer off ASAP before it lowers any more in value

2.) Forget the Mackie monitors. The same amount of money will get you a pair of Dynaudio BM15's and a decent Hafler power amp and will kill the Mackies.

3.) How about a dual monitor card with 2 17" LCD's? That gives you more screen space, more flexibility, and costs less.

4.) Get a computer built for audio production, and not one filled with OEM crap.

5.) Maybe lose the MOTU and go with an RME Fireface or some RME solution for better sound quality, and rock solid stability.

6.) Don't buy the DAT until you have everything else you want since they are expensive ( media), a pain in the ass to deal with, and redundant with todays DAW set-ups.

7.) Save some money and don't get 4 Mackie extenders. Maybe just 2 of em. You may find that you use them much less than you might think.

If you want to truly compete with professional studios, you really need a couple of high exposure high dollar units to help bring some foot traffic through the door. For hip hop, people seem to be really keen on the whole Avalon 737 Neumann mic thing. I would also do my best to get at least 1 Distressor, a great river preamp, maybe a Soundelux and a BLUE mic as well. Also, make sure you are capable of a bare minimum of 16 simultaneous inouts to your DAW if you want to be able to work with bands on a professional level.

Most importantly though, none of this means squat unless your engineer knows how to deal with clients (PC skills) and does good work.
 
xstatic. i agree 100 per cent with your post. excellent stuff.
iproduce - you know what you might do - but this is very "bleeding edge" !!
benchmark an amd 64 laptop. heres the reasoning.
1. they are powerfull - with 7200 rpm drives.
2. it might give you an edge in your market as you could maybe offer a "mobile recording service". someone i know made a lot of money 10 years back because they were the only outfit in town that would go to a location
and record with their "truck".
BUT - a ryder , amd laptops are very new technology. so take some time
and benchmark carefully if this interests you and make sure you check with
the vendor of the sound solution eg..rme whoever that the particular laptop
is compatible. or maybe try and rent a amd 64 laptop with the agreeement that you can buy it when your studio is up and running and your sure all works seamlessly. in theory a amd 64 laptop is a great solution for a mobile daw. BUT - this is a very new technology so i'm sure some will buy the wrong laptop and get arrows in their backs. but in theory its a great solution.
 
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