MIDI help please!

  • Thread starter Thread starter VGreen
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VGreen

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Hi there,

As my name suggests I am very green at all this home recording stuff, so I hope someone can give me a couple of tips.

Here's the run down:

1. I've connected my MIDI keyboard to my computer via a MIDISport uno 1 to 1 interface, with the intention of recording keyboard only through an Mbox on ProTools 6.4. However, after loading up the driver and clicking through all the "Logo Compatibility" stuff a few times, only the USB and IN lights on the interface have lit up. Should the OUT light have lit up too?

2. Next, I've connected the keyboard to my Mbox via a 1/4" cable, i.e. from the "phones/output" jack on the keyboard to the "source 1" jack on the Mbox. I've then set the source 1 to "line" on the front of the Mbox. The "mono" light is off (although it doesn't seem to matter). The USB light is on.

3. I've also hook up two speakers using a stereo jack plugged into the "line output" jacks - black plug in left jack, red plug in right jack.

4. I've then created "new track" on ProTools 6.4 using mono, MIDI track. In the Mix window I've clicked on ALL as the input selector. and the USB Audio Device channel 1 for the MIDI device/channel selector. (Selecting the others, i.e. SoundMax WDM MIDI, MPU-401, or Microsoft GS Wavetable SW synth brought up a "no response" message and the program crashed. I assume this is because I don't have the corresponding software.

5. Then I tried to record. But only one note would sound every few seconds(on the keyboard) and would be recorded (in ProTools) even though I was playing many notes in a row, then there'd be a gap, then another note, then a gap, etc. like there's some time delay problem. Also, the OUT light on the MIDISport lit up each time these eratic notes sounded.

Any ideas would be much appreciated. Thanks a mil.
 
sounds like quantize is on... try turning it off or changing the setting to 1/16 or higher depending on how many notes your putting in one bar.
 
your method sounds pretty messy. if you provide some details, i'm sure we can help.
specifically... what keyboard are you using? are you using a sound module, or trying to take audio right out of the keyboard? do you understand that MIDI is not sound, but information?
i've not used pro tools for a while, so i'm a bit rusty, but i don't think the problem is in the software.
 
bigwilz24

"sounds like quantize is on... try turning it off or changing the setting to 1/16 or higher depending on how many notes your putting in one bar."

thanks for your reply. i've messed with the quantize option but nothing seems to change.

****************************

national sandwic

"your method sounds pretty messy. if you provide some details, i'm sure we can help.
specifically... what keyboard are you using?"

yamaha psr e303

"are you using a sound module, or trying to take audio right out of the keyboard?

i'm using a sound card in my Mbox, and connecting the keyboard to the Mbox. as i understand it, the sound card converts from analog to digital then digital to analog then outputs the sound through the speakers, that are also connected to the Mbox. i've checked this and sound is in fact coming out of the speakers.

"do you understand that MIDI is not sound, but information?"

yes

"i've not used pro tools for a while, so i'm a bit rusty, but i don't think the problem is in the software."

thanks for your reply. i'm assuming the MIDISport interface output light should light up each time a note is played. this isn't happening. i've replaced the interface once but with the same results. i'm sure the interface is ok. my usb connections to the computer are also ok. audio recordings work ok, i.e. when i play the keyboard through the audio track option on protools. this tells me protools and Mbox are working ok. perhaps there's a problem with the midi component on the keyboard? it's new, but these things can happen.

if you have any more suggestions then please feel free to offer them. eventually i may have to take the keyboard back and get this checked.

thanks again for everyone's help.
 
ok... answer these questions:
- what are you trying to record? the keyboard's own sounds, or are you running a software synthesizer (in Reason or something) that you want to record?
- why do you want to record MIDI data?

I don't use a MIDISport, my midi's on my card. But all units should have at least one LED that lights up when MIDI is received and sent. Your OUT light isn't lighting up 'cos you're not sending MIDI out of your machine into the keyboard. For now, you really don't need MIDI going into the keyboard, so only connect this:

Keyboard (MIDI OUT) -> MIDISport (MIDI IN) -> Computer (USB)

Pro Tools isn't a great sequencer, it's a great audio recorder, and even though it has MIDI capability, it's really not the best place to be doing MIDI work. Once the data is in the computer, you need to tell the computer what to do with it, it's meaningless on it's own. If you use softsynths, they interpret the MIDI as notes, with pitch, duration and velocity (volume), and play them back. the MS Wavetable is a bunch of really shit MIDI patches (sounds) available in Windows. The MPU-401 is your computer's MIDI Out, so that'll send a signal out of the machine (via your only interface, the MIDISport) to an external MIDI patch module (which I'm assuming you don't have). I'm not sure what the SoundMAX MIDI option is; SoundMAX is usually an audio driver, but maybe it has MIDI patches too... so you need to select the MS Wavetable or the SoundMAX as your MIDI device to produce sounds.

Your keyboard isn't a "USB Audio Device", it's a USB MIDI device. Remember, MIDI is never audio, it's just a bunch of instructions.

what kind of machine are you running? i'm wondering if the machine is coping with MIDI playback...but i'm sure it shouldn't be struggling, whatever it is. sure, it's possible the midi on the keyboard isn't working, but that's unlikely. try find the option on the keyboard to set "Local" to OFF. this will turn the keyboard into a pure midi signal machine, and won't send anything to the keyboard's own patch module, only through the MIDI Out.

STILL, if you're managing to record AUDIO, through the MBox, then that's good. Your Yamaha's patches are almost certainly better than anything on your computer.
 
NationalSandwic said:
ok... answer these questions:
- what are you trying to record? the keyboard's own sounds, or are you running a software synthesizer (in Reason or something) that you want to record?
Click to expand...
Good question. You've just triggered something in my brain. I've actually been trying to record the keyboard's own sounds directly through midi, but your question has made me realize that I can only do this through audio. With midi, I can use the keyboard only as a controller, but the sounds must be supplied by a software synthesizer like Reason, which I have.

However, I've just been trying to set up Reason but am having problems with midi input. In the Preferences menu it says I have no midi input. I assume the midi input is through the MIDISport, which is connected!

- why do you want to record MIDI data?
Click to expand...
I want to record some of my songs on midi so I can insert different notes, correct mistakes etc.

Your OUT light isn't lighting up 'cos you're not sending MIDI out of your machine into the keyboard.
Click to expand...
Makes sense.

Pro Tools isn't a great sequencer, it's a great audio recorder, and even though it has MIDI capability, it's really not the best place to be doing MIDI work.
Click to expand...
That's just great. I wish they had told me that when I bought it.

The MPU-401 is your computer's MIDI Out, so that'll send a signal out of the machine (via your only interface, the MIDISport) to an external MIDI patch module (which I'm assuming you don't have).
Click to expand...
Correct.

what kind of machine are you running?
Click to expand...
Pentium 2. I had the computer designed specifically for using mbox and protools, so it should be ok.

try find the option on the keyboard to set "Local" to OFF. this will turn the keyboard into a pure midi signal machine, and won't send anything to the keyboard's own patch module, only through the MIDI Out.
Click to expand...
Done.

I appreciate your help. I'll try to get my head around all of this new jargon. I'm a little confused about Reason and Protools. I'm assuming Reason is a sample software supplied by Digidesign (makers of Mbox). I'm also assuming that to record using midi in Protools, I'll need another synthesizer software program.

Take care.
 
Ok! I thought that was the mistake you were making. =)

I actually haven't used Reason myself. But I assume selecting a MIDI In device should be a simple procedure. You ought to have some documentation for the program; check that out. Reason may have some sampler modules (which use bits of audio to model the sound) in it, but I believe it's mostly synthesizer modules (which generate sound by algorithm). I'm not certain if Digidesign bundles the full version with the MBox; probably not, but it should definitely be MIDI capable. You may even be able to record MIDI into Reason itself.

Getting audio out of Reason and into Pro Tools is another excercise altogether...you either need to use cables or (preferably) a system called ReWire which both PT and Reason understand.

I'm afraid I've never tried to record MIDI into PT, so I can't say how or if it's even possible. But I suspect it isn't. :/ But for editing/altering notes, you really need a MIDI sequencer, I think the most popular (but, not the most powerful) is Cubase.

I use Logic Audio for my recording (audio & midi). It doesn't have as good an audio editing interface as PT, but it's been ok for my needs so far... for hardcore audio processing I use Cool Edit Pro. Don't stress about having bought PT though...the MBox and Pro Tools itself are both great.
 
Pentium 2.
Click to expand...

Is that a typo or are you serious?

I'm assuming Reason is a sample software supplied by Digidesign (makers of Mbox). I'm also assuming that to record using midi in Protools, I'll need another synthesizer software program.
Click to expand...

Reason is not sample software nor is it made by Digi, you may have a demo for PT

You will need to rewire reason into PT (a feature) but if your running a pentium 2, dont expect much
 
Thanks for your help Nat and Al. I've been making some progress as follows.

Firstly, I should have said Pentium 4, not 2. :p

The guy at the store I bought the Mbox from advised me to visit the M-audio web site and download the latest updated driver for the MIDISport 1x1 interface. I did this and now have MIDISport as the Input option in Protools as well as Reason Adapted. The Output light on the interface is now lighting up each time I depress and release a key on my controller keyboard, which is correct. Also, the midi notes I play on my controller are being recognised on PT, however, no sound is coming out when I play it back. Sound comes out on audio tracks but not midi. So I'll have to work through this. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

I've also had a look at Reason Adapted, which is a sequencer. (By the way, the guy from the store tells me PT is also a sequencer and can record midi.) I've managed to import a drum sequence (patch) and have learned how to use it. But when I import a patch to use with midi, such as electric piano, the controller makes a really weird, loud sound that sticks on and the only way I can stop it is by closing the program. Again, your suggestions would be appreciated.

I've been reading up on midi and have exposed my ignorance. At this stage my understanding of midi is like a jigsaw puzzle and I'm just waiting for the right piece to bring it all together. But at least I'm progressing, not regressing. Thanks again for your help.

V
 
You will need to read extensivly how to rewire reason into PT.

I would play around with reason on its own first, get it working with your controller and then start worrying about PT integration
 
Sure thing, VGreen...hope it helped some.

Yeh, sure PT can record midi...it's just not the best place to work with it. :)

i can't think what the deal with your new problem. brain slow today; maybe someone else better will help. sounds like you might have a midi feedback loop there.

altitude's right, ReWire isn't the simplest thing to get going...you set it up so it creates input tracks in the Master application (likely Pro Tools, in your situation) which are actually the Outputs of the Slave application, eg. Reason.
 
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