Mastering Engineers! Help! - Using Waves Plat

[tempo]

Mastering Engineers:

I am not a Mastering professional. I am a hip-hop producer. I would like to present my material in certain settings, post mix. But those venues do not necessitate sending my material away to be mastered. I just need it to sound relatively good for the moment. Example? A customer stops by the studio, and would like to hear a few demo tracks. I want to be able to put a little spit-shine on my mixes so that they 'sound' more presentable.

Now, when it's time to press the tracks, I always send my material away. Because, I'm not the guy who masters. I produce, record, and engineer. But, I need some help here if you can help.

My question is: I'm using the Waves Platinum edition w/Sonar 4. Recently, I've used the Shuffler (spatial enhancement), L2 Limiter and the LimB (multiband limiter) in my effects chain when attempting to put that 'shine' on my mixes for demo purposes. I need to know what you use in your effects chain (if you are using Waves) and in what order are you layering these effects? For instance, I'm using the above effects in the order given.

Can you give me some help on this one?

 

[Massive Master]

You use what the mix asks you to use. If you're not sure, send it out. There are no presets - There is no "starting point" but listening objectively.




Why does it seem that everyone that owns $4200 on a plugin suite doesn't know how to use them?!?

I'll give you one hint though - Spatial enhancements and maul-the-band compression don't belong in the chain unless something is failry messed-up in the mix 99% of the time. If your own mixes require that type of fairly radical processing during the mastering phase, find out what's wrong with your mixes first.

 

[tempo]

Thanks for the quick feedback...and critical at that. That is what I like to hear. I appreciate it from one professional to another. I will definitely check my mixes....but before I go, I should kinda restate what I said in my first post......

I know that there are no presets, and really - I feel like I've found a comfortable medium with the sound that I'm getting - but I want to make sure that I'm on the right track. And really, unless I'm pressing - I don't want to send my tracks out.

My question is this. What order are you placing the effects in the chain...generally. (eq, limiter, comp - or comp, limiter - etc) I don't want big secrets or anything. As for the spacial enhancement - I specifically use that on the instrument subgroup to widen the stereo image if necessary - but only if it is needed. I should have stated that correctly from the outset.

As for the multi-band compression, I find that it is sometimes necessary when adding that touch of compression over hip-hop tracks that have big bottoms...no what I mean? But even then, some hip-hop tracks might not call for it. It's all in the source material. So don't get me wrong...I was giving more of an example in my first post...not the norm.

Quite honestly, I don't use that 4200 dollar effects package in a mastering environment....only in the mix (i.e. compression, eq, and verb).

Do you agree with any of this, or do you still think I'm off base a bit.

Thanks! I take critisism well and am willing to listen.

 

[tempo]

Better yet...based on what you've noted....could I send you a track at 192 to listen to? Then, tell me if my mixes are just F'd up. If they are...well then, I'd rather not even discuss glossin' the track post mix right

Can I email it? If you want 320 or wav, I can do that too...just not over email

 

[Massive Master]

Don't take this wrong - I just don't have time to evaluate mixes for the most part (that's why I don't hang in the Clinic too often).

But I would imagine there's really going to be issues if you don't know if your mixes are "F'd up" or not...

And again - There IS NO standard order - The MIX dictates the order and the settings. You need to listen to the mix objectively (I'm assuming it's too late for that, which is why it's generally not a good idea to master your own mixes - Especially if you're not certain of the quality in general) and evaluate and establish a mental image of its potential. From that, you should be able to establish a chain and at least approximate settings for that chain *in your head* - If that's not happenening, you need to either learn your tools better or keep throwing plugs at it until something sticks - All the while, losing whatever objectivity you didn't have when you started.

I don't mean to sound negative, but this comes up an awful lot - There are SO many variables - and as many "right" answers as wrong ones.

 

[chessrock]

I appreciate it from one professional to another.

You mean "From one professional to some guy who's messing around with Sonar and a bunch of plugins" ?

.

 

[Ford Van]

You mean "From one professional to some guy who's messing around with Sonar and a bunch of plugins" ?

.

You know, that is about how I refer to you Chessrock.

 

[tempo]

Something to listen to....

I can't post tracks here.....I'll have to post it on my site. Give me some time to get it ready. I'm at www.stellarbeats.com. I should have it ready tonight by 9 est.

 

[jonnyc]

Why does it seem that everyone that owns $4200 on a plugin suite doesn't know how to use them?!?

Hey now John, its my job to call them out and yours to reel them in. Its like I mix you master. Remeber two sets of eyes are better at catching pirates than one. LOL! Hey I'm sending a band called pronoia your way, treat them good.

 

[jonnyc]

You mean "From one professional to some guy who's messing around with Sonar and a bunch of plugins" ?

.

Chestcock you're so funny man. Honest too.

 

[chessrock]

I'm just calling it like I see it. If you have to ask questions like "what order" to put your effects chain in ... or how to "spit shine" something to present to a client, pre-mastering ...

... these are things a professional engineer/producer should have at least a rough grasp of, and a basic sense or ear for (And a professional producer should know that a "spacial enhancement" plugin is not going to be of any real use to him at that stage). Similarly, a professional mechanic shouldn't have to ask how to fill a tire or how to change oil, either. A professional pilot doesn't ask "What does this knob here, do?"

Getting back to the original question ... If you want to impress a client, and you don't have the benefit of sending it off first, then simply CRANK IT UP ... good and loud. To the untrained ear, stuff just sounds better at higher volumes. Don't worry about all that plugin stuff or spitshinging. Just crank it. You're welcome.

.

 

[c7sus]

Professionals moan when they cum.

Always remember that.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Professionals moan when they cum.

Professionals cum?

G.

 

[Ironklad Audio]

eh...i know where this guy's coming from

it's the ol' problem of having clients who want to hear a finished product, even though the product isn't finished yet

honestly, since you're just doing rap, i would probably just squash the mix a few db's with the L2 limiter to get that extra little bit of bump, explain to the client that their shit is NOT YET MASTERED, and then crank it as loud as your monitors will let you

 

[tempo]

eh...i know where this guy's coming from

it's the ol' problem of having clients who want to hear a finished product, even though the product isn't finished yet

honestly, since you're just doing rap, i would probably just squash the mix a few db's with the L2 limiter to get that extra little bit of bump, explain to the client that their shit is NOT YET MASTERED, and then crank it as loud as your monitors will let you

My homey...thanks dude! That is what I've been doing. I never squash the mix over 3db...usually by 2 to 3db - but based more on what it sounds like. I plan to post a link to a track that I've done recently. I'll do it today like ASAP!