Limiter time settings

[PDP]

I noticed something about my mixes lately, which is that the sustain of the bass (in particular) changes on different playback systems, sometimes quite noticably. In some cases it even sounds as if it drops out.

I use very short (in fact the shortest) release settings on my Mastering limiter because it sounds bigger and less squashed, but I wonder if its so short its not carrying out the mix enough. In general, I tend to use compression in general (while recording) say at a 6:1 and knock off 2-3db, rather than say 3:1 and knock off 5-6db, for the same reason, its a more open sound to me.

I just started playing around with the transient designer (envelope shaper) in Cubase 7. Very powerful tool. You can get a snare drum so tight it sounds like it will pop the speaker, or so loose it sounds like someone hitting a garbage can.

So, any suggestions on the release of mixing overall? and does anyone use envelope shapers much on any instruments other than drums.

Pete

 

[miroslav]

I noticed something about my mixes lately, which is that the sustain of the bass (in particular) changes on different playback systems, sometimes quite noticably. In some cases it even sounds as if it drops out.

That's probably because they are not all able to reproduce the LF the same way....

 

[mixsit]

I noticed something about my mixes lately, which is that the sustain of the bass (in particular) changes on different playback systems, sometimes quite noticably. In some cases it even sounds as if it drops out.

Difference in freq response, system can be boomy, resonate and that's sort of a time/decay thing, but what you're describing seems beyond that.

So, any suggestions on the release of mixing overall?

Release times for mix comp?

..and does anyone use envelope shapers much on any instruments other than drums.

Definitely. Guitars, bass comes to mind when the shape or sustain doesn't fit, the sustain side or both of the transient tool, or an expander are candidates.

 

[Farview]

It sounds to me like you are relying on the basses fundamental frequency to carry it instead of the midrange. This can lead to the problem you are describing where the playback system can't reproduce certain frequencies, and at certain points in the song, the bass is nothing but those frequencies.

But without hearing it, Im just guessing.

 

[PDP]

That's probably because they are not all able to reproduce the LF the same way....

Thanks

Difference in freq response, system can be boomy, resonate and that's sort of a time/decay thing, but what you're describing seems beyond that.


Release times for mix comp?


Definitely. Guitars, bass comes to mind when the shape or sustain doesn't fit, the sustain side or both of the transient tool, or an expander are candidates.

Cool, apparantly they can be quite useful. I think the release time is only a few milliseconds,( I use the Ozone 5 limiter set on the fastest setting) I played with making the release longer, but it didnt seem to make much difference in regard to the bass.

It sounds to me like you are relying on the basses fundamental frequency to carry it instead of the midrange. This can lead to the problem you are describing where the playback system can't reproduce certain frequencies, and at certain points in the song, the bass is nothing but those frequencies.

But without hearing it, Im just guessing.

Exactly, I dont use multi-band, but I do send my Bass and Kick to a separate buss that only compresses the low end. It gives the mix a nice full sound, but there can be a hole sometimes. Cubase 7 has a visual analyzer on every channel now, which is helpful in finding missing freqs.

Thanks everyone for all the comments.

 

[GONZO-X]

pdp,
this sounds like a 'mixing' question, not a mastering question.

you don't want to go to mastering solutions for a fix for this kind of thing.


apply a limiter on your bass track or bass bus, and experiment with settings til you find what you like.

on the other hand, just better compressor settings are probably what you are looking for.

low end, and bass guitar, are the two top issues with mixes.
cuz they are the hardest.

 

[PDP]

Bass really can be tricky. I agree getting right in the mix is really what needs to be done. Some pro masters really have this awesome bass sound. It sounds really big and full yet its not too much. I've gotta look into how they get that. Thanks.

 

[GONZO-X]

i don't think the mastering engineers created that 'awesome bass sound'.

the mix recordists did.

all the mastering did, was maintain the integrity of the bass with all the rest of the processing.

 

[PDP]

By "masters" I meant the finished recording, not the ME.

 

[GONZO-X]

right.
we're talking about exactly the same thing.

that bass sound probably sounded very close to that before it went to the ME

or, at least, it should have.

 

[PDP]

Thanks bud.