July Thing

  • Thread starter Thread starter rayc
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rayc

rayc

retroreprobate
Here's something I put together last night & this arvo. The progression (well most of it) has been haunting me for about three months - decided I'd better get it down before I forgot it or went troppo.
I had a really cool busy bass line but it killed what the guitars are doing in one part so i simplified it this arvo.
I've used the realplay drums from band in a box for this one as my drum machine is getting wobbly. I had to export them from BIB & import them into Reaper but that wasn't too bad once I fought my way beyond the BITB error messages.
Guitars (a Bruno & a Guyatone) through a Kustom 5watter and the bass (Vantage) through a Behri BDI21 (I'll rerecord with cab & DI blend later if it's worth it).
Are there too many guitars?
Does the bass tone suit the style?
Is the bass too simple in the verse compared to the long walks in the chorus?
Any other thoughts?

Here's the latest remix with new bass line - see post down below...

Here's the latest - 8th July - reeplaced a couple of guitars to address the timing issues raised.


Here's a little more bass 19th July
 
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i hear two guitars, bass and drums. thats not too many for me. reminds me of the stones except for the drum fills. i like the simple bass personally.
 
Manslick said:
i hear two guitars, bass and drums. thats not too many for me. reminds me of the stones except for the drum fills. i like the simple bass personally.
Click to expand...

As soon as I heard this I thought of the stones so,, to answer the questions;
1, too many gtrs =NO
2,bass suit style= certainly does
3,bass simple= it does what is needed(can't fault that!)
4,other thoughts=this sounds really good & you should 300% do vocals, (ask Jagger if he'd help?),, :facepalm:
I think just vox & then listen if it needs anything else,,but I think with the right vocals on it, the jobs-a-goodn! BRAVO :guitar:LOVE IT.
 
Yup, it does sound Stonesy. I like everything you got here, but the timing is way off in spots so it's hard to really lock in with it. I like the raw crunchy guitar tones. It sounds like 2 guitar tracks? I don't see how that can be too many. That's just right to me. I think I like the bass, but I need a little more of it. And it's not too simple. Simple is good.
 
Manslick said:
i hear two guitars, bass and drums. thats not too many for me. reminds me of the stones except for the drum fills. i like the simple bass personally.
Click to expand...
Thanks Manslick,
There're four guitars in total. Yeah, BITB drummer adlibs in a very full on way - a little OTT.
 
jiff 41 said:
As soon as I heard this I thought of the stones so,, to answer the questions;
1, too many gtrs =NO
2,bass suit style= certainly does
3,bass simple= it does what is needed(can't fault that!)
4,other thoughts=this sounds really good & you should 300% do vocals, (ask Jagger if he'd help?),, :facepalm:
I think just vox & then listen if it needs anything else,,but I think with the right vocals on it, the jobs-a-goodn! BRAVO :guitar:LOVE IT.
Click to expand...
Thanks Jiff 41,
vocals are always an issue for me - I collab because I can't sing or write melody. Hopefully I'll get some done.
 
Greg_L said:
Yup, it does sound Stonesy. I like everything you got here, but the timing is way off in spots so it's hard to really lock in with it. I like the raw crunchy guitar tones. It sounds like 2 guitar tracks? I don't see how that can be too many. That's just right to me. I think I like the bass, but I need a little more of it. And it's not too simple. Simple is good.
Click to expand...
Hello Greg,
The timing is awful in a few spots - the little amp is really loud & even with buds in under protectors I had trouble following the drum track. I can fix that though by rerecording the dud tracks.
4 guitar tracks: all through the 5 watt but 2 different guitars, two volumes levels &, essentially, 2 rhythm parts. The Guyatone has a cheap humbucker at the bridge & it really gets the amp to bite.
I've tried to get the bass right on the way in - I did a Lemmy, all presence & mid with the others dialled back (no to 0 like Lemmy though). thanks for the detail.
 
rayc said:
1 Are there too many guitars?
2 Does the bass tone suit the style?
3 Is the bass too simple in the verse compared to the long walks in the chorus?
4 Any other thoughts?
Click to expand...

1 Nope.

2 The guitars know exactly what they're doing and where they're going, but the bass seems unsure at times. You probably just need to play the part ten times in a row and home in on something more solid and convincing. It's got some timing issues right now, so you're going to have to do it again anyway. :)

3 See 2.

4 Vocal?

Good stuff.
 
dobro said:
1 Nope.

2 The guitars know exactly what they're doing and where they're going, but the bass seems unsure at times. You probably just need to play the part ten times in a row and home in on something more solid and convincing. It's got some timing issues right now, so you're going to have to do it again anyway. :)

3 See 2.

4 Vocal?

Good stuff.
Click to expand...
Dobro,
Thanks mate. You picked the problem with the bass. It was the 1st run through after deciding to ditch the previous busy line. & I was, essentially, trying things as I went. It will be rerecorded & hopefully will lock in with the drums a little better as a result.
Vocals? Well, as ever, that's a matter beyond me. I think I have a lyric, I think I have a match of emphasised sy;;ables &against the rhythm and I know, as always, I don't have a voice.
Again, thanks.
 
Rerecorded bass


I was going to address all issues today but didn't get near recording until 9 pm so no guitar changes as I couldn't use the supposed "bedroom volume" 5 watt amp.
I did redo the bass line as it was, as described by dobro, tentative.
I couldn't help myself and added an extra grace note into a run.
Hopefully it works & didn't create any additional tentative moves.
How's the timing now?
 
July 8th Retracking


This is the latest. I've rerecorded a couple of guitars to address some timing issues, (I hope). Does it work?
 
Julything 19th


NEXT mix. More bass and a little more balanced stereo (well according to my meters and monitors).
 
Each subsequent mix is a step in the right direction. Bass is sounding more enthusiastic than the 1st few mixes I just tried on the 1st page. I really like the gnarly guitar sounds you got on this...it's a little heavier sounding than most of your tracks at least in terms of guitar tone. It is a little relentless though...any thought of stripping some stuff away in some places just for a break from the guitar onslaught?
 
Yeah, the new bass part's way better. Now for tone: the bass part's got all those honky frequencies maxed out, but not much bottom. Is that the way you recorded it, or did you axe the low stuff in the mix?

What Heat said about the relentlessness of the guitar part: it needs one or all of...

* a foil (vocal, lead line, whatever)

* judicious muting in some sections

* some kind of change up in the guitar part
 
Yup, better and better. I agree with heat. I love the gtr tones. Real raunchy without getting into too much gain. I see what he's saying about them being "relentless" as nothing really changes, but I think like dobro mentioned some vocals will take care of that. Bass is cool to me.
 
Heat,
Thanks mate. The Kustom Defender 5 watt is quite good. The recordings were done with the volume knob at 10 o'clock with only the cheapo humbucker & soapbar pickups on a Guyatone Mosrite copy on the way in. It's LOUD in the room at that setting too. I did have a rhythm track with a single coil semi-acoustic but the feedback was uncontrollable at that volume & it didn't push the amp to break up at all so I recorded the track again with the Guyatone. Relentless? Actually, if you listen to most of my stuff without a vocal & guitar solo you find that same thing.
I will introduce a little dynamic variety when I have a solo &/or real drums &/or vocal if any of those come to fruition.
Dobro,
Ta mate. I set the bass up according to the Book of Lemmy: all mid & presence with top & bottom wound back. There's still some bottom in the recorded track which I can use as needed depending on the vocal/drum tracks.
Greg,
Thanks. This song started as an experiment to get a decent sound for future reference though I'm beginning to like the song. If I've succeeded it's due to your signposts.
 
VERY Stonesy - I'm liking the new tones you're coming up with. Oh and judicious mixing will solve any relentlessness (is that a word?? ) as evidenced by your previous masterpieces....:-)
 
Gerry,
Thanks mate. The little amp is very interesting to toy with. It does get some odd squeals after it's been on for an hour.
Relentlessness definitley is a word - a good'un too!
 
You've definitely managed to get a decent sound ray - both the guitars and bass sound really full and in their own space, but without stomping all over each other's frequencies. That's always half the battle for me.

It made me think a little of The Fall in their poppier era (though that's a relative term when it comes to The Fall) - with the relentless groove, aggressive guitar chug and fat bass. It's better produced than a Fall record too mind ;)

You've got a few skeletons of songs around at the moment, so I hope you get some of them finished off with collaborators - for your own satisfaction as much as anything. Timing sounds much better on the update too.

Always cool hearing your work evolving ray :)
 
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