is preamp that important?

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Elmo89m

Elmo89m

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My question is not if i can record without a preamp..but how much does a preamp change sound....i cant afford one and would like to know...I mean if you are a good singer and you record right to a computers line -in will it still sound bad?....are there any decent preamps that can be used for vocals and guitar for under like 100- 150. also will a crap mic completely ruin your sound.....basically im trying to justify why everything i record vocally sounds on key...but has bad tone to it....i dont want to spend money on a bunch of hardware that wont help because my voice just has bad tone.Thanks
 
If you want to record with microphones, a microphone preamp is required. There are recorders that have them built in, there are PC / MAC interfaces that have them built in, there are mixers that have them and there are also standalone units.

A preamp takes the low output of a microphone and amplifies it to a line level signal.

War
 
My question is not if i can record without a preamp..but how much does a preamp change sound....i cant afford one and would like to know...I mean if you are a good singer and you record right to a computers line -in will it still sound bad?....are there any decent preamps that can be used for vocals and guitar for under like 100- 150. also will a crap mic completely ruin your sound.....basically im trying to justify why everything i record vocally sounds on key...but has bad tone to it....i dont want to spend money on a bunch of hardware that wont help because my voice just has bad tone.Thanks
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It might help if you share how you are recording and with what gear / mics / software. I've heard some good recordings done on 4track cassette recorders before. Also, if you are not used to hearing your own voice it can be sort of creepy when you do.
 
Im using a line-in to my Sonar thats it....im pretty used to my voice through a PA
 
Elmo89m said:
...basically im trying to justify why everything i record vocally sounds on key...but has bad tone to it....Im using a line-in to my Sonar thats it....
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Then that's why it sounds like crap.
You need amplification between the microphone and the line inputs to match the mic's output (both voltage level and impedance-wise) to the line level inputs.

What kind of mic are you using?
 
Im using a line-in to my Sonar thats it....im pretty used to my voice through a PA
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No mixer before the card? just mic straight to computer card?
 
In general, a preamp can make a huge difference in the sound. It's just one link in the recording chain, but it's an important one. I recommend getting a decent one, even if it's only something like the M-audio DMP3, which is around $120.
 
Im all an ultimate low budget....my mic is a less than thirty dollar shure and the preamp i am getting has four inputs and is only eigthy dollars...i blew all i have on other recording stuff like sonar...and on guitars....(mustang, and a hybrid gretsch<) and right now im not in the position to by a better mic or preamp because i am also buying a UB 12 input mixer
 
Elmo89m said:
Im all an ultimate low budget....my mic is a less than thirty dollar shure and the preamp i am getting has four inputs and is only eigthy dollars...i blew all i have on other recording stuff like sonar...and on guitars....(mustang, and a hybrid gretsch<) and right now im not in the position to by a better mic or preamp because i am also buying a UB 12 input mixer
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The UB mixer is a fine starter preamp, just plug in the mic and use the stereo output to your sound card.

Get a better mic, sonar is a great package but remember

Garbage in - Garbage out
 
Not sure if this will help with your set up,(I'm an analog nut) I use a set up to tape that is unorthadox but sounds great! I use an sm57 into an imp. (radio shack$10.00) and plugged into my POD. Using the tube preamp setting, along with lots of compression, also with the noise gate on. Sing about a foot or even two away from the mic. A wind screen and even a pop filter might be needed. This gives me a nice, flat response. I record direct to tape,and EQ and add effects during mixdown.

This provides excellent gain, and the compression makes a world of difference for that "sounds like you're singing in my face" tone. Works great for acoustic guitar too. I could e-mail you a wav file example if you like.
 
most of that didnt help...ill be honest....but the part about singing feet away i liked because i think that could be my problem.. i have a backing track of one of my favourite cd's (silvechair's frogstomp) and when i turn the mic on in the room with it playing and sing from a distance it sounds almost indifferent from the real singing, but when i do it from withing a foot or two it sounds poor....if this is for another reason it wuold be nice to know that as well
 
Yeah, singing a foot or so away from the mic, takes away the "proximity effect". Which adds kind of a dynamic bass and midrange quality. The closer you sing to a mic.,the bassier it gets. Singing away from it evens out the response. You don't really need much bottom end on vocals. It just muddies things up. The problem is you have to crank the gain to do this, which of course, adds noise.
Another option for you might be an ART tube pre(the one with compression built in) can't think of the model#.
I can't stress enough the value of compression on the vocals. Makes them sound soooo much smoother! I just mentioned the POD thing because their so popular. Seems like everybodies got one. I'm pretty cheap when it comes to gear. If I can make something I have work well, I don't like to blow the cash.
 
Sonar has all the compression you need and the ART pres are not well respected. If you must get a pre look at the DMP3.
 
paddyponchero said:
...ART pres are not well respected. If you must get a pre look at the DMP3.
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True enough. But i gotta say, the art pre was one of the most inexpensive but useful peices of gear i got when i had no other preamps! Bass/Keyboard DI, and mic pre covered in one box. They are a no-brainer for what they cost nowadays. Still use it as Bass/Guitar DI and kick drum pre. I remember hearing mp3's on this board a few years back using the art stuff on everything that were excellent...
 
I've only tried the MP models personally and found them nice as a DI but not as a pre, The DMP3 is $40 more than the tube pac and has two nice clean channels
 
paddyponchero said:
I've only tried the MP models personally and found them nice as a DI but not as a pre, The DMP3 is $40 more than the tube pac and has two nice clean channels
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You can get a Tube MP on ebay for like $35 including shipping.

That's what I did (for mod'ing). They don't sound beautiful, but they work. And if you switch out the OpAmp, they improve a whole lot. Food for thought...
 
Elmo89m said:
Why wont that 8 input mic one work? that i have the link for
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It will work but you said:

"my mic is a less than thirty dollar shure and the preamp i am getting has four inputs"

If you have one mic, you only need 1 mic input, you have four, you don't need eight more. (hehe - that sounds like my sons maths 'you have four apples, you eat one, how many apples do you have')

If your spending money spend it on a mic, if you're not spending money stop windows shopping for stuff you already have.

P.S.
How many inputs has your soundcard got?
 
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