Help with recording vocal vs live PA vocal.

[TheTester]

Hey guys, I have huge problem that has plagued me to no end. I use to play live a year or so back and have played on and off live for a few years before that. I developed an "EAR" to hear what I thought that was pro sounding and decent to the audience at that time. I recently took up studio recording because I song write and a couple of my songs were noticed by some well known artists. When I sang my first phrase through the studio mic with the phones on..........HOT DAMN that was different and sounded like I had NO idea how to sing at ALL. Every little tick in my voice was amplified and stuck out like a sore thumb. I learned QUICK that my sound on stage that I thought was good was just OK and it wasn't my Real vocal anyway. I had to learn how to sing all over again and where I just belted loud on stage and added a certain amount of draw and color to my vocals, now I just sing with my natural voice with no effort or color at all and I say for my own opinion it sounds very GOOD to me and almost pro. I can sing almost any song with minimal effort and it sounds very good. As before I would have to work on it or color it a bit to make it sound good. Now what I hear on CD and or in the studio Definitely high quality, I live two hours from Nashville and hear a LOT of guys singing. Trust me I am my worse critique.

Here is the huge problem. I have had A LOT of great opportunities to sing with and in front of people who could change my career from a hobby to a profession in a blink but when I pull out my old EV's 15 on bottom and 1.5 or 2" diaphram on top, the old shure 58 with nothing in between it but the Yamaha MG206C mixer and the Crown 4000 amp.. I sang a song or two and HOLY COW it sucks worse than my dog howling. I found that I was wanting to EQ the heck out of it "" I know NO NO" but I could do nothing that made me sound like ME. My recordings that I had worked on for the past year on cd that people were hearing and LOVED. I can NOT reproduces LIVE. Have I got to use to the amplification and clarity of the studio? Around here everyone has a different setup or in house PA and you just have to get up and take what you get out of the speakers. You have to be a singing guru and adapt Quick or be a prodigy and sound good no matter what you sing through even if it was a corn cob. I AM NOT THAT GUY.

I don't know what to do or what I have done. Have I developed a WRONG vocal technique or sound that is only good for studio? My vocals are WORLDS apart from the studio monitors and phones or CD in car compared to the LIVE pa. I am serious this text can NOT express it enough how different it is and it makes me want to alter my vocal to hear the same thing. I can't hit the same notes or stay in key because I don't hear the same thing. It ISN'T the same thing.

In the studio I have a medium sound vocal that is warm and raspy that could be compared to Brad Paisely but on a live PA is sounds muddy muddled and I hear no distinct gravel or rasp that makes is great. I hear a blended toned vocal and it makes me want to sing higher and or a LOT LOUDER where I hear a more clear true vocal like I hear in the studio. Again is this the amplification and clarity of the studio at play? Either way it effects my ability to hold in key and it just simply sounds like BS. I would not listen to it for free if that says anything but if I don't figure it out my chances are numbered with these opportunities. Would I have to have some serious gear like JBL arrays and subs to get that clarity and studio sound live? I don't know I am lost.

Please help me out and explain some on this if any of you have some years behind you and know what I am experiencing. I know I am a rooky and don't know much but please don't flame me out. I would like some suggestions and or some answers to what I can do to achieve my studio vocal live IF it is possible.

Thanks much,
TheTester

 

[chrisharris]

I dunno' man. Unless you're doing something crazy in your studio like piling on ten pounds of autotune, the sound of your voice shouldn't be drastically different. I record my vocals with condenser mics and I sing live through an SM-58, and it's still me. Hire a sound guy or get one of those vocal "processing" units and see if it helps?

 

[TheTester]

No funny thing I have recorded dry with nothing but a mic. Still I can tell it is me with out the WOW effect. I get on the shure 58 crank up the EV's live and blah just pure blah. It still has some characteristics of me but that medium deep rasp is gone. It sounds plain and higher live. Muddled kind of if you would say that. I am thinking it is because it is a fifteen boxed up main that doesn't have that kind of frequency responce. There is no mid range I think to grab all of my voice. It is simply getting the low of the low and the high of the high. Put that together and I think it is sounding robbed. Crazy but that is what fellas have always played with and continue to play with but I am lacking some knowledge here. I just don't know how to get that studio sound live. The studio sound is usually illusive but now it is right opposite. I need some some seasoned guys to let me in on how to acheive this.
Thank you again for the reply,
TheTester

 

[chrisharris]

I need some some seasoned guys to let me in on how to acheive this.
Thank you again for the reply,
TheTester

All the seasoning in the world won't help somebody help you with this. You're trying to describe sounds with words. If I heard your recorded vocal and your live vocal, I could probably give some suggestions. But without hearing it, there's no way to tell if the difference is technique or equipment or in your head.

 

[c7sus]

If there is that much on the line you would be miles ahead to line up a producer and/or live sound guy that can translate your studio performance into a live showcase.

 

[gecko zzed]

There is a world of difference between the controlled acoustical environment of the studio and the less controlled and compromise-full live environment. So it is unsurprising that you will sound better in the studio.

However, EV speakers are known for the quality of their sound, and you should be getting a better result. But you know what? I'm thinking that maybe the horns are blown . . . that would certainly deliver a 'robbed' sound.

Maybe you should think about a different mike. The 58s are good, versatile mikes, but they don't suit everyone's voice. Think about getting a good hand held condensor, for example.

It's also possible that the EQ settings are not doing you justice. Get a good sound person to have a look at your set up.

 

[witzendoz]

I get singers in occasionally that find that they don't sound as good as they think they do live. They find that they can't seem to hit that curtain note, they don't sound as rock and roll as they do on stage etc , etc.

What I have found is that this is because on stage they are belting out the song to hear themselves about the stage sound and the extra effort helps them to reach the high notes and to have more drive in their voice. I fix this by turning down the mic input, turning up the band mix in the phones and telling them to go for it.

On a personal side, I have done tons of vocals live and in the studio and now I sound the same everywhere, it's just a case of getting used to it. Personally now I prefer the vocals loud in the phones as I don't have to belt it out volume wise but have learned how to still get that attack.

Don't give up, just keep practicing, vocals is the same as learning any instrument, practice makes perfect.

Alan.

 

[arcadeko]

It could be your stage monitors.

Have you recorded the PA test from where the audience will be? It will not sound the same from where you are performing as where the audience is...

 

[bouldersoundguy]

I developed an "EAR" to hear what I thought that was pro sounding and decent to the audience at that time.

Whatever you thought of how you sound to an audience is not based on anything. You can't tell from stage how you sound out front.

I could do nothing that made me sound like ME.

The bone conduction in your head completely alters how you sound to you, and nobody but you can hear that. How you think you sound is not how you sound to others or to a microphone.

What you need to do is repeatedly record your voice and listen back, adjusting until you get something you like. Try different mics and distances. Make sure your voice is loud enough in your monitors to overcome the bone conduction effect.

On stage you also need sufficient monitor volume to overcome the bone conduction effect so you can hear your actual voice. This is extremely difficult if you share a monitor mix with anyone else because they don't need to hear your voice as loud as you do. Also, on a stage with live drums and amps, you may need to sing with the mic up to your lips to overcome bleed. When you do this most microphones will have a boosted response in the low and low-mid range that will need equalization for your voice to sound natural. Cut as much as necessary from about 500Hz on down.