Getting the vocals and acoustic guitar to gel together

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jamie_drum

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Some feedback on recent tracks I have posted suggests that I am having trouble getting my acoustic guitar and (male) vocal to sit together well. I suppose they don't necessarily sound like they are in the same space.

Can anyone suggest ways to work on this? I considered adding a bit of "ambience" reverb, perhaps a convolution reverb, to achieve this.

Generally my vocals are recorded into a Real Traps portable vocal booth (which isn't a booth at all, it's more like an SE reflexion filter) with some acoustic treatment behind me. My guitar would typically be recorded in stereo, in the same room. However, more reflections from the wood floor might get into the recording on the guitar track.

Thanks for your thoughts. If you want to hear the "problem", my tracks are at:
JamesSolstice's Spotlight page on SoundCloud - Hear the world
 
Use a 57 aimed at your right shoulder/lower neck 3 feet away (record vox and guitar simultaneously).
 
If you want to make it sound like they were recorded in the same place, you need to get rid of the reflection filter, or at least tame its effects (move it further away from the mic). A little reverb on the WHOLE mix will help some, unless the guitar already has a lot of room reverb.
 
Listened to 'Promise and 'Kid. Vocal relative the guitar-
Both have the vocal forward -not just being louder (it is) but also in its presentation.

The guitar is set back somewhat in level but partly also by what sounds like some fast attack compression and/or its resulting mellower tone. The vocals on the other hand are in the sharp upper mids detailed' end.
Forward / back

They're quite dry as well. Heard a bit of a long tail on one of them but a patch perhaps designed to set the hall behind the source. But with out smaller/earlier reflections or delays what have you to 'set things back'. So adding some 'in the room (as opposed to 'room behind) closer cues' is another route.
No doubt I'm missing stuff here but in general sans that you're sort of left with level, tone and dynamic.

BTW, the dry intimate voc thing is a perfectly cool way to go, maybe try slightly slower attack (not too slow..) but faster release. That tends to let/put things (the guitar in this case) sit forward as well
Play on :guitar:
 
i can hear what you're saying about the vocals not meshing in with the guitar.

to me the vocals sound louder than the background music, and that is what puts it too far out front.

i wonder if you do another mix, but this time set your volume of the music, then set the vocals at the same volume (which will be a bit inaudible)....then finely split the music sections only where there is vocals and lower the music volume, only at that section, to make the vocal volume appear clearer,
like a "ducking" effect, then when the vocals leave, the music doesnt seem so far back and the volume change is less noticeable.

also there is a flangy-like effect on the acoustic and the vocal sounds spotlessly clean, which also seperates the two, maybe try cleaning up the guitar or ..either... add some of the same effect to the vocal to blend them together more.

when the bass and percussion /drums come in could be something to glue the vocals too...hmmm?
interesting post.just a thought...
 
A bit dry

James
Might want to try a bit less gain on the vocal and doubling up the guitar track and pan it slightly right and left. May also want to change the phase on the guitar to make it stand out in front a bit with the vocal and then take the final mix ( vocal and 2 guitar tracks)and run it through either a medium room or small hall.
Give it just enough reverb until you start to hear everything coming together.
Listened to your first 2 songs and really like them but with a little tweaking they will hopefully come together.

Jon
 
Cyparski said:
doubling up the guitar track
Click to expand...
You mean actually playing and recording the part twice? Worth a try. Copy and pasting? Don't even bother.
May also want to change the phase on the guitar to make it stand out
Click to expand...
Changing the phase (polarity) on a single instrument doesn't accomplish anything. It has to be in phase or out of phase WITH something else, specifically an identical track or another mic picking up the same source. Since the OP is recording his guitar in stereo, flipping the polarity of one of those mics (not both) might help if the 2 guitar mics are out of phase with each other. But just flipping the polarity on a single guitar track wouldn't do anything.
 
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Wow, lots of great advice here. There is definitely a balance between having a modern, up-front vocal and making it too up-front. I will definitely have a look at the attack / release issue...that could be be part of the problem.

I tried to position the mics far enough from each other that phase should not be an issue. However, I could try some phase rotation (eg phase bug by betabugs) to see if that improves the sound. I actually think the guitar sounds pretty good soloed.

Maybe a bit more reverb...I just want to avoid too much as that is an easy trap to fall into.

Thanks for your help!
 
I updated the mix of "A Promise" to try to get them to sit together better.
 
im sure i'll catch a bunch of hell for this, but oh well. check out youtube.com/lwbga666 and the bonedust tracks posted. most are totally rough, and not where we want for the pressing, we use youtube as a promo/teaser , but me and a friend in another band i produce started a side acoustic project - bonedust and the bloodstained bastards. we are barebones, we use protools, a digi002, a mitchell acoustic, some plugins, etc. i may catch grief over the quality, but we pretty much record and produce from heart for bonedust. get at me if our tracks yield to what your looking at, even though their roughs on there.
 
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