Gated drum tracks

[P Johnston]

I'd like any advice on using limiters to lessen bleed between drum mics. Would this be a situation where you used the gate while recording the drum tracks, with each mic routed through a gate? Any recommendations appreciated

 

[Tim Brown]

I'd like any advice on using limiters to lessen bleed between drum mics. Would this be a situation where you used the gate while recording the drum tracks, with each mic routed through a gate? Any recommendations appreciated

Okay, I'll take this one-since I'm the Gatekeeper! hahaha

What kind and how many gates do you have and/or plan to use?

A Limiter (just in case you don't know) does nothing as far as "gating"-a Limiter "limits" the amount of signal that gets through; i.e., it put's a "ceiling" on it, and says "This is the MAXIMUM that gets out-no matter what the input is".

I gate drums all the time. The Noise gate allows you to shape the drum signal in the sense that you can cut off the "tail end" of it. You also can clean up the sound and add separation between individual drums using 1 gate per 1 mic per 1 drum.

I.e, you want to gate every drum in a 5 piece kit-you'll need 5 mics, 5 channels on a mixer WITH individual Channel Inserts/patchpoints, and 5 channels of Noise gate.

I track with the gates. But here is a trick. You can put a drum trigger on the drum-and use the trigger to open the gate-by inserting it into the "key" input, and setting the gate for an "external key".


Let me explain:
Let's say you have a kickdrum with the Mic running through the gate.
Now, a Bass player is in the same room playing through an amp. Your Gate is essentially worthless-because the Bass from his amp is going to be picked up by that mic in the kickdrum.
This will open the kick mic, and allow bleed-through to be picked up. It's not a matter of it might open the gate-A bass guitar signal WILL open the gate-The Signal is usually so loud it will open it-just a matter of fact.

BUT, if you put a trigger on the Kick and connect the trigger to that same Channel's KEY input-the gate is no longer being opened/activated by the MIC; it's only being opened when the trigger reacts to the kick drum being struck.

Instead of "triggering" electronic sounds, your're trigger your own kick sound-while your "making" said kick sound.

make any sense?
I hope so.

You could also wire a pot in series to act as a "sensitivity control" for the drum trigger


Tim

 

[Shailat]

Although you can, I would'nt gate during tracking.

When you get to the mix you have the option to change the gate settings so way not leave your options open.
Many times I choosen to use a little more of the snare's ambience and not to cut it short.
You can trigger during mixdown as well.

 

[P Johnston]

Thanks for the good advice. My technique is to record the drummer totally separate from any other instrument...he's listening to a click track and a demo bass line and vocal for reference through his headphones. I have one dbx 266xl compressor/gate in the rack, so I'll need to acquire some more gates for the studio, as I typically use 5 mics on his kit: kick/snare/rack tom/floor tom/overhead. Does anyone make a set of gates in one rack unit for this purpose? Unless you think I can/should group the 5 drum tracks during mixdown and gate them simultaneously, but is it likely that the same settings would apply to all drum tracks?

 

[Tim Brown]

Thanks for the good advice. My technique is to record the drummer totally separate from any other instrument...he's listening to a click track and a demo bass line and vocal for reference through his headphones. I have one dbx 266xl compressor/gate in the rack, so I'll need to acquire some more gates for the studio, as I typically use 5 mics on his kit: kick/snare/rack tom/floor tom/overhead. Does anyone make a set of gates in one rack unit for this purpose? Unless you think I can/should group the 5 drum tracks during mixdown and gate them simultaneously, but is it likely that the same settings would apply to all drum tracks?

If you're going to get gates-here is my advice:

Behringer has a 4 channel 1 rack space noise gate.
The Behringer goes for around $200 or so.

My suggestion would be, either go for an Aphex (great gear man!) OR, get a Drawmer Punch gate.
I've seen them both for around $400-$500 New.
It's well worth it to step up to a Pro Gate.

I have a specific sound that I'm after for my own use-and that's what my gate/trigger thing is for.

I sometimes take these tracks, and then use them to trigger a Sampler.

Other times I'll just use a 4 Mic technique ( 2 Kicks, Snare, 1 condenser overhead)

Just depends upon what I'm trying to accomplish.
Tim

 

[James HE]

I wouldn't worry about gating the overhead- let all the ambiance come through. How many tracks will you be lying down simultaneously? If you are say putting the kick on it's own track, then take shaliat's advise and gate it on mixdown. But if you ar submixing things, then gating individual drums while recording would be the best thing to do. I find that floor toms ring out a lot sympatheticaly to the kick, muddying up the kick drum sound, so that would be a good drum to use the gate on, and the snare too. The trigger thing is excellent for the snare. I too have the 266XL, I don't really like the gate all that much, but with some tweaking (and a lot of patience) you can find a good setting.

-jhe

 

[Skyline609]

i think people tend to over use noise gates, and do not allow the natural ambience of a properly mic'ed kit. Dont get me wrong, gates are a valuable tool, and can really help solve some problems. However, i think you should try to mic the drums as best as you can, and refrain from any dynamics processing for as long as possible. Just keep re positioning until you start getting a good sound on each piece of the kit. Then if you have some really bad bleed problems after you think youve made the best out of your mic setup, start adding some gates. Dont take anything away from the natural sound of an instrument unless it becomes nessecary to. Sometimes it may sound really good in the long run to leave that little bit of bleed in there.
Just some suggestions.

 

[Paulie]

Of the 6 compressors I own the 266 XL is by far the worst. It is shameful to have the DBX name on it. The older 266 is a little bit better, the 160 X is awesome. Get yourself some Asley CL-50s they are top notch.Peavey made a 5 channel gate that is very good.

 

[Tim Brown]

Get yourself some Asley CL-50s they are top notch.Peavey made a 5 channel gate that is very good.

Hi Paulie,

Yep, the Ashley's are really good compressors.
Does the Peavey gate have Key inputs on it?
I know it's 5 gates in 1 rack space.

Thanks,
Tim

 

[virtual.ray]

If you've got enough tracks on your recorder you could do both;gate the individual mics going to tape and put up a pair of overheads without gates and record them to a seperate stereo track.Just make sure they are far enough away from the individual mics to prevent phase problems.