Fancy a lyric critique?

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Eurythmic

Eurythmic

majordomo plasticomo
I've never really been the kind of songwriter whose songs can stand on lyrics alone.Melodies come a bit more naturally to me, so that's usually what I concentrate on when I'm writing a song - and when I'm listening to someone else's. In fact, I generally don't even hear a song's lyrics until I've listened to it many, many times. The words just don't register with me.

That said, I've been checking out this area of the forum and I thought it might be nice to get some outside opinions on a few of my words. Please be gentle. :)

I'll post two songs. The first is from a ballad called "We Cried". One or two of you may remember this; I posted a demo of the song several months back. I'm still working on the final version. A friend of mine wrote most of the lyrics - I only wrote the final verse, line two of the bridge, and the last two refrains. I was fine with letting him concentrate on most of the lyrical duties, since that song was about a breakup I'd recently been through and the subject was a little ... close, if you know what I mean.

What is it with women and songwriters? :D

WE CRIED

Why do you keep on saying
We're gonna keep on waiting
And this game that you keep on playing
Cast aside from the love we found

Chorus
And we cried ... to make things right

Why do we keep on fighting
Our anger was so misguiding
And the light in my room is dying
Just like the time before

Had I lied... would I still be in your sight?

Bridge
This common ground we stood upon now slowly drifts apart
I close my eyes, I see your face, and the sorrow fills my heart
So how can I justify the views you choose to see
When everything you say and do takes another part of me!

My hope is quickly fading, I feel
Helpless, it's so degrading
My morals I'm always trading
I'm discarded like a broken glass

All my life... I'll try to keep the fight

But I'll die... if you don't make this right

So what do you all think of this one? It could just be that I'm incredibly hard on myself when it comes to lyrics, but I can't shake the feeling that I ought to change some things so it feels a little less... well, cliche. Any thoughts?

That's the more important one, since I know I'll be releasing it in the near future. But just for my own curiosity, I'll post one other. This is a highly David Byrne-influenced tune. Maybe you've heard "The Moment Of Conception" or "U B Jesus"? It's called "She Dance".

SHE DANCE
She blow through
She mow me down
Personal prevailing wind
Move across the floor
She can see me watching
She's amazed that I care

And she dance
She dance on my skin
Tiny beads of sweat
They dance all over my skin

She glowing red
Pounds in my chest
Sets the place aflame
No smoke no mirrors
They watch her feet
I'm amazed by her hair

And she dance
She drips on my skin
Little beads of sweat
Fall all over her skin

She facing me
Can't keep this pace
How does her world turn like that?
What's your forecast
Tell you what I think
Taking her home with me

And she dance
She trips on my skin
Tiny beads of sweat
Keep dancing on my skin


Thus saith the Peanut Gallery? :D
 
we cried.

As far as cliche goes. Well, love gone bad is cliche and tends to find a common lyrical ground with itself.
Your friend writes some nice lines. The word content is definitly ready to work with the strong point of your melodic phrasing.
Please post the final in the mp3 forum when you've the song done.

I can't seem to bring myself to posting raw lyrics on this forum.
they are so personnal, I know I wouldn't change them but, I am starting to see how songwritters can talk and share.

Thanks for the read.
Theron.
 
Wow.. very impressive lyrics, both songs.. I'm curious to hear the music behind "She Dance"

One thing you might consider on "We Cried": Rhyming the last lines of each verse would really solidify the work. For example, rhyming the word "found" in the last line of the first verse somehow with the line "Just like the time before" in the second verse. I realize there is a chorus in between these phrases and there may be no need to rhyme, but as I am reading it on the screen it seems like it would be an improvement.

Really though, if what I mentioned above doesn't seem to work, then I seriously wouldn't change a word.

Cy
 
We Cried...Cool! As a read the bridge seemed long ..but it is probobly very cool the way it stands..She Dance..Nice and simple and to the point !Kinda want to see "blows" instead of "blow"..mow ect..But if thats some effect you are going for then cool!Really good work!
UMMMM....Peanuts LOL

Don
 
Just a suggestion. In the final verse your voice and the action of the last line, IMHO, conflict with each other. Your voice is clear but you switch between always changing your morals to "I'm discarded." I think it maintains its focus and whose action it is if it read "Discarding like broken glass."

The last two lines "All MY life" and "But I'll die" I think would work better and maintain your voice if you just switched their endings to "All my life I'll keep up the fight" and "But I'll die trying to make it right."

The reason I think the changes are better is because they give your voice strength and focus even if it is a love song cliche in some form. I think chics pay more attention to some one who has a strong committed voice of change than one that is "I'll die if I don't have you" type of appeal. That type of appeal "is" a worn out cliche IMHO.

Lyrics have to work on more than one level and my suggestions are just a point of view and may not fit.


Keep the faith, Ozlee
 
Wow. Very nice comments and suggestions, everyone. Thanks a lot. Definitely not the "been there, heard that" I was expecting.

"We Cried" will definitely be posted in the mp3 mixing clinic when it's ready. I'm really taking my time with it, because as it is going to be on my first release, I'm really going to want people to pick it apart.

So I want to make sure that it's really something I can be proud of, before I let the picking commence. :)

"She Dance", I've had a lot of trouble with. I posted my lyrics because I'm particularly pleased with them, but I've had a lot of problems with the musical part of it. Whenever I sit down and try to write something, it comes out not sounding anything like what I hear in my head. Don't you hate that?
 
one rule of thumb

one major thing to avoid when writing songs is starting with a question, "why" or "how" ?
 
how could anyone give someone advice on how to change a personal thought? Why would you search for these sugjestions? Lyrics are a form of art...the less filters you put art through the better it is. Of course, I feel there should be NO filters, but they seem to be everywhere in the industry, even in the underground a lot of the time.
 
I haven't heard these songs. I just read the lyrics above. And I *love* them. Well done!

-j
 
Eurythmic,

I just cann't get a feel for the lyrics to "She Dance," that isn't anything new for me, but the lyrics make for an interesting song. For what its worth, I can tell a difference in the lyrics "We Cried," between your voice and your friend's. Maybe it is just because you told us that, but your voice sounds like the real source for the whole song anyway. Changing your work isn't something that I think is easy for anyone to do after they have reached the point that you have. Personally I think any song well work better when the lyrics have a clear and understandable flow. I don't mean to say that the listener knows exactly what the source or true meaning behind the words are, or that it has to apply to every song, because lyrics are only half of it anyway. Speak from your heart. Try to make it so that each verse maintains its voice and completes its thought and that the whole thing works as a whole, ( saying what you want ) and don't call it finished untill you are ready.

The only reason that I have for following up and saying any of this is because the song is about a subject that we all have experience with and because you asked ( which I think is smart ), I think the way you word it is important. But they need to be your words and your voice. I'd be glad to help with more specfic suggestions if you are intrested, but only in the context of what I've already said.

Keep the faith and keep on writing,

Ozlee :cool:
 
I liked your suggestions, Ozlee. I'm going to give them a lot of thought when I'm getting ready to have one final go at this song.

Lyrics are really tough to criticise, since they're the most personal part of the song. It's really easy to make someone feel bad, but you all did great. I got a lot of good pointers, and my ego is intact. :)

I wouldn't mind being able to write lyrics like Elvis Costello - but until then, as long as people know what I'm talking about, I'm happy. And if I'm REALLY lucky, then maybe when you all hear the song, you'll know how I FELT when I wrote it, too.

I'd be really pleased with that. :)
 
Hey everyone! In case you folks who responded in this thread still have it on auto-notify, I thought I would let you know that I have posted "We Cried" on mp3.com as-is. Although the instrumental tracks are finished, the vocals are still my scratch recordings. But, I'm holding off on recutting them until I'm able to make a few improvements to my "studio", which could be a while.

Anyway, if you're curious, have a listen. I'll mention this in the mp3 clinic too, but I'm still waiting for mp3.com to approve a couple of songs.

http://www.mp3.com/P_o_T
 
Hi Eurithmic!

Really nice lyrics you got there, I especially liked We Cried. It's very recognizable, I sometimes feel the same. The lyrics themselves are very "rythmic", they have a good flow. It's hard to explain, since I'm not a native English speaker, but what I mean is that they don't stutter. One thing does (IMHO):

Cast aside from the love we found

I'd say:

Threw away the love we found

But then again, I'm not an English speaker and these things are very subjective. I think it would work better, though.



Concerning She Dance: Don't want to offend you, but I'm hearing an uptempo-dance-style Kylie Minoguish-song... I DO like the lyrics, don't get me wrong, I think they would sound nice with a good beat under them... That reminds me, sometimes it makes REAL fun if you make a song in a style that you don't have anything in common with, I wrote lyrics about a rusty car 2 days ago, and I'm making a country-song of it. Country is NOT my style, but when I'm playing it you can see a BIG smile on my face. I can really recommend this!

Good Luck!
Dirk Demon
 
Don't want to offend you, but I'm hearing an uptempo-dance-style Kylie Minoguish-song...
Click to expand...

Man, if that song turns out _half_ as catchy as something like "More More More", I will be EXTREMELY proud of myself. :)

Thanks for the comments!
 
Eurythmic,

I'll give it a listen as soon as I get my pc back up and running. You guys need to keep your anti virus software updated daily if not weekly. I got one of the new ones I think after my daughter had been on my pc. It trashed just about everything.

Keep the faith, Ozlee:(
 
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