Dr-008

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mishappen

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I have read the manual to try and figure this thing out and I'm just not getting it.

I've got my keyboard setup so I can see it triggering the sounds. I can hear the sounds as well. But I don't get how to record what I'm doing to a track.

I am totally new to midi and barely understand it. Should I read more in the midi section in the Sonar manual?

In the dr8 manual I don't understand section 3.(MIDI NRPN Implementation etc...) Is this why I'm not able to get recording to track?

Am I approaching this from the wrong direction?

Also it says there is an upgrade for $49.. Does anyone know what the upgrade can do, that what I have already, can't do?

My dr8 came with Sonar XL 2.2

Thanks

ditsy in denver
 
You should be able to record MIDI data to the the MIDI-track, but you're not allowed to record directly to the audio-track. That's just normal.

The point with MIDI is that it's only signals, the sound is triggered each time the DR-008 get's a MIDI signal (either from the MIDI-track or you playing directly).
 
Open a Dr-008 in an audio track.

Load your sounds.

open a midi track.

Set the output of the midi track to DR-008.

Press record on the midi track.

Record.

Tweak your performance in the piano roll.

Bounce to tracks when you are done tweaking/performing the track, and delete the DR-008.

Enjoy.
 
I think you are almost there.

Make sure both tracks (midi and audio) are armed to record and hit the record button and play some notes on the keyboard.

Then hit stop

Then double click the green mid track and the piano roll should open up and show the notes you have played... From there you can build your beats.

If the window that comes up has a piano keyboard on the left side then you need to use the drum kit manager to set up a kit. This will change the look of the window to one that is easier to use for manually writing drum rhythms.

You could also just play along with the metronome playing say: kick and snare... Go back to the beginning hit record again then play cymbals... continue repeating this until your song is done.

Other cool things you could try is to use quantize after you have recorded somehting. This will put all the hits right on the beat..

Groove quantize can make it sound a bit more human.

A lot of ways to skin the cat. You can hear a very rough drum beat used during composition here: http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=2999&alid=653 The track with the dr-008 is Daytime Dream (go easy on me, the song is still being composed.)

Note that DR-008 can be used with wav samples of acoustic drums, like a sampler. This is how I use it.

Regarding your $49 upgrade it really only includes more sounds and loops. My personal feeling is that there are enough free sounds out there in the form of wav samples. I also do not like using other peoples loops so the upgrade did not make sense to me.

Hope this helps.

If you have other questions, let me know. Happy to help.

Jim
 
mishappen said:
I
Also it says there is an upgrade for $49.. Does anyone know what the upgrade can do, that what I have already, can't do?

My dr8 came with Sonar XL 2.2

Thanks

ditsy in denver
Click to expand...

Yeah, what jdier said. The Sonar version of DR-008 has 99% of the functionality of the retail. Your $49 will get you some bug fixes, .sf2 support and the free kits. I have not upgraded myself, but I understand that it is several gigabytes worth of drum samples, which may be worth considering.
 
You only need to arm the midi track to record.


Arming the audio track will only fill your hard drive with blank nothingness, wasting space, I'm pretty sure. Regardless, you only need to arm the midi track to record it.
 
It seems to me that the main question he wanted to know is how to make it show up on an audio track only...i.e., how to bounce to a track?

Insert dxi--dr-008. Leave parameters as is, and click okay.

Then, in the midi track named DR-008, you use the dr-008 in the drop down menu as your out. Set up all your parameters, i.e. patches and all that...is this correct guys? I have never used my dr-008. But, dxi is a dxi. Then, in audio track, make your dr-008 the in on your audio track. The out will be your normal out.

Now, when you record, you only need to arm the midi track. You won't see anything on your audio track...this is a way for you to hear it. If you want to bounce to its own audio track, solo these two tracks, midi and audio from dr-008 and make sure no tracks are selected (black). Go to edit, bounce to track...and you will bounce the sound from the midi/audio track combination of your dr-008 to a new track, which it asks you to specify. This saves disc ativity too, I think, in that you can disable and mute your original dxi tracks, or delete them if you know you're finished with them.

I may have left something out here, and maybe the dr-008 works differently than, say, LiveSynth, but I am guessing this is pretty accurate, though off the top of my head. If it isn't what you really wanted to know, and I wasted my breath, sorry everyone!!!!

Thanks,
Kirstin
 
Hey it worked!! I loaded dr8 into the synth rack, and it made an audio track and a midi track. I armed the midi track opened the dr8 from the synth rack, pushed record and...wahla. (I thought I did that last time but it didn't work.

Thank you.

I also tried it with fruityloops dxi (exactly the same way,... as kgirl suggested). Just fiddled with a few settings, added some beats, basically got a loop going of some sounds. Then went back into sonar, pushed record, but nothing recorded onto the midi track. I could here the loop playing but nothing recorded???

As far as arming the audio track, I don't even have that option. The"R" is greyed out. What is the purpose of the Audiotrack that the synth rack creates? Is it so you can hear what you are doing?

Can you use the dr8 in different ways? Like create a drum map in sonar and send it through the dr8? As well as recording from the dr8?

The way I have done my drums in the past is map them in fruity loops. This sounded pretty good, but was very time consuming. I've read that dr8 makes it much simpler. But without something to listen to to keep the beat, I think it would be hard to get the groove I want. Do you guys put down a click track first, or a guitar part just to get started? How does that work?

Sorry for so many questions. I SEEMS that the drums are the fist thing that should be recorded, and I'm just trying to figure an easier way.

Thank you so much for your input!

dana
 
Dana,

I think this may actually be something with Fruity Loops/Sonar instead...but I could be wrong. I've heard some other issues with FL before.

You won't arm the audio track if you do it this way. The audio and midi track become linked together when you have routed the ports between them. If that makes any sense. You will only see audio in the audio window after you bounce the two to a separate track, and then you wouldn't need the midi tracks technically any more. I had to try that several times for it to work as well...it doesn't like you having the wrong clip selected at all, or it will tell you no audio to mixdown. Maybe you've experienced this.

You should be able to make a drum map by using the drum map manager. Your midi notes are all numbers, 0-127. So, if you know the notes of the dr-008 pads (like I said I haven't used it really, but it is possible they'll have the numbers already on the pad) and if you know how to do the drum map soooorrrrryyy. I really don't much but just started messing with them the other day. They're pretty cool.

So, you'll make a new map, then start inputting the in and out notes, which will generally be the same unless you need to do something interesting. Then, you can click on ports for in and out, and here you will route it to your dxi (DR-009). Keep making new drum sounds, naming and numbering each one with the corresponding midi note. Select proper routes for each note as just done with the first one.

At the bottom window, also, your midi devices will appear, and then you can select your patch/bank info there. But, it should already (I think) be the same information as what the dr-008 is set to use. Here's where my knowledge fails, cause of the dr-008 itself.

Then in the midi track for your dr-008, you can change the out on that track to a midi map that you created. Your drum map, I mean. Then, if you go to the piano roll...you'll see only those names of those drums you just made. Program away, and make your loops. So, you're still playing your dr-008, you're just adding a middle man, I suppose.I made my first percussive loop the other day. I hadn't been using any of this stuff at all, and so I decided to try it. I also played around with groove clips as it had chopped up my clip pretty well.

Fun stuff!

Hope this helps a bit. I can't guarantee a few tweaks won't be necessary to my thoughts here, but I'm trying to help!:D
-Kirstin
 
Apparently too, you can set a dxi inside an audio track as an fx. You could try that too...I've never done that, but I'm sure I'll be playing with it.

That fruity loops thing...you may only be able to trigger that from within sonar...are you doing that, or setting up the parameters in Fruity Loops and then pressing play on fruity loops, and record on sonar? I'm not sure they've made that work properly. I bet if you did a drum map of Fruity in Sonar it might work. though, I'm really opening my mouth on a subject that I have ABSOLUTELY NO KNOWLEDGE on. I shouldn't do that...because it's basically making assumptions. I just remember reading something regarding Fruity Loops and frustration of this same type.

Now, I wanted to ask the other guys, if they are still coming here, why would we set up dr-008 as an fx in an audio track instead of inserting a dxi and having a midi and audio track each for the dr-008? I'm sure there is a compelling reason, but I'm always searching to find them myself. Can someone throw me a bone? It could be that there are just two ways to do the same thing, but they seem inherently different, and I am wondering why a person would choose one before the other.

Any insights? I am looking for shortcuts too!
Thanks guys,
kirstin
 
Oh, and use your drum map to make a quick click track. Just program one bar, and use groove clips to make it long, or copy and paste the midi track a bunch of times. I like the groove clip plan, cause then I can use the same track for my actual drums and get the click off of it.

-Kirstin
 
Sorry I'm posting so much...I really identify with you here, and I'm totally late to work, but...oh well.

I personally am now trying to do it all this way. Put a basic click down. Play as you think you will. go BACK to the drums, and it becomes easier to program something that fits the style. Then, re-play/re-program as necessary. then, when you get the final drum track down, the instruments will be happy playing to the rhythm tracks.

I am learning that I need to devise a plan, or I feel overwhelmed with "what now?" Keeps me from looking too far ahead too, where I can SEE that I don't know what to do!

Yes, I think the audio part of the dxi synth is just so you can hear it. But, it's cool, cause you can apply effects to that audio track, and hear it on your midi track. So, if you don't like the sound of that kick, add the compression straight in.

I have also heard that the dr-008 can send each note to a different track, I don't know if that's what I really heard, but I think so, and I'd like that functionality. In LiveSynth Pro, which I use more, I can't do that withougt a cal script.

Okay, I HAVE to go.
Kirstin
 
mishappen said:

The way I have done my drums in the past is map them in fruity loops. This sounded pretty good, but was very time consuming. I've read that dr8 makes it much simpler. But without something to listen to to keep the beat, I think it would be hard to get the groove I want. Do you guys put down a click track first, or a guitar part just to get started? How does that work?

dana
Click to expand...

Glad to hear you are up and running. Yes, the R on the audio track is greyed out. I was wrong on that post.

As a former Fruity Loops addict I can tell you that once you get the DRUM MAPS set up for DR-008 you will feel right at home. The DRUM MAP MANAGER lets you name all of the pads and changes the note bars to triangles. It makes it much more intuitive. You can loop from the this drum screen and then add/delete notes as the pattern repeats. When composing this way, check out the function for the pointer which I think is called AUTO ERASE. This allows you to change from ADD, to ERASE, to MOVE, to VELOCITY by only using the mouse, not requiring you to use hotkeys or menu picks to change from one function to another.

(bear in mind I am writing rock music where the midi drums will eventually be deleted and replaced with live recorded drums...) When composing I work one of two ways:

1. Click track -> Guitar -> Drum Pattern

Here I will make a click track. One measure of quarter note snare rim hits, then copy paste 100 - 200 measures.. This is now my click and I play guitar over it. Once I have a scratch guitar, I shit can the click and begin writing the drum part.

2. Drum Pattern -> guitar -> Drum Pattern.

Here I start with a somewhat simple drum beat (which I will usually repeat over and over using the LOOP function) I play along and customize the beat until it sounds pretty close to what I want, then I copy paste it then lay down the guitars.

So, my suggestion to you is to create two new files. both have drum maps set up, one has 200 measures of 1/4 note click track and the other has 200 measures of a simple 4/4 drum beat. Save them off in a special folder and when inspiration strikes, open up the appropriate one and you are recording guitar!

This has worked pretty well for me thus far.

(In my next steps, I usually mute the midi drums, bring back a click, then let our drummer play along as we track the live drums.)

Hope this helps.
 
Thanks for the info Kirsten and jdier. I have defenetly got direction.

I didn't understand alot of your post kirstin. Probably because I don't understand the Drum Map Manager very well. And midi to boot. And probably because I just got done with long day at work.. I don't know how some of these guys have thousands of posts, work and do music??

It sounds like what you are saying jdier is that you can make basic beats and save them to file. And when you need them in a song you can bring them up, tweak them and then do a "save as" type of thing
Very Cool.

I will post again when I have time to reread your posts, and put them into practice.

dana
 
dana

You probably didn't understand me because I'm an incessant babbler. I never know how to get to a point.

I have a chart I can send you with all the numbers for each midi note, if you like. Then, all you need to do in the drum map manager is name the drums you'll be using, and giving it a corresponding note number...which is the note that the particular drum is played on. All the drum map does is make it easy to see the name of each drum so that you aren't looking at a bunch of piano notes. Plus, you can draw in your velocity for each note and edit individual hits, pretty much any way you'd like.

How did you use a drum map for Fruity? If you made one for Fruity Loops, you've already done this probably.

If you want me to tell you anymore, just pm me. I may not be explaining it properly anyway, so maybe someone else would better cover it. The fact is, as I said, I just learned the drum map manager the OTHER DAY. So, if I can do it, you can do it. It's basically like making a spreadsheet program, or editing one anyway. It doesn't do anything other than make the programming easier, and if you mess around with it, you'll get it.

Let me know how you fared out though. I'm interested to see how the dr-008 works for you.

Thanks,
Kirstin
 
Does anybody have a Sonar DrumMap for the Drumkit from Hell?
 
Did you try the dr-008 forums? I was there the other day, and there very well may be someone who did that.

-Kirstin
 
scratch that...I'm not sure where the hell I was yesterday. It all runs together.

I'll keep a look out for you though. If I find one online, I'll pm you.
-Kirstin
 
kgirl please do send me that chart.

Since I am totally new to midi what, in the manual, would be the best reading. It seems that everything is kind of intertwined. ie.. midi, dxi, drum map. I'm currently reading up on the drum map manager.

In fruity loops the way I originally did my drum was just map them out manually (no midi). When I was finished with that I would mute all but one sound and export to wave. I did this until my whole kit was exported to seperate files. And then simply inserted each wave into a seperate audio track. I thought it was very nice to be able to tweak each piece to liking.

I assume that once you get your midi drums finished you can also export them to individual tracks.


dana
 
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