Do egg cartons really work ?

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1grizzly000000

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I don't have any money until my album drops so i need a cheap form of sound proofing for a wooden box that I have created. If I line it with egg cartons will that be good enough for my own listening pleasure? I don't want to take the time to build it if it doesn't make a difference. Thanks. Psycho Logistics.
 
The answer is NO!
check out the Studio Building and Display forum.

Cheers
john :)
 
Do you have 20 bucks

1grizzly000000

Do yourself a big favor and spend the $40 that your were going to spend on egg cartons and get 2 sheets of acoustical foam from Markertek.com.

Here's a link for some foam that I got for my booth at home. This stuff, I can definetly say, really works in decreasing or eliminating room reflections.

http://www.markertek.com/MTStore/product.CFM?BaseItem=MF-3

They are 54" x 54" sheets for $19.99. Wonderful stuff! Not a salesman, no kickbacks on referrals, just a happy customer!

Rev E
 
Hey, he said he's broke, didn't he? ;)
Try the grocery store for apple boxes--at the bottom is a nice foamy egg carton type unit that works pretty good in a pinch...at least better than the hard-surfaced egg cartons...
Also recycling centers have been known to have large quanitiies of that waffle foam stuff that is used for packing, etc.
 
Tonewoods,

I agree with you to a degree. "Broke" may mean different things to different people. $40 is really not THat much to save up, even if it takes a month or so. Sure there are a lot of makeshift ways to cut out room reflections, but in the final analysis, those same people who fudged with a homemade solution come back and tell of the large amount of time that they wasted to track down this "free" or cheap substitute OR that their recording sounds hollow or..... If the music is worth enough to put out the least one should do is put their best foot forward (recording, engineering, performing, etc).

Many of the homemade substitutes absorb frequencies at dramatically unequal levels, leaving a boomy, but apparently dry room. Heck, even ACoustical foam doesn't absorb all frequencies equally.... but it's more uniform than foam bedding or egg shells and probably sounds better with effects. I'm not speaking from the point of view of a rich kid, who had nothing better to do that to spend Daddy's money. I have in the recent past gone the cheapie route and put up blankets and other stuff to record vocals. And while the results were acceptable, they still could have been done better. AND what I have found is that in the end, I still spent about the same (for extra materials, backing, etc) as it would have cost me if I had just bought a couple large sheets of acoustical foam! Go figure.

The Markertek foam that I recommended is $20 a sheet (approx. 5 feet by 5 feet - 54"x54"). That's a huge bargain and would probably add up to the money, time or trouble that it would take to go the homemade route. JMHO. So I still say save a buck or two a day, cut out something (coffee, fast food, sodas etc) and get some inexpensive, but good foam from Markertek or somebody similar. That's the best price that I've seen in all of my catalogs or on the net.

Rev E
 
be careful...

acoustic foam, egg cartons, carpet, and so on... all only handle, at best, frequencies above ~500 HZ. they don't touch < 300hz. you can't just use a single treatment. you have to use a combination of treatments. unfortunately, for those who don't have much to spend, commercial products are not the way to go. you can build your own and get a much wider BW and coverage. but, if you don't or can't build your own, to get this right, it's going to cost you a bit.

IMHO, without a better fundamental understanding of room acoustics (e.g. Low, Mid, Hi Frequency, Room Modes, Mode Stacking, ...) you're wasting your money with any purchase.

if you want to maximize your purchase and minimize your dollar outlay, get the book "The Master Handbook of Acoustics" and read it, over and over, before you do anything.

-kp-
 
I once tried an entire wall of empty 1-gallon LDPE Arrowhead water bottles stacked with the conical end facing away from the wall. Amazingly unreflective. It took about 500 of 'em!
My DCM Time Windows sounded great in front of that wall.
 
Hey Rev E...

Rev E - What do those acoustical foam sheets look like from Markertek? Are they smooth or do they have the "egg-carton look"? I'm considering those to cover the walls in my very small studio. Thanks!!!
 
ive recorded in rooms, and they contained windows and whatever. beds, bookcases filled with books. not all up against the wall. and i have to say the room sound is great. you cant even REALLY hear it, its just kinda there. almost like a slight reverb tail, but not reverby, just a little it of sound. hmmm... but i guess some people want super sterile.
 
I recorded vocals at the end of my hallway. There was a thin mattress (approx. 3") proped up against the wall that I was singing towards. Behind me was the rest of the hallway and my kitchen. It sounded good I thought. There was a little of that thing Krisian was speaking of, but not as much as the bedroom I was in to begin with. I Gerry rig it, read my name, look at my german face, I Gerry Rig it.
~james
 
I use that egg carton looking foam that goes on a bed. They're cheap and you can cut them with a carpenters knife. Deadens the sound pretty good.
 
Dead Ringer

The egg cartons will definitly deaden, or take the ring out of your room. But "WILL NOT" soundproof. They might muffle it a little, but not enough to matter. Believe me I've tried it. A whole friggin' room ceiling and all covered with the things. I used about 500-600 of them about 12"X12" a peice. Although they really tamed the room. If you've got some nice reverb effects, a dead room is alot easier to control. Out of curiosity I recorded the band I was in at the time, practicing with two mics and a technics stereo cassette unit from my stereo system. Funny as it may seem, We were quite impressed with the quality of the recording. thanks to the egg cartons.
Good Luck, T.
 
grizzly,

First off, you talk about sound proofing your room and then you talk about listening in this room. Egg cartons won't sound proof shit. Plain and simple. Acoustic treatment is another matter entirely. In short egg cartons will change the listening characteristics of any room. It might not give you what you want, but it will help deaden the room. This is a topic of great disagreement. None of the other replies are right or wrong, but they don't really matter that much. I am sure a lot of people will disagree with me on this, but they would have to be purists and that is not the real world. Room acoustics does matter if you're trying to get a particular sound, but overall, not as much as the equipment you're using and the engineering. It's amazing what a little eq and some well put fx's (reverb, echo, compression, etc.) will do. The suggestion about recording in the hall with a mattress is great. If you want to deaden the sound, use a mattress, pillows, or blankets (you get the point). If you want a bright sound, record towards a window, a flat hard surface, or put a mirror in front of what ever it is you're recording. All this frequency stuff is easily taken care of with eq. You never mentioned anything about recording in this room (box) anyway. You just asked about your lisenting pleasure. For that, you would have to be more specific about what is already in this room, i.e., carpet, furniture, drapes, windows, etc. and what kond of equipment you're using. Anyway, whatever you're doing in this room, whether you're just lisenting to music or recording or both, your equipment is still more important than the acoustic treatment.

Boardman
 
boardman said:
...It's amazing what a little eq and some well put fx's (reverb, echo, compression, etc.) will do...

...All this frequency stuff is easily taken care of with eq...
Click to expand...

Oh my god, that is wrong on SO many levels... that's about as useful as using a spectrum analyzer to "read" your monitor's response and use an EQ to "flatten" it.... (it won't work!)

Using EQ to "fix" room frequency response anomalies will do much more harm than good, by introducing all sorts of phase issues as your boost (or to some degree, cut) certain frequencies.

And the VERY LAST THING you want to be doing is muddying up a bad room sound even more by applying another reverb on top of it - especially if it happens to be of the $200 or so variety!!!!!!

As far as equipment mattering more than the room - top-level monitors (say, for example Meyer HD-1s!) in a good room will sound amazing, but in a bad room they will sound like crap! Room acoustics matter FAR MORE than you seem to think - and it's not only purists! (I'm definitely not of the "purist" variety.......) There's more to the room sound than you are aware of - maybe John Sayers can give you some lessons (or buy his book!)

You were right about one thing though - people disagreeing with ya!!! ;)

Bruce
 
You Tell'em B ! There sure is alot i'd like know about Frequencies,Phase issues, Etc. Does john's book talk about these subjects ? What's the book called ?
T.J.Hooker
 
bvaleria,

Chill out. I can see you don't agree and that's cool. But if you're going to quote me, please don't do it out of context. If you read what I said very carefully, you might understand what I was trying to point out. You use examples that have no bearing on what I said at all and trashing me for my comments sure as hell doesn't help anyone but your own ego. I don't need to buy a book, I've been recording for over 20 years and have done just fine without your help, thank you. I do know a few things. I know that the equipment you use (not just monitors) is far more important than the room you record in. That is a fact plain and simple and If you think that's wrong then I would suggest you buy the book. Anyway, this isn't a pissing contest, just different ideas and as I said, grizzly never said he was recording in this room anyway.

So sorry to step on your turf.

[Edited by boardman on 01-23-2001 at 02:23]
 
boardman said:
bvaleria,

Chill out. I can see you don't agree and that's cool. But if you're going to quote me, please don't do it out of context. If you read what I said very carefully, you might understand what I was trying to point out. You use examples that have no bearing on what I said at all and trashing me for my comments sure as hell doesn't help anyone but your own ego. I don't need to buy a book, I've been recording for over 20 years and have done just fine without your help, thank you. I do know a few things. I know that the equipment you use (not just monitors) is far more important than the room you record in. That is a fact plain and simple and If you think that's wrong then I would suggest you buy the book. Anyway, this isn't a pissing contest, just different ideas and as I said, grizzly never said he was recording in this room anyway.

So sorry to step on your turf.

[Edited by boardman on 01-23-2001 at 02:23]
Click to expand...

Hey, I'm chillin' fine thanks........ :D

You're right, this isn't a pissing contest, but with 20 years experience, how can you say that you can fix it with a little EQ, reverb, effects??? Get the sound right going to tape the first time.... much cleaner...

I'm not trashing you at all, just calling you on some of your comments (you already knew you were being a-typical otherwise you wouldn't have made a comment about people disagreeing with you!) So if you're going to throw something out there, you can expect some dialog on it, especially from the engineer types that frequent here.

BTW, you're new here, so you may not have read my other posts -- if you had you would see that I'm not here to feed my ego at all. I'll tell it like my own not-unsubstantial experience says it, and if you find I'M wrong, you can call me on it - but then, expect to back yourself up if you want to convince me!

Peace...
Bruce

PS - there is no "turf" here - this isn't gangland (except in the Dragon Cave).....
 
I don't know why some of you guys can't see the common sense in what Boardman is saying. Sure, room acoustics certainly do make a difference, but only if you have a huge amount of amazing gear. if you are only recording on a cassette 4 track (or whatever) you have tape noise, poor preamps, lack of inserts or effect sends and the like to contend with first. Also, if you don't how to use your equipment or you are just a poor engineer room acoustics won't give you a good sound. If the performance of the musicians stinks acoustics won't help either. I have heard (and I'm sure you have too) "home" recordings that blow away "professional" studio projects. So basicly there are so many other factors like equipment, experience of the engineer, and performance of the musicians to take into consideration BEFORE spending alot of money and time on room treatments.
 
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