Digitizing old cassettes

  • Thread starter Thread starter lisag
  • Start date Start date
L

lisag

New member
I'm looking to digitise old mix tapes from days gone by... ideally I'd like to get it on my computer in a lossless format. I know the sound has already degraded but I'm after the clearest possible reproduction of my ancient cassette tapes! I no longer own a working tape deck.

What's the easiest and cheapest option to achieve this? Apologies in advance if this is a dumb question - I'm a newbie here! :)
 
If they're perfectly normal stereo tapes at 1.75 IPS, there are actually USB cassette decks out there now for people who want to do just that. ION make one and there are probably many more. I've never used one and I have no idea how gentle they are on the tapes. Or whether they support Dolby B noise reduction. But that's one option.

The other is to try and get a reasonably nice cassette deck on ebay or something, and a sound card or USB audio interface. In my experience onboard sound systems are terrible and you'll get the sound of the processor and the USB bus splattered all over the recording.

If your tapes are something more exotic like TASCAM 4 or 8 channel multitracks, then you'd have to get a compatible cassette deck and go through a multi-input soundcard. But they're probably just stereo tapes.
 
lisag said:
I know the sound has already degraded
Click to expand...

I work professionally in digitising cassettes and reel to reel tapes to archival standards. I'm curious to know how you know the sound on your recordings has already degraded.

Regards Tim
 
I think I'd rather use a quality deck and interface than a USB player, but that's just my personal bias.

Probably the most overlooked variable when transferring cassettes (and other analog tapes) is head azimuth. Adjusting that can get signal off the tape that can't be recovered otherwise. Aligning the head to be "correct" is not as good as aligning it to the actual recording.
 
bouldersoundguy said:
I think I'd rather use a quality deck and interface than a USB player, but that's just my personal bias.

Probably the most overlooked variable when transferring cassettes (and other analog tapes) is head azimuth. Adjusting that can get signal off the tape that can't be recovered otherwise. Aligning the head to be "correct" is not as good as aligning it to the actual recording.
Click to expand...

totally agree with you on this !!:thumbs up:
 
I've done exactly the same thing with the "Awesome Mix Tape #23" :thumbs up:

I bought a second hand Denon cassette deck and I have the M-Audio Delta 66. The cost is likely about 2x the cost of the Ion cassette to mp3 machine.

The Delta cards are relatively inexpensive with the analog I/O separate from the card. I am skeptical of an all in one solution using the USB port for the reasons mentioned above. I think you'll get better quality conversion and less chance of bus noise/interference. I use Audacity to record to a single wav file and wavbreaker to cut it up into individual songs. (This is on a Linux box, there should be Windows solutions as well.)

Finally, burn the compilation to a pair of CDs. Assuming a 90 minute cassette and an 80 minute CD, it was easier to make two 45 minute CDs. I also converted the mix tape to mp3 as well.
 
Wow, I need glasses...
I thought the subject line read "disgusting old cassettes" :facepalm: Was waiting to see some slimy, gross white cassette tape!
 
WhinyLittleRunt said:
Wow, I need glasses...
I thought the subject line read "disgusting old cassettes" :facepalm: Was waiting to see some slimy, gross white cassette tape!
Click to expand...

I've heard worse descriptions* of some of the stuff I recorded back in the 80s, on recycled cassettes. You could use a pencil eraser to get the ink off them, and then a sharpie to write on them. They do have 30 years of dust and hand grease on them.

*I prefer the moniker 'experimental music' however.
 
Blue Jinn said:
*I prefer the moniker 'experimental music' however.
Click to expand...

Does this mean you wouldn't buy it now?

imo you'll get better qaulity with an interface and secondhand deck too. Just my two pence.
But as blue says its going to cost you more. Old decks are ten a penny on ebay or maybe a family member or friend has one they havent used in a while. Consult your aunts and uncles older brothers etc
 
jpmorris said:
Frankly I agree, but the USB thing is likely to be the 'easiest and cheapest'...
Click to expand...

I don't know how much easier it could possibly be than a cassette deck into an interface. And what do you give up? Do USB cassette decks have all the NR options (Dolby B, C, S) and provision for adjusting level and balance on the way in? Do they have decent converters with the sample rate and word length I like to use?
 
bouldersoundguy said:
I don't know how much easier it could possibly be than a cassette deck into an interface. And what do you give up? Do USB cassette decks have all the NR options (Dolby B, C, S) and provision for adjusting level and balance on the way in? Do they have decent converters with the sample rate and word length I like to use?
Click to expand...

To be fair, I mentioned noise reduction straight up, and warned that they might not be very good. But I do think you're looking at this the wrong way.

Yes, you could get fantastic results from a fully-serviced Nakamichi deck, an $800 sound card and a top-of-the-line equalizer stuck between the two, and tuning the azimuth by ear for each tape. But that's not really what the poster is looking for and I couldn't recommend it for someone who just wants to digitize a handful of cassettes cheaply and easily and may not necessarily know how to go about it (otherwise, why ask, right?).
For that scenario, a USB deck might be worth considering and in any case they're probably some of the only cassette decks being built new right now.

On the other hand, someone who wants to get the best results possible regardless of the cost? Avoid the USB decks like the plague and look for a Nakamichi or something in good condition and get it services. Get a dedicated converter rack and use an optical link to the computer to avoid sending bus noise into the converters. But that's not a solution I could happily recommend for someone who, again, may not be quite sure what they're doing (no offence to the original poster intended).

It's all about choosing the right tool for the job.
 
jpmorris said:
To be fair, I mentioned noise reduction straight up, and warned that they might not be very good. But I do think you're looking at this the wrong way.

Yes, you could get fantastic results from a fully-serviced Nakamichi deck, an $800 sound card and a top-of-the-line equalizer stuck between the two, and tuning the azimuth by ear for each tape. But that's not really what the poster is looking for and I couldn't recommend it for someone who just wants to digitize a handful of cassettes cheaply and easily and may not necessarily know how to go about it (otherwise, why ask, right?).
For that scenario, a USB deck might be worth considering and in any case they're probably some of the only cassette decks being built new right now.

On the other hand, someone who wants to get the best results possible regardless of the cost? Avoid the USB decks like the plague and look for a Nakamichi or something in good condition and get it services. Get a dedicated converter rack and use an optical link to the computer to avoid sending bus noise into the converters. But that's not a solution I could happily recommend for someone who, again, may not be quite sure what they're doing (no offence to the original poster intended).

It's all about choosing the right tool for the job.
Click to expand...

Well said JP!!:D
 
At the risk of talking for the OP, I think OP wanted the 'best quality' at a reasonable cost. A second hand deck and a good sound card like the M-Audio's seems a fair compromise, better quality than the straight to mp3 via usb solution, at a slightly higher cost. Also, if the original tapes were encoded w/ Dolby, it looks like that would be necessary, as I didn't see Dolby on the aforementioned cassette--usb. (I may be wrong on that.)
 
jpmorris said:
Yes, you could get fantastic results from a fully-serviced Nakamichi deck, an $800 sound card and a top-of-the-line equalizer stuck between the two, and tuning the azimuth by ear for each tape. But that's not really what the poster is looking for and I couldn't recommend it for someone who just wants to digitize a handful of cassettes cheaply and easily and may not necessarily know how to go about it (otherwise, why ask, right?).
Click to expand...

Okay, lets not go hyperbolic here. I'm using my MobilePre and a good used Sony S deck from the flea market that cost me $30.31 with tax (I have the receipt) and getting great results. There is very little room left for improvement so no need for a rebuilt Nakamichi Dragon or $800 interface. The cost is only a little more, it's not any harder to do and the results are way better than what I'd get with an all-in-one solution.

The ION Tape Express is clearly a cheap product with limited potential for decent sound that's not meant for people interested in quality. The Tape 2 model looks better but only has a generic "Noise Reduction" option that can't possibly do justice to any real collection of tapes. Both appear, based on features and pricing, to be aimed at people who value convenience over quality, not someone who wants "the clearest possible reproduction" into a "lossless format", to quote the OP.

Adjusting azimuth takes a little knowledge, a good ear and less than a minute per tape. It is low effort and makes a big difference.
 
Popping back in here to clarify a few things! Yes, Blue Jim is right and I'm looking for best quality at reasonable cost. I'm looking to preserve the memories of my youth reasonably well. I've been taking a look at the USB Ion converters but wasn't sure if they were really going to give me decent results?? The comments here have been very useful, I can really see there's a range of options depending on my determination and budget! :D

What I meant from the sound degrading is that the original cassettes themselves were played and recorded over and over again. The sound quality is more from overuse than from time, I think.
 
lisag said:
Popping back in here to clarify a few things! Yes, Blue Jim is right and I'm looking for best quality at reasonable cost. I'm looking to preserve the memories of my youth reasonably well. I've been taking a look at the USB Ion converters but wasn't sure if they were really going to give me decent results??
Click to expand...

I'd be a little leery of them. In retrospect I should clearly have listed them as the second option in my list, but omitting them entirely would have been intellectually dishonest.

I'm not a great user of cassettes myself so I'll leave that to others. However, I'd consider the TASCAM 112 as a starting point. It should have a solid transport and it handles both Dolby B and C. I rather doubt your tapes have S or SR or DBX reduction.

Soundcard wise, if your machine is a desktop, consider the Asus D2X soundcard. I believe the X is PCI-E and the D2 is PCI. They're rather nice, high-end consumer cards and should do the trick nicely for what you're doing. They are shielded against RF inside the machine and they use reasonably high-end components rather than the cheapest they can get. I use the D2X myself, though mostly as an optical transceiver for an external ADC/DAC unit.

For laptops, you'll need a USB audio interface and I'm not really up on those. All the ones I've used have failed internally and let the USB bus noise into the recordings, but perhaps I didn't pay enough.
 
Yeah, avoid USB for recording, cassette or otherwise. PCI-E and the older PCI are leaps ahead of USB... and Firewire for that matter. JP, I don't think it matters how much you pay. Your experience is pretty typical of USB as far as performance with the noise problems.

For cassette, I like the Tascam 112 MKII. Also take a look at the 102 MKII. Too many good models to name really.

Also don't forget a stand-alone CD burner as an option. My Tascam 102 MKII cassette to HHB CDR-850 CD recorder is hard to beat for good sound and ease of use. It won't be cheap if you don't have anything yet, including a cassette deck, but you might get lucky and find a used deck and a burner for cheap.
 
Just digitizing the audio is only half the job. The chances of ending up with a file you'll find listenable without some more work are slim. That's why I digitize to 24 bit and spend some time editing and mastering the files into a listenable product.

A USB interface lets you keep the deck and analog connections well away from the bulk of the computer generated noise. Some laptops do have issues with grounding that causes noise problems with USB interfaces.
 
Thanks for all the great suggestions everyone! I'm off to compare all my options now... hopefully I can find a solution that won't break the bank!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top