Construction Question

[Michael Jones]

So, I finally got my trusses up and my roof on.
The trusses are a scissors truss which gives a "vaulted" type of ceiling.

Extending the walls up to the trusses wouldn't be such a big deal IF the walls were paralell, but of course they're not. So what ends up happening, geometrically, is you have this constantly varying pitch as the wall goes across the ceiling at an angle.

So, what's the best way to frame that?
I was thinking of just using a plumb bob at each end of the wall segment, to find its place on the ceiling. But if the wall end falls between trusses, then you have no place, except a plain in space to measure from.

So, how best to overcome this?
I could finish out the ceiling and THEN extend the walls. Probably not the BEST idea, because ceiling would be contiguous, and most likely not aid in isolation from room to room.

Or, I could put up a piece of "temporary" ceiling; you know, tack up a piece of OSB to have a soild plain from which to measure, frame up the extention (allowing for the OSB thickness) and place that whole extention up there, then sheetrock as normal.

What do you guys think?

 

[Doug Quance]

can you post a few pictures?

 

[Michael Jones]

Yeah. I can!
Getting the roof on was a MAJOR milestone in construction. I was planning on documenting the construction to date on John's site, so I'm going to e-mail him a zip file of all the pics I have; sometime today.
It may be a few days before he gets them posted.

But, I'll run out and take a pic this afternoon, to show you what I mean.

 

[Doug Quance]

Cool... I'll take a look at them tonight when I get home.

There is something to that saying "a picture's worth a thousand words"...

 

[Michael Jones]

Cool... I'll take a look at them tonight when I get home.

There is something to that saying "a picture's worth a thousand words"...

Yeah, I know. Sorry. It's obvious in my mind's eye, but I've been dealing with this for weeks.
I'll post a pic or 2 later today.

 

[John Sayers]

Cool Michael send me the pics, but I don't need the pics to know the problem you face. Are you putting the ceiling on RC to the trusses?? I'd put the ceilin up first and then meet it with the walls. Unless you are doing a second ceiling there's no other way around it. You can make a saw cut along the line of the wall once it's up to separate the plaster maybe.

Welcome to the wonderful world of anglular construction

cheers
john

 

[OzNimbus]

Welcome to the wonderful world of anglular construction

cheers
john

We're going thru that nightmare at my place right now


-0z-

 

[MikeA]

Michael,

Is what you are experiencing close to what is pictured in Update 1 of Sonar Studios out at John's Studios under construction site? The 5th & 6th pictures down are what I am talking about. He did his ceiling first in that situation. And look at it this way. If you do the ceilings first the hard part is over and done with! Good luck with it.

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hello Michael, just now had time to read this post. Wow, I thought about this way back when you posted pics of the truss. Having never done it personally, I'm not qualified to say much, but, if I had to build it myself, I would build standard 8' wall(or 10' whaterver matches your exterior wall height, and fill in with a wall extention to the ceiling, instead of trying to build the complete wall on the floor, and raising it. At least, once the angled walls are in place, you can lay a 2x4 like a straight edge, against the face of the wall, up to the ceiling, like a plumbline. Once you mark it at both ends, you can then go ahead and nail a plate(2X6) to the ceiling. Run plumb lines from the studs, up to the ceiling plate, Then measure each extension stud,(you'll have to have an ajustable square, to match the cheek and bevel cuts at the plate. Once you have one cut, all the others should be the same. Except for length. Angles don't change. DON'T cut them to length untill you have the angle cuts done. Then you can place each one up against the face of the wall(they will still be longer than the opening where they will be), mark the length, and do your 90 degree cuts then. Well, this is all theoretical, but I've done some hip and valley stuff. Whoa! Interesting. Mind boggleing if you've never done it before, or have odd roof pitches. Well, my .02 Michael. Wish ya luck, and wish I could be there to see how you do it. I think this is the stuff that no one thinks about when they are laying out angled walls and ceilings. Till you have to cut.
I watch the guys in the mill build huge valances(6'widths) 40' long(with loose joints), and the bottom return has a 12" radius(curved bottom edge). Add the fact that its covered in gloss laminates, compound miters become the nightmares of legend. But THEN add angled walls, where, when you install, you have to custom cope the joints to match in the field, were talking insanity. Especially when you consider, one section weighs a whopping 400 pounds, and you have to position it before cutting the joints, you soon realize why installers make so much MONEY I have been there. Holy moly, commercial millworkers have to KNOW THIER STUFF! I've seen em build custom jigs for routing stuff in the field to match existing conditions, and the jigs themselves took 2 guys to position and clamp. Makes for nervewracking stress. Only one chance at some of this stuff, cause of the finish materials, and time constraints, not to mention a client who is the epitome of less than tolerant of any faults or deadline overuns. They kill you. Ha!
fitz

 

[Light]

How about a Water Level. Just a thought, if you are trying to find a level plane in midair.

Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Michael Jones]

John, thanks.
I kind of figured you'd know what I meant.
I need to adopt another mindset for studio construction; things don't always follow the "normal" sequence of construction.

Oz- I hear ya!

MikeA - I looked over those pics, and its similar, but not quite the same.

Rick - Yeah, I frame up the wall sections on the slab, then tilt them up in place. It's the extention to the ceiling I was curious about, see, an angled wall, extended to a pitched ceiling, will have a varying pitch, or at least a pitch that doesn't match the ceiling pitch. Not too difficult to construct, but if the wall ends fall between the trusses, then you have no solid plain to measure up to. But I think John pretty much answered that for me.
I'll put the finished ceiling up first, and use a plumb bob to find the point of the extended wall where it meets the ceiling.
Clear as mud now!

Light - Yeah water levels work pretty good; a little messy at times though. I think I'll just finish out the ceiling first.

Thanks, everyone, for your help!

Here's a pic, a "sneak preview" if you will.
This is looking at the drum room from the live room. The vocal booth is in the background, you can see its "window". (Which I need to lower.)