combining analog and protool multitracking

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I'm trying to set up a combination of an analog and a digital recording unit. I'd like to record drums and guitars on a 1" or a 2" 16track tapemachine for the fat sound but still be able to edit them digitally on a mac with protools (digi 001 Le expanded to 18 I/O) . I have a 32/8 mackie studio console.

Is it possible to sync the tape machine and the protools?
What if you record on tape first on tape and transfer the takes to your protools set up, do you still keep your analog sound?

Does anyone have experience in combining analog and digital multitracks? Thanx for helping me out.

grts,

David
 
The main way that I record is to track my basic tracks to my Tascam 38 1/2" 8-track, and then mix to stereo to my computer, and then add tracks to the stereo mix in N-track. I like the flexibility of this setup. It gives me the editing power of digital on tracks where I need it, and it gives me the tape sound on my basic tracks. Me likeee. I do lose a little flexibility when it comes time to mix down, but since I just do this with my own stuff, I can take all the time I need to tweak the original analog stereo mix and rerecord the digital tracks if need be. Usually, though, rather than having to rerecord the digital tracks, I can just edit them to make them work with the tweaked analog stereo mix. It's a time-consuming process, but well worth it to me. Especially since reel-to-reel multitracks are just so damn much fun to record with. The look of the reel spinning, the smell of analog tape, the faint sound of tape hiss... In other words, to paraphrase Charlton Heston, you can take my reel-to-reel when you pry it from my cold, dead hands.
 
PS...
I'm pretty sure that it's possible to sync ProTools and an analog multitrack. Most analog multitracks can sync to SMPTE time code, and I think ProTools uses Midi time code, and I know there are boxes out there that convert back and forth between SMPTE and Midi time codes. Also, I think there's a chance that ProTools can sync to SMPTE directly. I bet if you emailed digidesign they'd be able to tell you. Of course, you waste a track (or two) on the analog machine for the SMPTE stripe, but it may be well worth it for the editing capabilities you get in ProTools
 
If you are talking about the PTLE version then dont expect it to lock up well unless you are prepared to go out and buy some gear that will cost you more then the 001 itself.
You will have drifting between the two.

To Adat, a PTLE can sync about 5-6 min with a insignificant drift but it exsists. To Analog you are asking for trouble.

There are poor mans syncing ways were you can record a click on the tape on all tracks abd then line it up in PTLE but it's work and annoying.
 
Dump the tracks to ProTools. You wont lose any warmth(your gonna end up on CD eventually, right?) so it will end up digital sooner or later.

You will also save the extra wear on the heads and tape.
 
A short story:

1. Recorded all tracks exept the keyboards on Pro-tools/Mac in a studio.

2. Made rough mixes on five channels including a SMTPE track on an 8-channel analogue Fostex.

3. Went to our keyboarder, copied the tracks to his 16 channel analogue including the SMTPE.

4. He used the SMTPE to sync to his Atari.

5. He made the synths on the Atari through Midi, all the way synced with the analogue.

6. He recorded the synths on the 16-track getting audio tracks and also put some other keyboards without Midi in live to the recorder.

7. We took the 16-track to the Pro-tools studio and synced it to the Pro-tools system.

8. Recorded the tracks on the analogue to hard disk synced with SMTPE.

It was a lot of struggle to get it right, but it worked in the end. Not recommended!!!

Do like TexRoadkill suggests, after recording, put it to harddisk as soon as possible.

Hans :)
www.hagen.nu
 
In any of these situations it's best to go with your strengths. If you already had a sync system in place with great analog processing gear I would say wait till mixdown.

Since protools is most likely your best mixing and processing platform use that as early as possible.
 
expanding digi 001

Hey thanks for the tips.
I guess syncing a tape machine to protools might not be a great idea after all. I'm actually just beginning with my studio so I don't feel like getting too deep into this syncing hassle. But I'm still up for it ... later maybe...
I guess just importing the tape tracks into protools will do fine now.

something else,

I feel it's a bit of a shame that I have this really nice 32/8 mackie mixer with excellent warm equalising, but I will do most of the mixing, and equalising with the protools software. I can only return a maximum of 18 tracks to my mackie. So I won't be able to make a mix on the mackie for a 24 track song on protools. I don't know if the protools equalisation is satisfactory enough. I can get nice plugins of course. Or is it maybe better to do the whole mixing & processing in Protools so you can stay in the digital field?

Do you have experience with this kind of set up.?

Can anyone tell me what the best ADAT/ AD/DA converter is to expand the digi 001 with addtional ins and outs? I'm not to sure about the fostex VC-8? 20 bit? Tango from frontierdesign seems to be high quality. But it doesn't have a S/PDIF converter. Also most of these converter talk about PC soundcards. What about mac? Does it support mac soundcards?


thanks for helping me out.

David
 
Use the Mackie for live tracking and any mixing that requires outboard processors. You would just be adding a lot of uneccesary DAC if you go to the mackie and back into protools with everything for your mixdowns.

If you had a Neve that would be another story but the Mackie isnt going to sound BETTER than pro tools.

Digidesign has plenty of hardware for Mac protools if you can afford it.
 
Sorry I got to this topic kinda late but I couldn't help but to reply since I just got out of session doing the very same thing that you ask of.

The basic thing is to have a synch system set up so all of your machines can run off of one common time reference. For example whenever I lock a new reel of 2 inch tape in and get ready to record the first thing that happens is that channel 24 gets SMPTE time code recorded onto it (Starting at 01:00:00:00)

This time code on the 2 inch tape is the MAIN reference, this does 2 main jobs ....ONE.... drives the console automation system (Soundcraft DC 2020) ....TWO.... Gives a time reference to the MOTU 2408 so the hard disk system, the console automation and the analog system are playing / recording in perfect time right down to the frame.

When the tracking is done it is now possible to make 3 passes (8 tracks at a time through the MOTU) from the analog 2 inch to the hard disk recorder. After making all of the edits IN DIGITAL we can pass the tracks back onto our 2 inch analog tape (once again 8 at a time) and get ready to mix off of the 2 inch machine or send it away for mixing.

It is very possible to do analog to digital track transfers even with a home studio as long as you have the proper gear. Gear that can generate time code and read time code is a must.

Hope this has been of some help

Saunavation Audio Productions
 
I go with TexRoadkill again, and think about the auto mixing possabilities in Pro-tools, just write it in and sit listening rolling your thumbs...otherwise you will need a lot of hands doing a mix the way you want it, different all the time. If you're lucky you'll get a good one. Use the mixer as preamps and for monitoring to you and the musicians.

Hans,
www.hagen.nu
 
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