Clean Sinewave Synth Bass?

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flextone

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Hello

I want to achieve a nice and clean, low pure sine wave bass. Just a one oscillator sine wave. They seem to smudge too easily when low notes are played so that their tonality is unclear. What I do is use a simple sine wave from a monosynth (futureretro xs, dsi evolver or even software), into a mono channel in cubase, maybe add a compressor to make the attack a little more punchy and cut away everything below 40hz, that's it.

It never sounds as good as some recordings I know, not even close. How can I get it to sound clear in the lower note range? I know the problem is not my monitors as I hear these basses just fine on CD's all the time.

Help?
 
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flextone said:
I want to achieve a nice and clean, low pure sine wave bass. Just a one oscillator sine wave. They seem to smudge too easily when low notes are played so that their tonality is unclear. What I do is use a simple sine wave from a monosynth (futureretro xs, dsi evolver or even software), into a mono channel in cubase, maybe add a compressor to make the attack a little more punchy and cut away everything below 40hz, that's it.
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I'm not sure just what you're trying to accomplish; if you want "punch" and "clarity", a pure sine wave is an awful place to start for those attributes.

Some people augment standard string bass by laying some sine underneath it, but pure sine without the mechanical characteristics of a plucked string is going to be pretty bland-sounding.

Also, adding compression to a sine wave won't do much other than reduce the overall gain of the sine. Nor will a high-pass filter do much to any pure sine above the cutoff frequency; it's kind of like sticking an infrared filter on an ultraviolet light ;).

If you really want to play with analog synthesis and waveshaping, look at throwing the sine through an ADSR (Attack, Decay, Sustain, Release) filter. Or try adding a second oscillator with a triangle or sawtooth wave to add some edge to the sound.

G.
 
Glen, thank you for your reply

Naturally, the sine goes through an ADSR envelope with a short decay to make it more "plucky". Regarding what I want to achieve, I guess what you call "bland", I call "round" and "deep". I love the way low frequency sinewaves sound. I'm aware that a similar sound can be done with a square or saw wave through a LPF filter with the cutoff turned down, but I prefer sines. Have you ever heard an 808 kick playing a bass part? thats the sound I'm after more or less. I just can't nail it though.

Also, adding compression to a sine wave won't do much other than reduce the overall gain of the sine. Nor will a high-pass filter do much to any pure sine above the cutoff frequency
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What do you mean? won't a compressor with medium attack and longish decay make the attack stage snappier? and an HPF won't trim the lows on sine waves? I don't get it...
 
flextone said:
Glen, thank you for your reply

Naturally, the sine goes through an ADSR envelope with a short decay to make it more "plucky".
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OK, I misunderstood your OP. Obvioulsy after shaping the envelope, it's no longer a pure sine...well, yeah it is, I guess, but it's no longer a pure envelope.
flextone said:
Regarding what I want to achieve, I guess what you call "bland", I call "round" and "deep".
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I get you; what I meant was that a pure sine isn't going to have it's own attack or "edge". Again, I misunderstood; I thought you were going more for a synthed bass line where you were wanting to synth the characteristics of a string bass and not so much of a kick drum sound.
flextone said:
Have you ever heard an 808 kick playing a bass part? thats the sound I'm after more or less. I just can't nail it though.
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Yeah I've heard 808s. I've never really looked at their waveform characteristics, though, and never really tried synthing them. I'd think they probably have a pretty strong attack and decay, but that's just a guess on my part. Also, I'd be guessing that I might want to try emphasizing overtones and even the first undertone of the fundamental.

Have you considered grabbing an 808 sample and looking at it?
flextone said:
What do you mean? won't a compressor with medium attack and longish decay make the attack stage snappier? and an HPF won't trim the lows on sine waves? I don't get it...
Click to expand...
Well, yeah you can shape the envelope somewhat with the compressor, I thought you were looking at something different. Though I'm not sure what can be done with the comp that can't be done with the ADSR (other than adding analog-ish color).

I could be wrong. But as far as the LPF, if you are indeed running pure sine, you're not really going to have any subharmoinics or mic/preamp path stuff to filter out. On the other side of the coin, though, now that I know we're talking about 808-ish stuff, I'm thinking that a 40Hz cutoff might be a bit high, especially if my theory about adding some undertone holds up.

G.
 
Well, I have hundreds of 808 samples :)

The kick is made from a sine wave with a fast pitch envelope. But the 808 has too much overtones to act as a true sustaind walking bassline. All I want is for the sine to come through deep and clear on the lower frequencies instead of smudging.
 
flextone said:
Hello

I want to achieve a nice and clean, low pure sine wave bass. Just a one oscillator sine wave. They seem to smudge too easily when low notes are played so that their tonality is unclear. What I do is use a simple sine wave from a monosynth (futureretro xs, dsi evolver or even software), into a mono channel in cubase, maybe add a compressor to make the attack a little more punchy and cut away everything below 40hz, that's it.

It never sounds as good as some recordings I know, not even close. How can I get it to sound clear in the lower note range? I know the problem is not my monitors as I hear these basses just fine on CD's all the time.

Help?
Click to expand...
Im going to go with the obvious and ask if u shortened your sustain and play your notes staccato..that way the natural sustain of the bass will cut off before the next note, and not bleed all over the place. Kinda like a kick drum wit no reverb.
 
The problem is not in the envelopes guys, the problem is that the muckiness of the sound at the low-mids in low notes. I can't get a sharp, round, coherent sine bass that will sound good through 2 octaves.
 
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