Classic vs. Flamenco

[Richard Monroe]

We need a relatively high-end nylon string guitar for the current project to match with a Celtic lap harp. We think a steel string will overpower the harp, which has a relatively small voice. I'll admit to having limited experience with classics. Can somebody define the difference between a classic and a flamenco guitar? I always thought they were the same thing, just different playing styles, but from the lierature I've been reading, it appears I was wrong.-Richie

 

[Tom Hicks]

Hi Richie
I played a little classical in college and a buddy had a flamenco guitar that I played a time or two.Since you have probably seen many classical guitars,I tell you the differences I remember.
Flamenco guitars have a very thin top and a plastic "tap plate" to protect the sounding board from all the percussive finger pounding that is part of that style.
The entire instrument is much lighter,with a thin trebly tone that projects well for the strumming they do.But on single string runs it is much quieter than a classical due to less mid-range and bass tone.
The celtic harp and classical guitar actually have not-dissimilar sounds.It might be a good idea to ues the flamenco guitar because as a nylon string instrument there will be enough commonalities of timbre to blend well,while the more trebly flamenco will maybe keep the two instruments from muddying the same frequencies.
Go over the musical range of the celtic harp and try to have the guitarist accompany it in a different register.Also ,if the harp is plinking arpeggio style,having the guitar strum chord style rather than fingerpicking will also help to draw a difference in the listener's mind.
Good luck on what sounds like a very interesting project!My parents have been travelling sculpture artists at rennaisance fairs for over 30 years.The local one here in N Tx is called Scarborough Fair.I have heard many a celtic harp,hammered dulcimer,psaltry etc. at these events.Are you doing medieval music or perhaps something like trad Irish?Be sure to post a clip of your efforts.
regards
Tom

 

[Richard Monroe]

Thanks, Tom- Actually we're running the gambit from blues to folk to rock n' roll to medieval to current Celtic folk. Imagine it as a folk/rock/blues/jazz fusion not unlike old Jefferson Airplane with the American/country folk replaced by Celtic folk. Among the assembled musicians, we have some serious jazz people with a background in folk/blues, and a bank of early music and classical people. I swear it's like herding cats! The lead guitarist is Christopher Woitach (jazz master guitarist, background in acoustic folk/blues), Maureen Fleming on vocals (jazz arranger, background in folk/pop/standards), Audrey White on violin (professor at New England conservatory of music- with Suzuki since age 6), Bill Van Pelt on fretless and double bass (jazz/rock/classical fusion), Vanessa Layne on Alto recorder and Irish flute/whistle (medieval/early music), Susan Kell on lap harp (early/medieval music) and Jeff Webb on percussion (psychedelic/jazz, now a specialist in African percussion), and myself (acoustic and electric guitars, background in Eagles, Jefferson Airplane, Heart, Fleetwood Mac, Beatles, CSN&Y, Wilson Phillips, the Who, Clannad, Steeleye Span, Silly Wizard, and much more), Carolyn Pfeffer on additional vocals (not a pro, just an old stage partner with great chemistry. Basically, I'm into classic California and British invasion folk/rock, and I'm handing my songs over to a collection of jazz badasses and early music specialists to create some eclectic sounds that will be immune to any genre classification. Look for a Christmas 2003 release date. (spam off)-Richie

 

[ozraves]

Classic or Flamenco? For what you are doing, I think the Classic is the sound. My personal favorite Classic models are Ramirez, Hirade and Guild. If you can find an old Guild Mark V then you might like it a lot. Hirades are readily available on the used market for reasonable prices.

The older Flamenco guitars had tuners similar to a violin in that pressure held the string in tune. These have now been replaced with tuners similar to those in Classic guitars.

An easy way to think of the differences to my mind are: Flamenco = gypsy; Classic = Segovia.

I think one of those old Guild Mark Vs might be the way to go. They are a little more lively in sound and are somewhat loud for a nylon string. You might check out a Tacoma. I have one of their steel strings. It's very loud. They do make a Classic model but I haven't played it. You get a lot of guitar for the price with a Tacoma.

From a FAQ at a dealer:

Q: What are the differences between classical and flamenco guitars?

A: The differences between classical and flamenco guitars are prevalent in materials, construction and sound.

Materials: Classical guitars are generally made with spruce or cedar tops and rosewood or mahogany backs and sides to enhance sustain. Flamenco guitars are generally made with spruce tops and cypress or sycamore for the backs and sides to enhance volume.

Construction: The body of classical guitars are generally deeper and the woods are slightly thicker. Flamenco guitars have a flat or negative (before string tension) neck relief, making the action very fast at the cost of some buzzing. The strings are also closer to the body on flamenco guitars to facilitate tapping. Flamenco guitars often bear a “golpeador”, which is a sheet of plastic mounted to the face of the guitar to protect its finish.

Sound: The classical guitar is designed to give the soloist the tools to perform poly-timbral music: “An orchestra in a box”. The attack is soft with a longer and gradual decay. The flamenco guitar is designed to cut through the sound of dancers stomping their feet. The sound is a bit more percussive, a loud sonic burst followed by a swift decay.

Steve
http://www.piemusic.com