Church Praise Teams - personnel issues

[Fusioninspace]

Ed Dixon wrote...

"Getting back to the original topic.

One challenge for many church music groups is dealing with people. I have been part of music groups at a variety of different churches and it’s amazing how much they vary on how they work with musicians and vocalists. There are two situations that seem to come up regularly.

The first is the basic question of what criteria, if any, is used in adding people to a music team. Suppose you have a praise team with musicians and vocalists. You have stage room for many. What criteria is used for adding a new vocalist? Is there an audition, or do you just take those who are willing. In most cases churches are dealing with volunteers and not paid music folks, so it can get tricky fast.

The second is the question of dealing with dependability. You rehearse a song with different parts assigned to different people. Then on Sunday, one or more don’t show and don’t call. So you end up winging it with somehow redistributing the song parts. The other variation is that people show on Sunday to sing, who did not make rehearsal, and really don’t know the songs.

What approaches are used by the different groups represented here?

Ed"

 

[mikemorgan]

We usually make them pay a small fee each week to be "in the band", and keep records of who's "on" this week. We only charge $.50 and pass the plate at practice. If they paid to play, they'll show up. If they didn't, they don't expect to be included on Sunday.

As for those with lesser musical skills, I think God gave us all the skills we'll ever need, and it's not up to me to decide their "worthiness".

 

[punkin]

I've been there...I know your pain. I learned a long time ago, be prepared to do a solo act at all times. Nothing worse than having only practiced the harmony part and be stuck trying to pull it off on your own.

 

[Fusioninspace]

Ed, I hope you don't mind that I start a new thread with your original message. I think there's enough worship team people here to warrant it.

There a pretty good site that deals with church sound issues and covers stuff like this from time to time:

www.prosoundweb.com

But more to your point - We do not have a very formalized way to bring new people in. Some new musicians come in because of mutual friends that happen to already be on our worship team. We get a few people from our youth worship. So I would say that cover's 75% of new people. Either way, it's usually one of the worship leaders that invites them to come on board.

A handfull of us are getting in by being on the sound team and over time get to introduce our skills during after-hours and practices.

I personnally like have the youth members because it really helps them mature as a musician quickly - some of those "kids" are really talented and it's nice to be able to help have a regular gig and worship at the same time.

One issue that we all struggle with is worship vs. performance. I think the majority of guitarists are very much into performance and obviously that can be distracting from the goal of worship.

Just make it a policy that if someone is not showing up for either rehearsal or services routinely (for whatever reason), then they need to step down so the team can focus. For people that show up late (near the end or after the sound checks) then the sound guy should just let them know they will not be included in the mix and that have to be quiet enough on the worship platform as to not interfer with the mix or the rest of the team.

Yea it is volunteer work, but it is also a commiment.

Good luck!

 

[macmoondoggie]

There are many at our Church that feel that anybody who wants too be in the worship band, should be and feel those that are in it are being exclusionary. As the teams leader that means me in particular trying to keep it exclusive. I just bear in mind that Psalm 33-3 admonishes us to "play skillfully" and on occasion have gently pointed that out to those whom desire far outweighs their talent.
This is not being exclusive, but the bottom line is who wants to be led by
a worship team that sings off key and can't keep time. Even though the music is not about us or to us, you still do not want to sound bad.
It is a tough balancing act, so I seek guidance from above all the time.
Peace.

 

[cephus]

I was going to reply to the other post that this issue must be the number one bummer of the sunday church band thing. I really like to help people feel that music is accessible, but I can't stand performing with people who suck. Plus the Christians are mostly really nice people and I'd feel extra shitty telling them that me and God think they should participate in music purely in a pedestrian role.

 

[johnny5dm]

I was going to reply to the other post that this issue must be the number one bummer of the sunday church band thing. I really like to help people feel that music is accessible, but I can't stand performing with people who suck. Plus the Christians are mostly really nice people and I'd feel extra shitty telling them that me and God think they should participate in music purely in a pedestrian role.

Ha! I love it.

What our church does is this: once a quarter or so, they have a "jam session" where anyone who's interested in playing/singing comes and does their thing (regular musicians show up to provide the backbone if it's needed). If they're good enough, the leader invites them to join one of our bands. If not, they can keep working and come back the next time. Doesn't solve all of the situations, but certainly makes some easier. It's like an audition, but nowhere near as much pressure, IMO.

 

[macmoondoggie]

I was going to reply to the other post that this issue must be the number one bummer of the sunday church band thing. I really like to help people feel that music is accessible, but I can't stand performing with people who suck. Plus the Christians are mostly really nice people and I'd feel extra shitty telling them that me and God think they should participate in music purely in a pedestrian role.

You've got it right on!

 

[soundchaser59]

Our church has a guy who admits that the only time he ever plays guitar is on Sunday morning once a month or once every six weeks when it is his turn to play in the band. And it shows.....

He does not come to rehearsal, he doesn't play in key most of the time, a lot of times it sounds like he isn't even playing the same song. The sound guys just turn his fader off and never bother with it. He is a "church veteran" from the original founding congregation, so nobody has the heart (or is it the guts?) to tell him his guitar playing just plain sucks.

I gave the leader of the bands a cd that I made by myself, finished tracks complete productions, and said I would be glad to play guitar any time. Then he didn't say one word to me about it for over 3 years. Then he resigned and moved out of state. Meanwhile, some other guy wants off the sound crew and mentions that I have a guitar and a mixer in my basement. They let me learn and a few weeks later I'm one of the 3 or 4 rotating sound guys.

Some younger guy comes in a year later to be the leader of the bands. After one of the services he starts asking me about how I learned to run sound. I told him the mixer in the old parish is identical to the mixer I have in my basement, would you like to see what I do?? So he came over, I blasted him with my Strat and my Twin, and 2 months later I'm playing guitar in the Christmas program and playing screaming guitar solos in a band on Sunday morning.

After the last solo/song, the guy who never practices comes up on the stage and jokingly says they should get me out of that sound booth and instead have me in his band instead of him! And the sound man says he will never turn the fader down when I'm the guitarist. It's not because I'm any kind of whiz on guitar, it's that my committment and dedication to playing the guitar as well as I possibly can shows immediately when the music starts......and the crew and the crowd all hear the difference and appreciate it!

It DOES make a difference in how people receive and accept the rest of the service.

 

[Micter]

Many churches pick people to be on the worship team for appearence and not talent. I see a lot of pastor's wives that can't carry a tune in a bucket but are leading a worship team. It's that mentality that has pushed me away from playing worship in church. I really feel as though if God has called someone to be on a worship team he will also give them the talent necessary. I really feel there should be a high standard of musicianship as well as lifestyle in order to play worship music in the church. It's too bad that many teams are thrown together without much thought of the abilty of the musicians. There are a lot of people that say "I'm not good enough to be in a band" but play worship. If you aren't good enough to play in a band you are not good enough to play worship.

The other thing that drives me completely nuts are soundmen that have no clue and teach others the same cluelessness.

 

[refin]

Musicians in a church should be chosen the same way leadership is.....heart and gifting.There are many in a congregation who may feel qualified to be in leadership,but the ones chosen are carefully screened.
Anything else is veneer,and falling short.

 

[rayc]

It's called being in a band, sheesh!
When it gets that complicated you know you are dealing with more than one person & it's NOT much to do with location, vocation or notation.
I can't get my head around this jargon...praise team, C.C.
Hey, if the band get tea & nibblies before &/or after the gig is that the C.C. Rider?

 

[XLR]

Lightning's going to strike you Ray.

But, "praise team" is an odd term for a band.

 

[Fusioninspace]

This is getting interesting. Soundchaser really brings up some good points about the worship team "leadership". I wonder if the bigger churches that have a paid musicial director have some of these kinds of problems...

Basically, if you have a team leader that has a full time day job, but really gets off on leading the team, but doesn't have the heart/passion/understanding or skill to build the best team possible... then the entire congregation suffers.

So much of this falls on leadership.

We have a smallish church (under 350/weekly) and I see the challenge of leadership to be our #1 issue. It's something I pray about routinely... All I can do is my best and try to make a diff. Sometimes it works, sometimes it don't - but the success or failure is what I perceive. It probably has nothing to do with what God wants...

 

[mixmkr]

But, "praise team" is an odd term for a band.

Not really if you put it in the context that I play with several others, and as a team we lead (the congregation) in praise (and worship). We are not a band. We are a helps ministry to aide the Pastor and to lead the praise and worship part of a service (thru music).

Our church holds auditions, as we believe you DO need to play skillfully and being a distraction ISN"T a leadership role. Whether are auditions amount to much or not, is obviously a point for opinion.

 

[maestro_dmc]

I really feel as though if God has called someone to be on a worship team he will also give them the talent necessary.

Those whom He calls, He also equips?

I really feel there should be a high standard of musicianship as well as lifestyle in order to play worship music in the church. It's too bad that many teams are thrown together without much thought of the abilty of the musicians. There are a lot of people that say "I'm not good enough to be in a band" but play worship. If you aren't good enough to play in a band you are not good enough to play worship.

So many times, you have one or the other. It can be quite frustrating. Our church has swung the pendulum back and forth a few times between the extremes. I think we're somewhere around the middle right now.

The other thing that drives me completely nuts are soundmen that have no clue and teach others the same cluelessness.

What our church does is this: once a quarter or so, they have a "jam session" where anyone who's interested in playing/singing comes and does their thing (regular musicians show up to provide the backbone if it's needed). If they're good enough, the leader invites them to join one of our bands. If not, they can keep working and come back the next time. Doesn't solve all of the situations, but certainly makes some easier. It's like an audition, but nowhere near as much pressure, IMO.

I like this. This is kind of the idea I've had. Right now, we just don't have anybody new hanging around for any length of time with any kind of musical skills. All our new musicians are coming up through the youth department.


Our approach is, if you're not there on Thursday night, you can't play on Sunday. This extends to EVERYBODY. We make exceptions when someone is absent for ministry reasons. We only ask for that minimum commitment of Thursday, and Sunday.

 

[SRR]

At our church there are auditions, but the auditions are half of how you sing/play, and half about you as a person and where you are at with your walk with God. You fail both parts you probably are not gonna make it this time around, that doesn't mean its over, just your plans of joining are delayed. We have 2000 in attendance, with practice on Thursday nights, if you aren't at practice, you aren't singing/playing that week. You get your folder the week before, solos/duets for singers are laid out in advance, if you can sing harmony the worship director will probably ask for it in advance or at practice. Services are Saturday night, and two on Sunday morning. It is very much a commitment thing once you pass the audition. You tell what weeks you can make the commitment of being there, and they schedule for some or all of the weeks you can make it. Sometimes they scream out and say hay we only have two vocalists can two more commit? Usually they have people step up. There are like 40-50 people signed up in CAC (Christian (or is creative) Arts Community), but really only 20 of them are regulars, which includes my wife as a vocalist, she has been on 3 times in a month before, but is more often then not on 2 times a month due to other commitments. She is trying to learn guitar so she can play and sing, but is finding practice time hard, she has told me to lock her in the basment 30-35 mins a night so she can get her practicing in....that hasn't been working very well, but still she wants to play. She took guitar 1 at the local tech college, they haven't had guitar 2 at a time and place where she could go, she learned so much in guitar 1, that I know she could really accelerate her learning if they just offered guitar 2.

Anyways, our worship director is paid for 40 hours a week, and she deserves it, cause she also does the powerpoint for all the songs and the sermon, puts together all the folders a week and a half in advance, plays piano for 3 out of 4 of the services a month, directs the practices, helps schedule people, etc. etc. Only other person paid full time is the head of the sound and lights crew. And he just went full time, before he worked almost full time but was only paid part time.

 

[true-eurt]

Lightning's going to strike you Ray.

But, "praise team" is an odd term for a band.

That is because for some churches and/or believers...to use the term *Band* may be inciting the devil, so it must be called *Praise Team* or *Worship Team*. Besides, if the group were not named one or the other, no one would know they are praising God...perhaps thinking they were singing songs to the devil in church?

I don't think, they think, God would know the difference without their help.

It is the same in dance for many too. It is not to be called dancing OR praise dancing even...the dancing is to be eliminated....call it what then? What else do you call dancing? There is a tendency to forget that David danced naked(naked may well be in a loin cloth) before the Lord and yes, the bible uses the term dancing in it's English translation anyway.

 

[faderbug]

all this religious shit scares the hell out of me!!!

i'm in moderate liberal belgium looking at the world becoming insanely fundamentalist. in my own city fundamentalist pakistani muslims started a riot at an islamic moroccan music and dance fest because music and dance is unclean and an instrument of the devil!

that scared me.

now i read that their adversaries the american protestants - who i suppose are defenders of the free world and democracy - share those ideas.

that scares me even more.

 

[rayc]

Music now with POWERPOINT! I am getting a little frightened.
The Ramones had a good song about basements - I don't go there anymore.
I have a nice guitar. Would anyone like to talk about that - or maybe my old semi acoustic bass?
True - How about " A band of Angels coming after me coming for to..."?
or Elvis - banned in the tri state area?