Blue Bear Sound
New member
Cymbals sound harsh and grainy, and there's some comb filtering happening due to mic placement issues (that whooshy, phasey effect on cymbal hits)....
No definition to the toms at all...
Woofy kick, but may be appropriate for certain applications....
Snare sounds kind of distant and roomy, as well as on the trashy side - again, may be the right sound for certain songs (no way to tell without hearing other tracks in context)
Everyone starts somewhere!
No definition to the toms at all...
Woofy kick, but may be appropriate for certain applications....
Snare sounds kind of distant and roomy, as well as on the trashy side - again, may be the right sound for certain songs (no way to tell without hearing other tracks in context)
Everyone starts somewhere!
peopleperson
I'm so sorry.
Those aren't real drums are they?
Myriad_Rocker
New member
Blue Bear Sound said:
Yeah, I think so too...but I'm such a recording n00b...and what is comb filtering?
Blue Bear Sound said:
What do you mean?
Blue Bear Sound said:
Again, I'm not certain what you mean....by "woofy"...like airy?
Blue Bear Sound said:
That might be the reverb I'm using on it. What do you mean by trashy?
Yeah, I'm not comfortable enough with my recording abilities to post it with the music....I'm afraid I'll get laughed at. Besides, the drums are a good place to start.
Myriad_Rocker
New member
peopleperson said:
Tell me why you would believe they aren't. I'm serious...
S
Steal Sessions
New member
Myriad_Rocker said:
I do not either.. Each hit sound identical to the former and next. If I'm wrong then my compliments for drumming like a drumcomputer, that would be something amazing... lacking any feel and dynamics, but amazing notherless..
No pun intended...
About the sounds: the toms sound a bit flat, no defeniton means to me that you only hear the hit with the tone of the drum, there is no resonance in the tone.. the kick is a bit 200-500Hz heavy if you ask me and the cybals especially the hihat are a bit too loud.
It's pretty amazing that cymbals that cost alot of money often end up being pretty low volume in the mix.. Well, it's all in the service of the song, no?
ecktronic
Mixing and Mastering.
See when posting, try and have a decent MP3 conversion. Your sample is at 96k!!!
Convert your MP3s to at least 196k (even cut the size of your sample, quality not qauntity kinda thing) . I think that is half the problem with the cymbals.
The snare and kik sound sampled. Could just be a really consistent drummer though.
Convert your MP3s to at least 196k (even cut the size of your sample, quality not qauntity kinda thing) . I think that is half the problem with the cymbals.
The snare and kik sound sampled. Could just be a really consistent drummer though.
HangDawg
bUnGhOlIo
I can't believe for 1 second that they are real drums played by a living person. I think you should rephrase your question and ask, "Did I do a good job programming this SR-16?" To that I would answer, no.
C
Cloneboy Studio
.
Definately a drum machine.
High hat gives it away--especially during the tom rolls. I'd love to see someone play those rolls while keeping the hat identical. Oh geeze... the ride cymbal sounds pure drum machine.
I've used drum machines since 1988 and I'm not dissing them, but it's pretty lame when someone tries to pass these off as the real thing.
High hat gives it away--especially during the tom rolls. I'd love to see someone play those rolls while keeping the hat identical. Oh geeze... the ride cymbal sounds pure drum machine.
I've used drum machines since 1988 and I'm not dissing them, but it's pretty lame when someone tries to pass these off as the real thing.
S
Steal Sessions
New member
Cloneboy Studio said:
Damn, I should have said that too...
its also the same tomroll over and over.
EDIT: I'd suggest using drumkit from hell or alike to create more realistic drumsounds... and think like a drummer, see if you can imagine how many various hits can be one at one point.. I guess 4, 2 legs and 2 hands..
EDIT AGAIN: It is not the drum fill, that could be doable when playing the hihat with your left hand all the time. Its the snare-crash-hihat combo at the same time that does it, right after the tom fill... need 3 sticks (thus hands) for that..
Lets say: The ability to program a drumcomputer does not make you a drummer...
Myriad_Rocker
New member
Cloneboy Studio said:
Good God guys....I just asked what he thought they were. Yes, they are sampled...but I have NO WAY of recording drums. So I'm forced to put together drums in a midi program and trigger acoustic drum samples from that. I have NO other way of doing drums. Short of spending lots of money that I don't have.
I'm didn't come here to test you guys on whether or not these were sampled drums. I came here to get mix suggestions, EQ suggestions, etc. Telling me that the cymbals are grainy is a good thing. I want to hear this stuff. Also, after listening to the drum track, I realize myself that the hats are too loud. And the ride as well.
So...any suggestions?
Another thing, I did it at 96 so you guys wouldn't have to sit and wait too long for it to download...forgive me.
C
Cloneboy Studio
.
There's no shame in using a drum machine, but when asking people to critique your drum "mix" you should let them know it's samples. Processing drum samples is different from real drums.
Look up my big tutorial on drum machine programming, it may help.
Look up my big tutorial on drum machine programming, it may help.
S
Steal Sessions
New member
Myriad_Rocker said:
Ah, ok. I guess you're right. Well, all the above applies also for suggestions for the 'overall sound' I guess. Making more variation in fills, dont use 3 sticks at the same point.. this sounds a bit un-dynamic also, maybe playing with the volume of the samples a bit could help. I kick the basdrum in a bit louder in the 'one' of each measure, especially when hitting a crash cymbal. stuff like that. using another sample and/or at a different volume could help to create a more realistic effect on a 3-hits-on -the-snare-roll that you have in there somewhere. If youre using drumkit from hell or alike with the correct plugin for that like the LM4 (i believe) the samples themselve change when the midi note tells it to be a bit less loud, a sample that was actually hit a bit softer is used in that case. Also you can use lefthand and righthand hits and all of them samples recorded while hit with different volumes/power. The cymbal sounds also would be a lot more realistic. The recordings of these samples is such that you normally would achieve a goud overall sound even without using copressors, eq or whatever. Only volume and panning set correctly would be enough..
The 'best' sound using samples/triggering can only be achieved using the 'best' samlpe set. Trying to make samples from various source blend nicely could be difficult in a mix..
And... if you have a nice tune, maybe someone is willing to help you with it? Maybe even record their real drumming for your tune... just ideas...
EDIT:
Maybe I'm stoopid, but I searched for it on the BBS... no luck yet. What am I doing wrong here?
Myriad_Rocker
New member
Yeah I haven't found the tutorial either.
Middleman
Professional Amateur
No offense but it sounds like a guitar player's impression of what drums sound like.
Not a problem, I've been there. Get a real drummer to program your drums. They do synchopated things and stick dribbles that you just don't get unless you're a real drummer.
The whole sound is veiled and the snare is just not fat enough. If you are doing tracks for your own please, then its good enough to craft out a tune. If your doing something you want others to hear then I would go for DFHS or DFH2 but still get a drummer to program them.
Not a problem, I've been there. Get a real drummer to program your drums. They do synchopated things and stick dribbles that you just don't get unless you're a real drummer.
The whole sound is veiled and the snare is just not fat enough. If you are doing tracks for your own please, then its good enough to craft out a tune. If your doing something you want others to hear then I would go for DFHS or DFH2 but still get a drummer to program them.
Myriad_Rocker
New member
Middleman said:
What's DFHS and DFH2?
S
Steal Sessions
New member
Myriad_Rocker said:
http://www.toontrack.com/
Drumkit From Hell Superior and Drum Kit From Hell 2. Various cymbals, toms, basdrums, snares and all samples like explained above...
view the demo's.. nice stuff for sure.
peopleperson
I'm so sorry.
I have no experience with Drums from Hell, but I have and frequenly use BFD and it's incredible sounding with tons of control over the mix, mics, and it's got 80 some velocity layers. Battery is nice too cause you can plug in your hits of choice. BFD make you use it's samples. Still, there are some killer sounding drum modules out these days.
six
New member
As for the sound/mix: I like the toms and even the bass-drum. ride sounds terrible. i'd even say it's the wrong choice - some more ride bell might fit better, of couse it depends on the song you're using it for.
the "playing": I think it will sound MUCH better if you vary the velocity of the cymbal-hits a bit and turn them down in general (as already mentioned above) and think about the 4-limbs thing. I also do everything the way you do it (www.soundclick.com/sixch) and I think my drumtracks are a bit closer to real-drumming on electro-drums
... but they still lack a lot of realism - for the critical ear.
Also you benefit of listening carefully to real drum-performances or just play a bit yourself.
I once tried to put in some more realism by playing some parts - only snare and bass for example - on a midi-keyboard. baaah, THIS sounds horrible unless you correct so many things that setting them in a midi-editor would have been the quicker way.
keep on banging.
the "playing": I think it will sound MUCH better if you vary the velocity of the cymbal-hits a bit and turn them down in general (as already mentioned above) and think about the 4-limbs thing. I also do everything the way you do it (www.soundclick.com/sixch) and I think my drumtracks are a bit closer to real-drumming on electro-drums
... but they still lack a lot of realism - for the critical ear.Also you benefit of listening carefully to real drum-performances or just play a bit yourself.
I once tried to put in some more realism by playing some parts - only snare and bass for example - on a midi-keyboard. baaah, THIS sounds horrible unless you correct so many things that setting them in a midi-editor would have been the quicker way.
keep on banging.
Myriad_Rocker
New member
Maybe I'm going about doing it all wrong. I'm not using different velocities for my samples and I'm not alternating hats on my hits....I suppose I could vary the volume slightly but that just doesn't get the same effect.
So....what could I use? I've heard of Battery and I have VSampler on my Sonar 3, I'm sure. I've also read good things about the nskit that's available for free and recorded pretty well and it has different velocities and hand hits.
I'm just looking for suggestions on what I could do better, using what I currently have.
So....what could I use? I've heard of Battery and I have VSampler on my Sonar 3, I'm sure. I've also read good things about the nskit that's available for free and recorded pretty well and it has different velocities and hand hits.
I'm just looking for suggestions on what I could do better, using what I currently have.
