Blues Jr. with brittle treble

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thebigcheese

thebigcheese

"Hi, I'm in Delaware."
I love my Blues Jr. amp, but the high end seems to be kind of brittle. I assumed it was my "The Paul," thinking that it had to do with the wood the guitar is made of. I borrowed my friend's Squier Strat (which, to my surprise, actually sounds decently Strat-y without much buzzing) and the amp seems to still be kind of brittle. What component in their would be causing that? Tubes? Speaker? Maybe just a setting I should change? From the brief bit I've read on the Bilm mod page, it sounds like the speaker has more to do with that, but I don't really know anything about amps, so any help is appreciated.

I do have the treble turned to about 3 o' clock (somewhere around 8 as labeled on the amp), but that's because the tone sounds better that way (except for the brittleness).
 
thebigcheese said:
I love my Blues Jr. amp, but the high end seems to be kind of brittle. I assumed it was my "The Paul," thinking that it had to do with the wood the guitar is made of. I borrowed my friend's Squier Strat (which, to my surprise, actually sounds decently Strat-y without much buzzing) and the amp seems to still be kind of brittle. What component in their would be causing that? Tubes? Speaker? Maybe just a setting I should change? From the brief bit I've read on the Bilm mod page, it sounds like the speaker has more to do with that, but I don't really know anything about amps, so any help is appreciated.

I do have the treble turned to about 3 o' clock (somewhere around 8 as labeled on the amp), but that's because the tone sounds better that way (except for the brittleness).
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well ....... I have a bunch of amps (14) and I gig nightly just about and the main amp I use is my Blues Jr. specifically 'cause it's small.
So I use it regularly ....... having said that; I don't think it's that great of an amp. There's a lot of issues with it ..... first is the speaker thing which you seem already aware of ..... the factory speaker is awful.
I'm not obsessive about such things but I had to change the thing.
And I do find them to have a funky top end ....... you have to turn the treble way up to get any 'sparkle' but then you get a harshness to it that's really annoying.
The reverb is pretty poor too.

I think that if you do a search for mods to it you'll find some simple ones that are supposed to do the trick. One simply involves snipping a wire and then there's some others that might run around $40 to do.
I keep meaning to do them to mine but I'm too lazy and I don't really care THAT much. If I do a gig I want to be fussy about I just use a different amp.
I actually have a link ..... let me go see if I can find it ..............
ah, here ya' go ...... : http://home.comcast.net/~machrone/bluesjunior.htm
that ought to get you started.
 
Ah, yeah, that's the site I've been checking out. I've been meaning to do his basic mods, but I've been too cheap to order the kit... I'll have to read up a little more and see if that'll help or if it's going to be the speaker that's the problem. Hopefully it's not the speaker...

When you changed the speaker, did it still have the brittleness?
 
thebigcheese said:
Ah, yeah, that's the site I've been checking out. I've been meaning to do his basic mods, but I've been too cheap to order the kit... I'll have to read up a little more and see if that'll help or if it's going to be the speaker that's the problem. Hopefully it's not the speaker...

When you changed the speaker, did it still have the brittleness?
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well ...... it gets hard to know what we're talking about when you say brittleness ya' know?
But short answer ........... yeah.
I just wanted to get that traditional Fender sound but apparently you can't get it with a Fender Blues Junior. :rolleyes:

I don't like the amp and I've really tried to 'cause it's so small and easy to deal with and mine's blonde with oxblood grill so it's even cool looking but it's just not a great amp as it comes from the factory.

It just has an annoying sound to it ....... but I'm sure it can be corrected. That guy's got a chart ...... I think the tone stack mod is free .... just snip a wire. So do that and see if it does what he says it will. If it does, then he probably knows what he's doing so then I'd look at his chart and see which problems sound most like yours.

As for speakers ......... I've never heard anything sound bad thru a Vintage 30.
If I had one I'd put it in but, as I said, ordering one is more trouble than I'm going to ......... but that's the speaker I'd try if I were buying one.
 
I recently put a JBL in a blues jr. and it made a world of difference in the sound. The little guy sounds like a Fender now.
 
Fender + Hempcone is a match made in heaven. I just started running my 5E3 Deluxe thru a Tone Tubby Superboy 10, and it is "that" sound! I'm gonna get another one to put in a 2x10 cab.

CRex is the ok budget match, but Tone Tubby is best if you can afford it.
 
Hmm, so maybe it's the speaker after all? I'm very happy to hear I can get rid of it because it is an otherwise fantastic little amp. How do you guys go about deciding on a speaker? I suppose I could pick one up at Guitar Center and exchange it if I don't like it, assuming they sell speakers.
 
Ugh, so it turns out they don't have speakers in the store... do you guys just order online? I can have it sent to the store, but I was hoping to just go out and get one... Any other chain stores or non-chains near Fairfax, VA, that might have them?
 
So I got some money for Xmas and I'm thinking I might use it to upgrade the speaker. I looking at Eminence speakers, either the Swamp Thang or the Legend GB128. The 128 is cheaper, and thus more attractive to me, but I don't know how either sound with my setup, so I'm hoping someone here has some opinions on them, since I will likely be ordering online and thus be unable to return the speaker. I generally play with my guitar clean for indie or overdriven for rock, though my Metal Muff sounds pretty good through my amp right now and I may eventually get to play some metal with it. Thoughts on those two speakers?
 
I don't know those speakers - I used a Weber 12F150 in mine, and it made a really big difference.

I also did a couple of the BillM mods that didn't require a kit (lowered the bias with a new resistor, did the midrange one, changed a capacitor or two) and changed the tubes out - I love the sound of mine now. The speaker was definitely the the biggest impact.
 
I have a Blues Jr and I usually turn the tone knob on the guitar a tad to avoid the spikyness of the highs.
I may look into changing the speaker one day.
 
Well, the GB128 is supposed to be similar to a Greenback, so if you have any experience with that speaker, I imagine the results would be similar.
 
thebigcheese said:
So I got some money for Xmas and I'm thinking I might use it to upgrade the speaker. I looking at Eminence speakers, either the Swamp Thang or the Legend GB128. The 128 is cheaper, and thus more attractive to me, but I don't know how either sound with my setup, so I'm hoping someone here has some opinions on them, since I will likely be ordering online and thus be unable to return the speaker. I generally play with my guitar clean for indie or overdriven for rock, though my Metal Muff sounds pretty good through my amp right now and I may eventually get to play some metal with it. Thoughts on those two speakers?
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If you start with the cheap ones you will like the Legend and you will never know what you are missing.

But dont ever get the Swamp Thang after that. If you do, you will kick yourself and wonder why you started with the cheap ones. They are cheaper for a reason, and I've heard the difference side by side with my own ears. The Legends were the first speakers I started with when my tone quest began, and they were the first ones to get sold when I bought my first Weber and my first Tonker and my first Swamp Thang and my second Swamp Thang, etc.etc.etc... I had forgotten I put an 8 inch Legend in my brothers BF Champ, and I could not get a Blue Pup quick enough to replace it.....

Start with the Swamp Thang or the CRex, save money by buying once and keeping it instead of replacing and buying another one....
 
I have the NOS with the Jensen speaker, and it sounds pretty good on top. One mod that I made to a Pignose G40V (just gave it to my grandson for Christmas -- his first tube amp), after I replaced the stock speaker with an Eminence Ragin' Cajun 10", was to install a Weber Beam Blocker. It noticeably improved the Pig, which had a harsh top end. I also put one on the BJ, but the effect was much less noticeable, I suppose because it needed less help.

The Weber piece is inexpensive, and it works.http://www.webervst.com/blocker.html
 
soundchaser59 said:
If you start with the cheap ones you will like the Legend and you will never know what you are missing.

But dont ever get the Swamp Thang after that. If you do, you will kick yourself and wonder why you started with the cheap ones. They are cheaper for a reason, and I've heard the difference side by side with my own ears. The Legends were the first speakers I started with when my tone quest began, and they were the first ones to get sold when I bought my first Weber and my first Tonker and my first Swamp Thang and my second Swamp Thang, etc.etc.etc... I had forgotten I put an 8 inch Legend in my brothers BF Champ, and I could not get a Blue Pup quick enough to replace it.....

Start with the Swamp Thang or the CRex, save money by buying once and keeping it instead of replacing and buying another one....
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That's exactly why I'm asking here first instead of buying. I am very much in favor of buying once and not having to worry about it later. Have you (or anyone else here) tried any of the other Eminence speakers? The Celestions are all a bit out of my price range, but I could afford any other similarly-priced Eminence speakers. I've mostly just been going down the list on the Billm mods page. The Swamp Thang, based on his description, sounds like it could be more of what I'm looking for than the others, but it's hard to really say without having heard them.
 
Did you go here...

http://www.eminence-speaker.com/soundclips.asp

and listen? These are a good start, but in the end they are no substitute for hands on.

I tend to only try the high power heavy magnet speakers, so Tonker, Swamp Thang, CRex (because of the hemp-impregnated cone), Commonwealth, Texas Heat, various Webers, Tone Tubbys (100% hemp fiber cone), and several Celestions. The Celestion Alnico Gold is superb, but it is not a budget speaker. If I were playing loud loud loud all the time I would go with the Swamp, but I would prefer the CRex if a ceramic Tone Tubby was out of budget.

Check here http://www.svvintageamps.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=21 before you buy, just to tease yourself, best prices I've seen on most models.....but they dont sell Eminence. The CRex and Swamp are running about $100-110 shipped, and for another $40 bucks or so you can look at a Tone Tubby or a Weber. Weber's ceramic Silver Bell is sweet (Brad Paisley clip on the alnico, at Dr Z's site!), as is the Weber Texas, or Michigan if you want smoother and tighter and heavier sound. There are a hand full of used Silver Bells on ebay right now, but they may be alnicos, which BillM says will not fit.
 
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and I'm gonna suggest that any of those speakers soundchaser mentioned would be nice upgrades from the stock speaker but I, personally, don't go for high power speakers in a low powered amp. If you do that .... the speaker doesn't get fully driven IMO and you end up with a sterile sort of sound.
When an amp is overdriven ..... part of the sound you want is some speaker breakup.
A 15 watt Blues Junior isn't gonna overdrive a 100 watt speaker at all.
I'd prefer something like a 30 watter for that amp.
 
Lt. Bob said:
and I'm gonna suggest that any of those speakers soundchaser mentioned would be nice upgrades from the stock speaker but I, personally, don't go for high power speakers in a low powered amp. If you do that .... the speaker doesn't get fully driven IMO and you end up with a sterile sort of sound.
When an amp is overdriven ..... part of the sound you want is some speaker breakup.
A 15 watt Blues Junior isn't gonna overdrive a 100 watt speaker at all.
I'd prefer something like a 30 watter for that amp.
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You probably have a point. I was just going with the speakers recommended by Billm, the Swamp Thang being his go-to speaker for bench tests, apparently (because it is so clean). I'm not so sure I want speaker breakup, especially when I'm trying to play clean, but I could be thinking of a different sound. Are you talking about the sort of crackly sound?
 
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