Best Cheap Gate for Drums?

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vwcsonic

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Hi,
I've never been good enough at tracking drums to think I might actually need to gate things. But now that I'm starting to feel like I actually know how to EQ and compress a bit, I'm listening to the bleed I get through my kick and snare mics, and the ringing in tom mics.

I guess some would say just let them ring, etc., and go for natural sound. Or get better at mic placement. But if I was going to pick up a decent gate on the cheap, say $100, anything you'd suggest.

PS: i've tried using the gates that are on dbx compressors, but even using the sidechain, and keying certain frequencies with an EQ, I still have problems. Of course, could be my lack of experience.
 
Are you recording to computer? The gates on most software is the best and cheapest way to go. Their biggest advantage is that they can "look ahead" so they perfectly gate the signal.

The Valley People gates are supposed to be pretty decent if you can find one on ebay. They had some cool multichannel models. Most new cheap gates will just click and add distortion.
 
I think the gates on my dbx are fantastic. the auto-expander makes them completely un-noticeable. I wish I had more. but I would also like to see what others have to say.
 
Don't gate while you are tracking. If the drummer isn't extremely consistent, you will loose some hits that you can't get back.

TexRoadkill is right. If you are using a computer, use those gates. Or (for toms) just manually gate them by erasing everything between the hits.
 
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If you have software definitely go that route. If you don't have software....check out the DBX project 1, 274 expander/gate. It is 4 channels and can be set as an Expander which is critical IMHO when gating drums. I got mine for like 75 bucks off ebay a few years ago. I would buy another one if I wasn't mainly using software/a daw now days for mixing.
 
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aleisis 3630 isn' t too bad. i have a modded version and it gets me by occasionally for kick and snare if the drummer and kit are below par. actually I have a Keypexvalley people which is much faster for this requirement. I NEVER track with them only use them with analog board mixing as outboard . i do like some of the plug ins they seem to have gotten a lot better.
 
i used the behringer 4 channel thing last night. (sorry - can't remember the model) it worked well for toms and a chatty backing vocal track. we have one for sale if you want one - probably well under 100 as i think they go that much new. (*insert anti-globalization slogan here*)

bigtoerecording@msn.com

for kick and snare - something with a little more control on the envelope can be helpful...we just found a dbx super gate cheap for this but haven't hooked it up yet. still - the behringer cheapie can get the job done.

Mike
 
Thanks for all the suggestions. To answer your questions, no, I'm not tracking to software, so no chance to use software gates. Also, I'm not gating when recording; I'm doing it at mixdown. I don't suppose anyone wants to get into how they gate, like if they key certain frequencies, or what controls are mandatory to have on a decent gate? thanks
 
if you are gong to use them for drums they have to have good transient response and react quickly esp in attack or opening times.nothing worse than a smeared opening. start with the snare first if its a good gate it may all you need just to get some isolation from the hats. always get the mike postioning accurate first 'cause you should only really resort to gating if you really need to.sometimes you can just expand a bit if you haven't an adequate gate .
gate the toms if you have good reliable overhead tracks to make up for the ambient loss of the gates on the toms . sometimes compression after the gates on just kick and snare can reallly smoothe out a bad drummer by keeping all the hits closer together .> not recommended for Jazz !
 
since you are going to use hardware gates, I see no reason to not gate during tracking. especially on something easy like toms. then you can re-use the same gate on bass drum and snare on mixdown. another trick is to submix the toms to a stereo pair (or mono even) that way you need even less gates.

the more bleed your mics get the worse the gate will sound.

this is why it is often difficult to gate snare.

which dbx didn't work out for you?
 
vwcsonic said:
Thanks for all the suggestions. To answer your questions, no, I'm not tracking to software, so no chance to use software gates. Also, I'm not gating when recording; I'm doing it at mixdown. I don't suppose anyone wants to get into how they gate, like if they key certain frequencies, or what controls are mandatory to have on a decent gate? thanks
Click to expand...

If you are lucky enough to have frequency keying, this is one way I use it to help set threshold. My goal is to have the threshold as low as possible, to allow the gate to open across the widest dynamic range possible, while avoiding false triggers.

I shoot for a frequency unique to the instrument. For kick, it's easy, as it has tons of LF below the snare, cymbals, etc. Key in something down low, and you can have a very low threshold. The gate won't open until the kick triggers it.

There is more, but I gotta go to work.
 
thanks. I was using a dbx 266XL trying to gate kick and snare. not much control, just threshold and range I think, so I tried patching in an EQ (Meek VC5) to the 266's key insert. Still the gate would get false triggers.

I'm thinking of buying this dbx 274 quad noise gate I"ve found for $85. Then I've got plenty of gates and hopefully they'll work better than the 266XL. (See my other post. I'm trying to decide between the dbx 274 and Valley People Gatex.)

Of course I realize that much of my problem could my technique, but I mean at least I know the mic placement wasn't that far off. I mean an RE20 inside the kick and a 57 right on the snare facing away from the hat...should be gateable, right? So must be my lack of experience actually using a gate correctly. Oh well, I'll learn.
 
Hi, don't hear too much about expanders on toms.

Why do you some feel it necessary?
 
they aren't always necessary . you have to make that desicion based on what level of production ( and time constraints ) you are trying to get to . more isolation on the drums means more nit picking and the abiliting to isolate and refine each sound as it is played . sometimes two mics can work on a drum kit , sometimes they need eight or twelve etc . For me when i started incorporating gates for kick and snare that was a big improvement and then the toms was even better . some drummers rarely use toms and the leaking of a close micked tom skin can introduce a littlte rumble that makes the drums occupy too much space in the mix.
you have to tune the gates ( open/shut times ) carefully to the drums AND drummer AND sometimes the tempo of the track may be relevant especially in long drawn out snare releases.
If you gate a lot then try sending the stereo drum mix to a comp to tidy things up even more...> if it really needs it.
 
If you really think you need to gate, you will need gates with (at least) a threshold, hold, release adjustment and a key insert. I had decent luck with aphex 105's, but they are just adiquate. some gates (like the Drawmers) have built in eq's in the key insert, so you don't have to have outboard stuff.

The bottom line is, if you are trying to use a gate to clean things up a bit, it will work. If you are doing it to get rid of an overwhelming wash created by bad tuning and improper dynamics on the part of the drummer, it won't.
 
ok, i just did a live PA , we had an amazing sound system but we ran a little short on compressors and stuff,
i had a dbx 166xl on kick and snare, and there's not much control, treshold and release time... the behringer multigate (or whats the name) has so much more control but i can't stand that brand and that sound...
so for my next gig i'm gonna try to get me a "real" gate, with attack, release, hold, hicut, locut options, maybe dbx or whatever i can find,

but you're not talking about live, i got a nice nice trick to help you gate toms or kick-snare, i use triggers, i got rid of my roland td6 cause i hardly used it but i kept the triggers, i "paste" them on my drumheads,
and a trs cable goes to the sidechain insert of my gates,
now the gate will always trigger when the snare (or tom, you know...) gets hit,
and i can hit my bassdrum and toms real hard, won't affect the gate on the snare,
i paid like $5 per trigger and its fun to work with,
and just my opinion; but i don't like gating subgroups,
if you hit tom1 , then the gate will open and you'll also hear tom 2 and 3 at the same time, ok, this won't mess up your mix i guess, but if you don't have enough gates.....go for software, you can even automate the treshold if suddenly the drummer starts hitting real soft

my 2cents
 
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