Bass: P vs. J

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tc4b

tc4b

Yeah I been drinkin, SO!?
I have grown to loathe my Ibanez cheapo bass. I want to upgrade, and I started checking out the instruments on recordings I like. And it turns out just about every bass sound I love in recordings is made by either a fender P or J (except for guys like Wooten and Claypool who have boutique/custom stuff).

My question for you ince people is, what's the key difference in sound between P and J? Is one better for rock and another for R&B? One for funk and one for punk? I have played both and like the feel of them, I could go either way right now. In case it matters, I'll be playing it through my sansamp rbi (and a nice amp someday if I ever feel like spending the dough). And I write and play in just about every style, hip hop, rock, country, jazz... No polka. Never wrote one of those.

Thanks for your help.
 
Well, that's a darn good question. Wondered about that myself. I really can't her any difference, or at least haven't noticed. Sorta concluded it was just marketing...
 
To add to the mountain on the subject...

The front pickups are generally in the same place (1/5 of the string length away from the bridge). The P bass (except the earliest 50's models) has a hum-cancelling split coil pickup and the J has a single coil. The J has a second single-coil bridge pickup wound in reverse so that when both pickups are at the same volume, they cancel hum.

The second pickup on a J makes it capable of more sounds (forgetting the player's contribution). My 2001 62RI J sounds a little fuller and deeper on just the neck pickup vs. my 94 Japanese P, which is a bit more punchy and mid-rangey. Both pickups on the J scoops the mids and makes the highs thinner - a very 80's slap tone. The bridge pickup is punchy and lacking the bottom (as expected) that the neck pickup has.

I think that over the years the J pickups have been positioned slightly differently. My J's neck pickup is exactly under the harmonic at 1/5 of the string (4th fret) which means I can't play that harmonic when I have just the neck pickup soloed (which is most often). My '75 EB-3 is the same way. The low-string side of my 60's-style P pickup is in exactly the same position, but the high side, being staggered back is not, making that harmonic possible on the D and G strings. I've played newer-style J's where the front pickup is not in that exact position, eliminating the dead harmonic.

The neck on a P bass is only slightly tapered in width as compared to the J neck. The stock bridges on mine are both 2 1/4" from E to G, but the nut on the J is significantly narrower than on the P.

There's a lot more that people can say and have said on the subject, but I like both and find them good compliments to each other. But if I had to keep only one, it'd be the J.
 
If you're asking this question, you'll probably be happier with a J bass. It's the more "normal" sounding bass if you've been listening to the last 50 years of popular music.

If you'd really like to hear the difference, "So Lonely" by The Police prominently features a P bass. This sound is pretty common in punk music. It has an accentuated mid-range. Another good example is "Picture Book" by The Kinks.

"The Lemon Song" by Led Zeppelin demonstrates the J bass. With the tone rolled off, it makes a pretty good bass synth sound. With the tone up, it makes more of a scooped sound (compared to the P bass).

Either of these are very popular in any genre. I own 1 Jazz bass and probably half a dozen P basses. In the mix, my opinion is that a P bass makes a sound that sits "above" the drums but will interfere with grungy power chord guitars. When I'm showing off my bass skills, I definitely prefer the P bass sound, but obviously people far more successful than me have done it with a J.

but if you have to ask the question, get yourself a J bass. :cool:
 
This is a pretty common question. I like both and I think most bass players eventually end up with both sooner or later. Here's a quote I lifted of Talkbass.com that I think sums it up pretty good.

Ed Friedland on the subject:
To my way of thinking, the difference between a P and J bass goes way beyond the physical. Yes, P bass - fatter neck (usually), split pickup, chunkier tone, less highs. J bass - slimmer neck, easier to play, dual pickups, more note definition, more high frequency.

But... I think P or J bass is a lifestyle choice as well. Committing to the P means taking on a set of preferences, and inherent parameters. You can't or at least shouldn't try to play a P bass like a Jazz. That would be missing the point. The P bass is a fat, chunky-butt animal that likes to take up space. It demands a high level of attention to what you play, because every note hurts - or helps. There ain't no takin' it back with a P bass. You better mean it, or be very good at making it work. You can play fast on a P, but it's not nimble like a Jackrabbit, more like a Grizzly doing 60mph to catch something to eat. Slap on a P? Sure, it's chunkfunk, think Boz Scaggs "Lowdown". The pop on a P is not as sharp as a J. It's like getting sliced with a serrated steak knife. Ouch! Use only when you gots to cut through some tough meat. Classic P guys... Jamerson, Rainey, Rocco, Bob Glaub.

The J is a sleeker machine. Being a Jazz guy means having a little more wiggle room. It takes up less space in the mix, so you can get more active without squashing people. With great power comes great responsibility. Just because you CAN move around, does that mean you should? And if so - how to, how much, and why? The J is a bit skinnier, so you have to learn how to use that texture to fill it up, and how to play it fat when it needs to be fat. Soloing? Sure. Slap? You bet. Passive it cuts like a well honed Buck knife. Active with a good pre amp, more like a barbers razor. Classic J guys... Jerry Jemmot, Larry Graham, Jaco, Marcus...

Some people make a choice early on and stick with it. Their entire style is built around that early decision, whether it was conscious or not. You may know some of these people. Players that would no sooner pick up the other axe than they would deliberately eat rotten food. There's honor in this I think, it certainly makes your life simpler when it's Friday night and you're trying to decide which bass to put in the bag.

I think it behooves (love that word) a professional bassist to have both and spend time cultivating the characteristics of each instrument. You need to make each one speak it's native language. There are some gigs that just naturally call for one or another. Not to say you couldn't switch around. You learn alot about the nature of the P and J when you try to make one do what the other does naturally.

Personally, I'm more fascinated with the P because I've always been a J guy by first nature. The J thing is in my DNA, but the P has gotten into my blood. I love chunkin out some fat ass P bass. It feels like I'm on vacation.

Fletch
 
Everything that could be said has already been said. :)
I prefer the Jazz myself, however.
 
There are some folks that record with a Precision Bass, but take a Jazz Bass on the road with them. What they do in the studio with the P-bass, they can replicate live with the J-bass, but not the other way around...and for the reasons explained by Fletch-X. I already have two P-basses (Squier Affinity and Fender Standard), and an Epiphone EB3 SG Bass, so eventually I'll be looking to add a Jazz Bass to my collection. The EB3 can be tweaked to go either way, but it's still its own animal, completely different from the P and J basses, so once I get a Jazz Bass into my collection, all will be well with my world.

Matt
 
I know I am not the OP, but I gotta say- this has become an intereting thread. I never knew most of this stuff.

I don't really think of myself as a bassist these days- when I started my first high school garage bands, guitarist were, like today, common as nails. I found myself with three guitarist, a drummer (without a kit, a story for another day- but Gawd, what a story...) and no bassist. Being the only one who knew the fretboard, I switched over. Scored a Vox Essex Bass amp (wanted the Vox bass he had, too, but ran out of money) and a Japanese bass that had a massive chrome plated pickguard and two J-type pups. I was glad I switched over- finding "work" (or at least bands needing a bassist) was made much easier, even considered joining the musician's union (who promised to get me at least one gig a year, thus covering dues... shouldda done it.)

Still have the Jap bass, the Essex electronics are still here (some kid stole it, hacked out the speakers and left the rest at the curb, cab got wet at the bottom and began to fall apart) and recently bought a lefty Mexio J-bass. So I guess it is true, we tend to stay with, or go back to, what we had first.

And Fletch, you make some good points, but I think you are WAY over thinking this...:)
 
My experience....

I've played both over a long period of time. The Jazz has a smoother sound, and, since it has two pickups, you can get more variety out one. There's nothing wrong with a Jazz.

BUT the Precision has a presence, and a personality, that I love. In my hands, the P is punchier than the J, and I now have 3 Ps and 0 Js in my arsenal.

I was the bassist in a working band, and when we started I was playing a J, and everybody thought that was OK. Then I got a Tribute by G&L L2000, and the band thought that was a step up, largely because I could now play parts closer in sound to a StingRay, which was featured in some of the material we did. Then I got a Fender '51 Precision Reissue, and it didn't cause any waves, but no complaints either.

Then I showed up at practice with a Classic '50s Precision, and after the first song everyone in the band turned around to look at me and said WOW! That's IT!

Since then, I've shed the others (including a fretless J) and I now restrict myself to the '51, the Classic '50s, and a recent split-coil that I put a fretless Warmoth neck on.

The only way to know which is better is by playing both in an ensemble situation. A bass that sounds excellent in the store may very well disappear into the drum and guitar noise at a gig. And, in my humble opinion, strapping on a Precision and matching up with a good drummer beats the hell out of playing a "pretty" bass. You're not there to please yourself so much as you are to join with the drummer to form the band's locomotive, and the P does that for me.
 
stevieb said:
I know I am not the OP, but I gotta say- this has become an intereting thread. I never knew most of this stuff.

I don't really think of myself as a bassist these days- when I started my first high school garage bands, guitarist were, like today, common as nails. I found myself with three guitarist, a drummer (without a kit, a story for another day- but Gawd, what a story...) and no bassist. Being the only one who knew the fretboard, I switched over. Scored a Vox Essex Bass amp (wanted the Vox bass he had, too, but ran out of money) and a Japanese bass that had a massive chrome plated pickguard and two J-type pups. I was glad I switched over- finding "work" (or at least bands needing a bassist) was made much easier, even considered joining the musician's union (who promised to get me at least one gig a year, thus covering dues... shouldda done it.)

Still have the Jap bass, the Essex electronics are still here (some kid stole it, hacked out the speakers and left the rest at the curb, cab got wet at the bottom and began to fall apart) and recently bought a lefty Mexio J-bass. So I guess it is true, we tend to stay with, or go back to, what we had first.

And Fletch, you make some good points, but I think you are WAY over thinking this...:)
Click to expand...

Me over thinking:D I guess I should have used quotation marks in my post. Only the 1rst sentence or 2 were my thoughts. The rest was a quote from Ed Friedland, former Senior Editor Bass Guitar magazine and all around super bass scholar. Me I just like basses. All of them!!! BTW. All bass players also need a Ric, a stingray, a fretless, duplicates of all of the above so you can string them with both flats and rounds......Over think... naw:D
 
All good advice in this thread. I stand by my advice that if you have to ask, buy a J bass and never look back.

The difference between a P bass and a J bass is really quite drastic if you're a dedicated bassist. The Jazz bass is easily the more versatile and more pleasant sounding for the casual player.

In my opinion, nothing matches the playability of a fat, thick Precision bass neck. When you're really slapping, thrashing, and shredding the fretboard, you need the solid firm foundation that a massive Precision neck provides - but that's a statement about my STYLE as much as the instrument. I try playing these pieces on a Jazz bass and they fall apart because the whole instrument resonates, shakes, and shudders. (FWIW, I find Warwicks to be simple overkill and detest active electronics.)

But if you want to sound like 75% of recorded bass playing, including a huge array of superstars with more talent than I have, use a Jazz bass. I have one - I like it, I dig it, I play the hell out of it. But I have 1 Jazz bass and half a dozen Precision or P-like basses. If you have to ask, buy a Jazz bass.
 
P-Bass Deluxe :)

Fletch-X, I love the quote...

As for what you should get... go with the P Bass deluxe!

It has the classic "P Bass" sound but also has an extra Jazz pickup to add tone options

Sounds like a best of both worlds bass to me eh?

I love the sound of the P Bass deluxe and it is VERY playable!!!

Julien
Recording Engineer @
The Electric Blu Studio
www.electricblustudio.com
Asheville, North Carolina, US of A
 
P Bass Deluxe Specs:

Here are the Specs off Musicians Friend.com:

"A deluxe version of Fender's best-of-both-worlds bass.
The Fender Deluxe P Bass Special 4-String Bass has a Jazz neck, a P Bass body, and a P/J combination pickup array with Vintage Noiseless pickups and active electronics. The P body is a little smaller and lighter, the J neck slimmer and faster, and the combined pickups give you just that much more to play with. A gold vinyl pickguard sets the Deluxe P Bass apart visually, and its satin-finish neck feels worn in from the get-go.

Fender Deluxe P Bass Special 4-String Bass Features:
-Jazz neck
-P Bass body
-Vintage Noiseless Pickups (J bridge pickup, P center pickup)
-Active electronics
-Gold vinyl pickguard"

I especially like the Slimmer Neck and P bass body!
Like I said, I LOVE THIS BASS!

Julien
You Know What...
 
ElectricBlu said:
Here are the Specs off Musicians Friend.com:

"A deluxe version of Fender's best-of-both-worlds bass.
The Fender Deluxe P Bass Special 4-String Bass has a Jazz neck, a P Bass body, and a P/J combination pickup array with Vintage Noiseless pickups and active electronics. The P body is a little smaller and lighter, the J neck slimmer and faster, and the combined pickups give you just that much more to play with. A gold vinyl pickguard sets the Deluxe P Bass apart visually, and its satin-finish neck feels worn in from the get-go.

Fender Deluxe P Bass Special 4-String Bass Features:
-Jazz neck
-P Bass body
-Vintage Noiseless Pickups (J bridge pickup, P center pickup)
-Active electronics
-Gold vinyl pickguard"

I especially like the Slimmer Neck and P bass body!
Like I said, I LOVE THIS BASS!

Julien
You Know What...
Click to expand...

On a similar note.
I just scored a MIJ Jazz Special at a local pawn shop for less than $200. It's a PJ with a jazz neck. Passive though with no pick guard. They've been reissued as the Duff McKagan signature. Great bass!!!

Fletch
 
I myself have a Deluxe Active P Bass Special. It's killer!! The Jazz neck is nice and speedy, and you can go for P and J sounds or anywhere in between. The instrument is rock solid though somewhat hefty. As far as I can tell, it is the answer to the P/J question.
 
Fletch-X said:
I just scored a MIJ Jazz Special at a local pawn shop for less than $200.
Fletch
Click to expand...


Totally. Jealous. I'm trolling eBay for a fretless right now. There's a beat copy for $400, and a nicely preserved one... for $600.

How is it the P/J is such a rarity? Did it get 80's-ed to death? Ridiculous, it's a brilliant compromise (although I'd prefer a P neck variant).
 
Fletch-X said:
On a similar note.
I just scored a MIJ Jazz Special at a local pawn shop for less than $200. It's a PJ with a jazz neck. Passive though with no pick guard. They've been reissued as the Duff McKagan signature. Great bass!!!

Fletch
Click to expand...

HA! I can do you one better- MIM Jazz, Lefty even, PLUS hardshell case, small Fender Bass amp AND leather strap- for $190! All in EXCELLENT condition!

I'm just glad no one has mentioned a FRETLESS Precision Bass- THAT, my friends, is an oxymoron!
 
I'm convinced that 'cut the kid in half' is the way to go... when I was a bassist I loved this mongrel 60's parts-o-caster Fender P/J i played: P/J pickups, P body, J neck.

I never seemed to like one or the other, but the combination of the two is killin' :D
 
A few months ago I purchased the Fender American Deluxe Precision bass and I love it. It's easy to play and you can dial in a lot of sounds. I was lucky and got a real nice one for 1/2 the price on ebay. I like a certain sound and got that with a set of flat-wounds on it.
 
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I got a '95 p bass for 300 its great if your playing alot of styles kuz its very versatile in tone. it has a very nice action and the neck makes it much more playable. its a very durable bass (mine wast hurt when my strap broke.) and it stays in tune pretty well. the p-bass has a punchyer tone but if you put the bridge pickup on 1 the kneck on ten and the tone on four it sounds just like a p-bass
 
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