"ANNOY-MAN" Microphone...

[mshilarious]

This is complete b.s. Nobody's baiting anyone. If the Neumann users (and I'm one of them) realize they have a superior piece of gear, but don't having anything positive to contribute, then they should just shut up.

As a said I don't have a Neumann, so I don't know why you'd include me in that group. Someday I hope to have a few MT Gefells though . . .

However your assertion is demonstrably incorrect. This thread was started to bait Neumann users, and the longer thread here:


http://www.homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=144769


was a Neumann baiting thread posting a clip that we had already discussed at length months earlier.

Notably:

I get flak everytime I bring this up

Thus it is the SP user that by his own admission invites the comparison with Neumann on a regular basis.

While I myself won't get into the comparison game, I will say that this certainly proves that both the B1 and the C1 are excellent sounding mics and your work won't suffer if you use them.

He won't get into the comparison game, but then implicitly makes a comparison: your work won't suffer in comparison to what?

As for diminishing returns, I am well acquainted with the concept. But even if the marginal utility of that 12th piece of pizza is less than the first piece, it still tastes pretty damn good

 

[Thurgood]

After having read most of this thread I sold my house and bought a ..... ,just kidding. What seems to be overlooked is the basic truth that most folks can't tell the difference between a great mic and a cheap mic. I'll bet that even fewer could identify what mic was used on a particular recording just by the sonics. I applaud anyone who gives good unbiased advice on equipment but to suggest that you can never make a great recording with a budget mic is totally absurd. To suggest such a thing implies that all that is necessary for excellence is a "great mic". This obviates the single most important aspect of transducer based recording and reproduction, and that is technique. As one poster states in his quote about monkeys and neves. Sure, Neumanns sound great but so do many other lower priced mics. Just for fun, stick an unpadded U-87 millimeters from a kick drum beater (play speedmetal bass pattern) grrrr. Thanks to all.

 

[slobbermonster]

I don't bash them either--I OWN some of them and occasionally use them. But if we go all the way back to the original "spark post" and listen to the sample test that was offered up anyone who's not deaf can hear a pretty big difference. I am one of those people who felt it was a BIG difference, big enough that it proved once again the inferior sound and that was with just MP3. I would imagine the WAV files sound even worse IN THAT particular test.

If I had a friend who had only $200 and that's all they could EVER SPEND in their life for a mic then I would tell them go for it on a SP or similar.(it's better than no mic) But if my friend could wait and save up for something better then I would tell them to wait.

 

[robgb]

You still really don't get the point.

Actually, it's YOU who doesn't get it. But apparently you never will.

Why even compare a budget mic to an expensive mic?

For a simple reason. To give them an ALTERNATIVE to that mic that comes close. Close enough to make them happy, yet doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

I'm certainly not trying to sell mics of any kind.

I say that if your budget is low (like most home reccers) there are many low $$ pieces of gear that will get you great sound and will help develop your experience. That is the point of a hobby, right?

Exactly. So, if a comparison is made, one that's designed to COMPARE the mics and nothing else -- like the one I linked to -- then is it really necessary for you Neumannites to blow your cork? If you know Joe Average can't afford a Neumann anyway, why bother jumping in at all? Seems to me you're being counterproductive to what this forum is all about.

But, I draw the line at trying to tell these people that a $100 mic, pre-amp, etc. will get them the same sound as a holy-grail mic. It is misleading and not true. Now, I have said this in many ways, many times and if you cannot understand what I am saying, just be happy that you have better sounding equipment than I and be happy that I lost so many $$$.

Nobody has ever suggested that the low cost stuff will get you the holy grail. That's just stupid. But you CAN get a great sound -- and you know what? -- people are doing it all the time. You're hearing it on the radio. On MTV. On CDs. People using low budget equipment. I know you don't want to believe that's true, but it is.

I think YOU need to be happy that you can afford to have high-end equipment and stop trying to sling shit at anyone who dares to compare -- in the meagerist of ways -- his crap to your gold.

 

[robgb]

It seems like you two (kv, rob) have not understood the concept of the law of diminishing returns.

It is an old and virtually universal concept, and the fact you don't understand this makes me wonder about the rest of your life experience.

You really shouldn't wonder. Life is great. I'm certainly, however, wondering about many of the clowns on this forum. Didn't mommy wean you boys properly?

 

[Thurgood]

Fair enough. Buy the best you can afford and learn to really use it well. I did not hear the original test. Is it still posted? I have done many a/b mic tests over the years, some in world class studios under great conditions ( super pre's etc.) and yes you can tell the difference in mic's (which, as you would probly agree is often not directly correlated to price). Well got to post a sound card question on another thread. See ya all later.

 

[robgb]

As a said I don't have a Neumann, so I don't know why you'd include me in that group. Someday I hope to have a few MT Gefells though . . .

However your assertion is demonstrably incorrect. This thread was started to bait Neumann users, and the longer thread here:


http://www.homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=144769


was a Neumann baiting thread posting a clip that we had already discussed at length months earlier.

Notably:



Thus it is the SP user that by his own admission invites the comparison with Neumann on a regular basis.



He won't get into the comparison game, but then implicitly makes a comparison: your work won't suffer in comparison to what?

As for diminishing returns, I am well acquainted with the concept. But even if the marginal utility of that 12th piece of pizza is less than the first piece, it still tastes pretty damn good

The thread was NOT started to bait Neumann users, no matter how you may misinterpret it. I'M a friggin' Neumann user. The flak comment was made in hopes of AVOIDING your b.s.

The ONLY point of the thread was to demonstrate that SP mics sound damn good and your music won't suffer -- as many claim it will -- from using selected LOW COST equipment. That's why I titled the thread SP AND Nuemann rather than VS.

Is that REALLY so hard to grasp? LOL. Get a sander and thin out that skull a little.

 

[acorec]

....
I think YOU need to be happy that you can afford to have high-end equipment and stop trying to sling shit at anyone who dares to compare -- in the meagerist of ways -- his crap to your gold.

I have not slung shit at anyone but you. You cannot make a cohesive argument and just run around in endless circles. It is YOU who are on the SP bandwagon trying to bully people into believing what you believe without leaving the "N" word out of it. The SP mics *in comparison* to the Neumann mics is a joke 'cause they are'nt in the same league at all.


Now, tell me how the SP mics are in sound *without* comparing them to anything other than another $100 mic. Then your comparison is totally meaningful.


SP mics are budget mics targeted towards the home recording crowd. I have no doubt that they sound great and probably far better than some other *$100* mics. That is where that ends. To assert that the SP mics are pro level tools by any stretch of the imagination is false *by design*

Get it? It is a $100 mic. Compare away and I will probably agree with you that an SP mic is far better than a Behringer mic. Same market, same *targeted* market by *design*.

 

[robgb]

Dude, I didn't make the comparison. Someone else recorded and posted that test on their website. I merely posted a link to it and said it was interesting and pointed out that SP mics sound damn good.

Then the storm blew in.

When you want to know how something sounds, it doesn't hurt to know COMPARED TO WHAT? If you can compare it to what is arguably one of the best mics out there and it STILL sounds damn good -- what god holy harm have you done?

None whatsoever. In fact, you may have SAVED someone a helluva lot of money.

 

[mshilarious]

There was another much more objective, spin-free mic test done by justharold:

http://www.homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=132869

If more tests were like that, we wouldn't have all this trolling going on.

 

[kidvybes]

Life experience...are you kidding?...

KRS says, " and the fact you don't understand this makes me wonder about the rest of your life experience."

...pretty funny having someone make a statement like that on an a "homerecording" website...I know a guy who has been making music in NY, Kingston, JA and Santiago, Chile for more than 15 years (music YOU can purchase in just about any record store in the USA) and his life experience in regard to the "Music Industry" is pretty expansive...and he just happens to have a little "home studio", so he occasionally chimes in on this website to voice his (well experienced) opinion...he's not an engineer (he hires them to assist him) and he's not a musician persay (he produces their music), but he certainly has accomplished enough to qualify as having some "street cred" in the music industry...silly to think he might have a valid point to make here on this site...(I find it ironic that I don't see the wealth of "Chinese-Mic Bashing" I see here, on the Pro-Audio Forums)...oh yeah, that guy is me...

 

[Big Kenny]

and you speak very highly of him....er..you

 

[kidvybes]

...it's not my intention to use this website to post a resume, but when someone decides to link someone else's valid point of view (that he doesn't share) to the quality of the opinioned person's "Life Experience", I found it neccessary to, in a very brief paragraph, to chime in on that nonsense!...(and yeah...I'm his biggest fan!)

 

[punkin]

Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann, Neumann

I'll bet that was annouying!

I'm feeling better now thanks.

 

[donkeystyle]

KRS says, " and the fact you don't understand this makes me wonder about the rest of your life experience."

...pretty funny having someone make a statement like that on an a "homerecording" website...I know a guy who has been making music in NY, Kingston, JA and Santiago, Chile for more than 15 years (music YOU can purchase in just about any record store in the USA) and his life experience in regard to the "Music Industry" is pretty expansive...and he just happens to have a little "home studio", so he occasionally chimes in on this website to voice his (well experienced) opinion...he's not an engineer (he hires them to assist him) and he's not a musician persay (he produces their music), but he certainly has accomplished enough to qualify as having some "street cred" in the music industry...silly to think he might have a valid point to make here on this site...(I find it ironic that I don't see the wealth of "Chinese-Mic Bashing" I see here, on the Pro-Audio Forums)...oh yeah, that guy is me...

i've yet to see this chinese mic bashing you speak of and i come here a lot. I have seen people get pissy about comparing neumanns to SP's and other chinese mics, which is ridiculous, pointless, and an insult to the consumers intelligence. all the consumer needs to know is how soandso's mic compares to other mics in their price range.

there are plenty of people on this site that think that most new neumann products suck, but there are some that don't think so. both groups deserve their opinion.

oh and i've also never seen anyone come in here and say that you can't get a good recording with chinese mics and you have to use neumanns or telefunkens to get decent results.......well, except trolls like yourself.

yes this website is called homerecording.com and I think that it covers homerecording perfectly, and it also lets you know what is available if you have a little bit more to spend. That's helpful.........threads like this aren't.

oh and if you want to see some info and opinions on some more chinese mics and are in-capable of using the search function as you seem to be, you can just go click on the microphone faq thread. another helpful thread...................................................................................................................................................................................................................unlike this thread.

ps. this is one of the very few times that i agree with DJL. i may even give him some rep points.

 

[kidvybes]

here's the point...

Prince has sold millions of records (and sold out arenas and movie theatres all over the world) playing and recording with a $200. Telecaster copy-guitar (in the movie "Purple Rain" and still in use on his most recent sell-out tour)...many guitarists will tell you that the Hohner Tele-copy is not as good as the genuine vintage Fender Tele (doesn't have the tone, sustain and feel of the original)...no one argues that point because the musician used the tool to the best advantage of the art...he make great music without worrying about the name on the headstock...there are thousands of capable young musicians making garage music on $100. mics, a few of whom will actually get a record contract and a career as a result...some may even chose to continue to use their "favorite" mic...that's called "artistic license"
...there are lots of "war stories" in the best studios in the world, about how this singer recorded his platinum-selling album using a common stage mic, rather than the vintage LD mic available...or how that artist refused to wear headphones will laying a vocal track, so the instrumental tracks were allowed to "leak" into the final vocal track...it's an art not a science...the science facilitates the art, but should never control or dictate limitations on the art...
only the artist can allow him/herself to be limited in the creation of their own art by a predisposition like "the mic's not good enough"...silly...

 

[acorec]

"...he's not an engineer (he hires them to assist him) and he's not a musician persay (he produces their music), but he certainly has accomplished enough to qualify as having some "street cred" in the music industry...



You're like kidding? I guess with credentials like these, any mics will do. The only question is how cheap you can get them.


BTW I am not a carpenter (I hire them to assist me) and not a craftsman (I hire them too) but I am qualified to select what tools they should use on their jobs. They all listen to me cause I know so much.

 

[krs]

Kidvybes WTF you're flogging a dead horse.

You should backoff and realise different people have different needs and different budgets. You don't see anyone else coming in hear telling everybody to stop talking about SP mics. I guarantee you SP mics are unsuitable for my preferred genre (Classical).

Live and let live, this is a spat you picked and will not win - besides which you make yourself look like an asshole if you can't hear the obvious differences between (even lower end) Neumann and SP mics.

 

[Big Kenny]

Soooooooooooo.....Prince is your favorite guitar player?

 

[noisedude]

Ah crap. Another one of these threads. I guess I'm obliged to also come in and fail to stop the argument whilst also agreeing with just about everybody and still saving a bit of breath to finish with a happy smiley