A Mental Singing Lesson

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smellyfuzz

smellyfuzz

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Well,

Back a couple of years ago, when I first started acquiring recording equipment, we (the band) recorded a song. This song was a vocal challenge for me, not out of my range, but it did top it off.

We hit record, and a singing I went. I wanted this to be the all time best vocal track ever put down in history. I want everyone to say,"holy shit, can that guy sing".

So I sang harder then ever before. I hit notes that few people on the planet could. I was a male Mariah Carey... so I thought.

Really, this tune was simply to test out the new equipment, so we let a lot go. I also was and still am in the process of learning how to track & mix. Be that as it may, I still wanted the vocal to be super impressive. SUPER IMPRESSIVE !

Well guess what, most people who heard the tune, absolutely hated the lead vox. I was crushed. They said things like, the voice is to high. Your off key. You sound like your straining. I did not see where I went wrong.

A long discussion took place with my keyboard player on this problem, "where did I go wrong," I asked. "I mean I KNOW I can sing. "
He proposed a theory. He said, "Look at Kenny Rodgers, He has no range at all, but his voice sells, big time. People love it."

This got me thinking about all the singers I love that have a very limited range. Like James Taylor, shitty range, but what a voice.

Not to make excuses, but part of the problem was that I did not know how to record vocals.

Most of the problem was ego. I was OVER SINGING on this song. Yes, over singing. A term I recently heard.

Think about it, how many divas are out there, where every song they sing is just so, so over the top. It IMHO sounds like crap. I've always felt that. Yea they can sing big time, but their attitude just ruins it for me. Every song is "look how great I am." Horrible.

Ironically/saddly, I did the same thing. Lost control of my ego. BUT, I did learn an very valuable lesson, all songs I NOW sing, I tone it down, drop the key a bit if I can, and never try to be impressive. Just sing the song. With emotion of course, but no arrogance.

AND, I has already paid off.
The last few tunes I've showed, the first response from some one is usually, "nice voice."


Sean
 
I have had the same response after laying down what I thought was an incredible guitar solo. I guess the old adage of less is best is often the case when laying down tracks. I consider the situation that you described to be an important part of the learning process for all artists.
 
smellyfuzz said:
...I did learn an very valuable lesson, all songs I NOW sing, I tone it down, drop the key a bit if I can, and never try to be impressive. Just sing the song. With emotion of course, but no arrogance...
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I learnt alot from yours too, fuzz... :) Cool experience, thanks for sharing it... :cool:

;)
Jaymz
 
smellyfuzz said:
Think about it, how many divas are out there, where every song they sing is just so, so over the top. It IMHO sounds like crap. I've always felt that. Yea they can sing big time, but their attitude just ruins it for me. Every song is "look how great I am." Horrible.
Click to expand...

Couldnt agree more, some singer or even the listeners themselves should learn that at most times, 'less is more'.

Managing to scream on every note and put extra syllable(s) on each and every word is just annoying. Not to mention extra choke,grunt, yell and those mincing-wincing face and make strange hand gestures... :rolleyes:
 
The singer who actually sings the WORDS will more effectively
emote than the one who shows off.
They are "into" character.

This is the main reason that Celine, Whitney (most stuff), Mariah,
etc. fail to excite me.
Whereas female singers like Aretha, Dusty, Patsy, etc. are among my faves.

Chris

P.S. Those guilty of R&B melismatic misdemeanors should
listen to Sam Cooke and Aretha as part of their probation! :)
(to help learn how it's done)
 
I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds the vocal delivery of the aforementioned ladies way over the top.
Dusty Springfield, what a great voice. It's a shame she didn't continue making hits into the 70's.
 
i suppose i ought to chime in. my take on this is that the goal is to sing as honestly as possible, and that if you do so, you won't have a chance to overdramatize or slack off too badly. that said, it's really easy at times, especially when already having your ego stroked, to push yourself in a way that comes out both as unnatural and unconvincing. i think that in many cases, the reason that i am unmoved by many pop musicians' vocals is that they simply do not have a REAL personal connection to a song. they were coached on it, but the words don't really mean anything other than a meal ticket to them. i personally do not sing songs that don't move me greatly. while this limits my song choices somewhat (not THAT badly, the amount of culture i receive expands my potential songs to sing, even when my writing is slacking), it usually guarantees that if i am in a fairly lucid state, i will be capable of really MEANING it when i sing. i hope that is clear enough, as it seems to make sense to me.
 
zer0sig said:
i suppose i ought to chime in. my take on this is that the goal is to sing as honestly as possible, and that if you do so, you won't have a chance to overdramatize or slack off too badly. that said, it's really easy at times, especially when already having your ego stroked, to push yourself in a way that comes out both as unnatural and unconvincing. i think that in many cases, the reason that i am unmoved by many pop musicians' vocals is that they simply do not have a REAL personal connection to a song. they were coached on it, but the words don't really mean anything other than a meal ticket to them. i personally do not sing songs that don't move me greatly. while this limits my song choices somewhat (not THAT badly, the amount of culture i receive expands my potential songs to sing, even when my writing is slacking), it usually guarantees that if i am in a fairly lucid state, i will be capable of really MEANING it when i sing. i hope that is clear enough, as it seems to make sense to me.
Click to expand...

It makes plenty of sense to me. I sound twice as good when I just try to convey the message of the song rather than concentrate on diction, tone, etc. If I can identify with what a song is saying, I can sing it so much better.
 
something that i do commonly when I'm singing is close my eyes for the song and make my own "music video" using past experiences. Anyone else do this?
 
Yeah Axis, I do a similar thing myself, usually with sad songs. I picture a moment in my past that was very sad, that also relates to the subject of the song I am singing.
 
morindae said:
Yeah Axis, I do a similar thing myself, usually with sad songs. I picture a moment in my past that was very sad, that also relates to the subject of the song I am singing.
Click to expand...

This is a pretty common acting tool known as emotional recall. A way of getting to a highly emotional place on stage without seeming forced. We were encouraged to use it in acting school on top of proper breathing. The technical and emotional aspects of combining the two often made performing a little schizophrenic but the goal was that eventually the breathing part would become second nature and then every moment, no matter how frantic, would be supported by your breath. Unlearning bad habits was emphasized over and again as well as getting to know yourself and the tricks you use in performance. A lot of what was taught there was downright silly in my opinion but it is amazing what you can learn if you simply pay attention to yourself.

-b
 
terocious,
Your comments made me think of something else along the mental singing subject. The group I'm in does 50-60 bookings in 8 months every year. Lot's of times after doing a song 100 times you get to where your mind can be miles away and still not miss a word on the song. This is bad in a way because the performance of the song has no emotion in it. You really have to discipline yourself to always think about what the song is saying even though you've done it 100 times. Did they teach you any techniques to use along these lines?
 
kdgospel,
I can almost hear my teachers responding to this question with "stay in the moment and tell the story." Which is difficult when as you said you know something so well you can do it in your sleep. Keeping it fresh and interesting for yourself was also emphasized but this is difficult within a large group structure where any deviation could throw a clog in the gears. You can certainly change up the image parade which accompanys a song in your mind and a good physical warm up before a performance can serve to energize you. Sometimes it helps me to remember that these words I am saying/singing for the umpteenth time are brand new to an audience. Sorry I don't have anything more for you than that. Most of the performance related concepts were pretty ambiguous and either worked for you or didn't. If they didn't you were on your own.

-b
 
This is actually an interesting topic that as far as singers are concerned, doesn't get talked about as much as it should. You've actually given us some good info terocious.
 
terocious said:
kdgospel,
Sometimes it helps me to remember that these words I am saying/singing for the umpteenth time are brand new to an audience.
-b
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I think this is the key. I am gonna keep this in mind at our next gig. Thanks a lot.
 
Coming from another vein

I was in a group where I didnt get to write the song lyrics. I tried my best to get into "the story" of the song but the lyrics were so ponderous that I even had a hard time comitting the lyric to memory. Just about all the songs went along this way. I stayed with the group for about 4 months trying my best to "get" the songs. I finally had to quit the group because I just couldn't relate to the songs emotionally on any level. Im no purist but to me a song has to have something in it that grabs you.
Heck one of these songs had a word in it that I didn't know the meaning of. Threnody. What the heck is a threnody?

My point (if I really have one at all) is that a singer has to be able to feel the lyric to be able to express it in a way that it will move people. It is what defines the song IMHO
 
I agree with you totally hottrocker. The only way that I've found to learn songs like you are talking about is record them while reading the words and then listen to the recording over and over and over and over.........
 
Originally posted by hottrocker
Heck one of these songs had a word in it that I didn't know the meaning of. Threnody. What the heck is a threnody?
Click to expand...

That is hilarious, I'm laughing my ass off at that. Four months of Threnody, you really are a patient man hottrocker. The guy that wrote that probably needs to attend a lyric writing class.
Of course, you're quite correct. In most cases the singer and the audience have to have some kind if connection with the lyric, although Jon Anderson of Yes seemed to do quite well without making any sense. How about Boy George and his Karma Chameleon. What was that about. :)
 
smellyfuzz said:


So I sang harder then ever before. I hit notes that few people on the planet could. I was a male Mariah Carey... so I thought.
Click to expand...

I was about to say man, before I read the replies...why would you wanna sound like a pregnant cat? Her voice is mad annoying, she's obviously talented no doubt, but all that warbling? Nah, I'll take a raincheck, maybe bite off my fingers and stick 'em in my ears! I hate all that stuff, it ain't called for, these entertainers are more like torture experts or something, it's worst when they take a real classic (someone mentioned Sam Cooke) and they absolutely murder it beyond repair by completely overdoing it, I think the word is sacrilidge? I can't bear to see someone do that, I don't like cover versions of Beatles tracks and Sinartra songs anyways because I think trying to perfect perfection is a fruitless exercise (unless you take it and make something completely original from it, not just yodel and welp like a pain stricken animal) So nah as you can tell, I ain't feeling all that garbage.

smellyfuzz said:
"I mean I KNOW I can sing. "
He proposed a theory. He said, "Look at Kenny Rodgers, He has no range at all, but his voice sells, big time. People love it."

This got me thinking about all the singers I love that have a very limited range. Like James Taylor, shitty range, but what a voice.
Click to expand...

Exactly, that's what I'm trying to do find what's special about my thing and develop that. I mean look at Bob Dylan, some people hate his voice, (I personally love it) but there isn't anyone who can deny he isn't an absolute stone wall legend. He'll be in the history books for centuries. His vocal range probably is limited, I know he has trememdous melody in his delivery. he once said, "Don't talk to me about folk like Fabian, I don't wanna hear no Fabian man, I'm a better singer than Fabian and I can hold my breath three times longer if I wanted to." He was a very good singer, just like Neil Young is, but the people who have trouble seeing past certain details like voice tone always come round or just learn to live with. Sure they say, "Dylan's to croaky" or "Neil Young's too high pitched" but they still buy thier records to this day and if they don't...millions of others will. So my point is, you know you can sing, you are probably technically better than both of those artist in the voice dept. But let that be an example of someone who wasn't blessed with skills and were still determined to do the damn thing. Go for it, what's holding ya back? Hopefully it's not Mariah Carey, aight? Lolz... Pz.
 
Hello All, (First post in this section of the bbs.)

I'm interested to hear someones take on Tom Waits?
Under selling it? Over selling it? Or just doing his own thing?

If there is a patron saint of singing determination I'd have to say it's him. :)

( To me, guys like Dylan (of course), Louie Armstrong, Jimmi Hendrix and Jerry Garcia really found a way to provide a song with simple unique emotion over stellar technique .
It seems they mastered "Being the song" as opposed to just "Singing it".... IMHO some singers can make you "Feel" the song and others ( Such as the current gaggle of "Performers" that sound like a Bapist church service on steroids in the midst of a nervous breakdown) are more like just "Hearing" it.
(Or flourishes of vocal technique set to "Music". )
But then again..., Whatever floats boats.

Interesting topic BTW
 
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