$10 to $15,000 Rap vocal recording studio building budget

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Harlem143

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I have $10 to $15,000 to purchase a Hip Hop/Rap Vocal (only) recording studio. I have a list of items I have my eyes on but would like opinions before I go all in. Great Advice will be respected. I will from time to time have an engineer over but not often. No Beats will be made here. A sample may be redone via instrument but that's about it.

Mic Preamp: Avalon VT 737sp
Mic: Rode NT-1A & MXL 3000
DAW: Pro tools 9 with digi 003 rack
Power Conditioner: Monster Power Pro 2500 power center
Computer/Laptop: 2011 MacBook Pro 8GB
Mic Stand: K&M Tripod mic stand w/boom
Monitor Speakers: KRK Rokit 6 (2 speakers)
Reflection Filter: SE Reflexion filter
External HD: Glyph (GT050Q) 1TB
Acoustic padding

I won't forget Cables & things in that nature. I feel a Control Center isn't really needed when most engineering of songs & albums will be done out house anyway. Am I GOOD or NO?? PLEASE LET ME KNOW!!!! Because I'm going shopping next month. My ppl be wasting money in Professional Studios so now I'm hustling in another aspect as a boss...

Thanks!!!!!
 
I would make sure to do a lot of research on the acoustic treatment as foam or thin padding will only deaden the high frequencies, and won't affect the low frequencies. Since it is vocals only, you won't need treatment that goes all the way down to 50 Hz, but you will definitely need some that at least touch 80 Hz and go up from there. Not having a properly treated room in the low end while recording vocals can give really thin or really boomy recordings depending on the placement of the mic.

I would also run a lot of tests talking into the mic to find the absolute best position for the microphone and keep it there. If it is in an odd spot, you can just mark the area on the ground with tape or whatever so you can place it back in the same spot after you move it.
 
As someone who has learned from experience, from advice from people who know what they are talking about (like above^^), you will be best off placing a good chunk of your investment in room treatment. It does not matter if you are just recording vocals man. You need to be able to mix/record them in a room that does not falsely influence your mixes. Thus, you need a fully treated/tested room, in order to have the ability to judge mixes correctly, and have them translate. Even with a square room, $500 in DIY treatment will give substantial results.

Unless, your only goal is to record vocals, then send them somewhere else for mixing..That is quite a different topic, though, you will want to have better control of the room than a simple SE Reflection Filter. The larger the room, the better for vocals of any type.

Size of your room is very important here. You should specify....


SE Reflection Filter - maybe ok for demo's, but not ideal, especially with a condenser mic like the NT1a. It is way sensitive, and will pick up everything in your room, regardless of the position of the SE filter. I would suggest dynamic for an untreated room.
KRK RPG 6 - maybe good for reference, but not so great for mixing.
Acoustic padding? - Not sure what that means. There are great, not so great, and absolutely worthless forms of absorption materials.

The rest of your posted items seem sound. Just realize that it ain't the gear that makes it sound good. It is the room, and the talent that makes for 95% of what 'works'. That is not BS from someone trying to sell you something. That is the TRUTH!

Though, I am just some dood who cares, on a forum that you are not familiar with. I could be some troll who is making stuff up. I am not.

Your best bet is to do extensive research on all of the above topics, before spending any money. Taking just one opinion, is wasting your own money.
 
+1 on GIK's answer -- PROPER acoustic treatment (GIK being a purveyor of some rather nice stuff themselves) is one of the most important and most overlooked part of any recording rig.

As is the monitoring chain... I'd step WAY up over Rock-it 6's...

Cut corners anywhere you want -- Never on your monitoring and never on properly treating the space.


Personal taste on some of the other stuff -- I can't even imagine recording aggressive vocals without some sort of reasonably heavy, slow, large diaphragm dynamic. Shure's SM7b is very high on a very short list there. EV's new RE320 I hear (no pun intended) does a decent job also. The RE27 is always a good choice there also. A less intrusive preamp -- Grace's m101, True's P-Solo -- Something that's actually going to sound the same every time you turn it on and that avoids a whole bunch of circuitry. Avalon's M5 (by far, the best preamp they make, IMO) wouldn't be a bad choice there either.

I'd pass on the MXL personally. The NT1a is a great mic to have around -- Not nearly as overly-sensitive as most LDC (although you'll probably find yourself using a LDD much more often).

The DAW is going to make about as much of a difference as the color of the walls, as will the stand and drives and what not.

The super-important money is in the monitoring and the room -- Obviously the interface is going to be somewhat vital, but I'd assume the 003 is capable without needing a better clock.

Sorry for the messy train of thought - It's been a long week and I probably need :drunk:
 
Thank you all for the knowledge & insight. That's why I'm here to gain some better understanding on this investment.
 
Hey there.
You've got some good advice here.

Just to add to it, I'd ditch the digi 003, especially if you're just doing solo vocals.
It has way more IO than you're likely to need, it's overpriced, the preamps aren't that nice, and it's not needed for Pro Tools anymore.

If you just need line inputs, take a look at some cheaper interface/converters.
I think echo do a two channel line input interface, for example.

Now, if you plan to expand and record drums kits and stuff, that's a different story, but if not, I'd cut back. :)


Few people mentioned it there; Focus your research on acoustic treatment.
Even if you don't look at it mathematically, just having a few 4" rockwool gobos to hand can make a massive difference in a bad room.
The reflection filter might help with this, but depending how expensive they are, you might save a bit of cash doing the above.

I learned that recently. :facepalm:
I built 4x 1200x600x100mm panels for about £40.


EDIT:
I'd tack the MD421 onto Massive's list because it's great, and sometimes you see them cheaper than the others on ebay.
 
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I find it interesting that you have so much money to invest in your studio but you've chosen such low-cost microphones.
They will work, but you gotta remember that the microphone is the first point of entry into your vocal chain.

I'm not a Hip-Hop kind of guy but I agree with one writer above about the possibility of using a "Dynamic" mic for vocals as opposed to using a "Condensor" such as a Shure SM7B or the Heil Pro 35? or 40. However, I've seen people using the $2000 BLUE MICROPHONES "KIWI" and the $1000 AKG C414, both of which are Large Diaphragm Condensors.

Consider using the "Search" Function on this Forum and type in "Microphone Rap" then perhaps "Channel Strip Rap" or "PreAmp Rap".

And as far as the Avalon 737 Channel Strip? Is that best for Hip Hop? Not sure. It uses tubes but it might not have the Tube Quality or Personality of the Universal Audio LA-610 Channel Strip.

The Focusrite Liquid Saffire 56 might be a good interface to use as opposed to the Digi-003 as it is compatible with Pro-Tools and has 2 channels of some very nice preamp emulations of the Avalon, Neve, Universal Audio and others plus it has 8 channels of preamplification PLUS 8 "Line Ins" plus tons of digital Input/Output Options.

Perhaps just purchase the Highly Rated $2000 Focusrite Liquid Saffire Channel Strip where you can mix or match preamps with compressors and eqs?

No matter what choices you make, be sure to have fun! :thumbs up:
 
Massive Master said:
+1 on GIK's answer -- PROPER acoustic treatment (GIK being a purveyor of some rather nice stuff themselves)
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Thank you for the compliments. We try!

Massive Master said:
+1 on GIK's answer -- PROPER acoustic treatment (GIK being a purveyor of some rather nice stuff themselves) is one of the most important and most overlooked part of any recording rig.

Cut corners anywhere you want -- Never on your monitoring and never on properly treating the space.
Click to expand...

Absolutely agree. And as someone who has previously owned Rokits I would suggest the same as you did, though if you're really ONLY using them for reference and not for mixing at all then they aren't bad. But even there, it makes more sense to go with HS50ms as they still help more people achieve more accurate mixes just in case you need to use them in that context. Rokits are completely useless IMO in a mixing sense. They don't translate at all. They do sound great though for general listening.

Steenamaroo said:
Few people mentioned it there; Focus your research on acoustic treatment.
Even if you don't look at it mathematically, just having a few 4" rockwool gobos to hand can make a massive difference in a bad room.
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+1
 
i would go with the KRK 8's if your doing rap. i will be purchasing the same. i will also be goin with the matching 10" sub for the extra 225 watts. It makes a big difference. my buddy has it in his stuio and i love it.
 
GIK Acoustics said:
Thank you for the compliments. We try!



Absolutely agree. And as someone who has previously owned Rokits I would suggest the same as you did, though if you're really ONLY using them for reference and not for mixing at all then they aren't bad. But even there, it makes more sense to go with HS50ms as they still help more people achieve more accurate mixes just in case you need to use them in that context. Rokits are completely useless IMO in a mixing sense. They don't translate at all. They do sound great though for general listening.



+1
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Since a new guy brought it up again, I will agree; The KRK Rockit line is not ideal for mixing IMO. They are just not 'clear'. Great for cranking it out for the guys while tracking drums. I don't rely on them anymore for mixing tho...
 
If you want to get NT-1a, get this:
Award-winning microphone engineering from Michael Joly
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Wow! Thanks. I have one. Guess I'll have to get this mod done. Great.
 
I feel a Control Center isn't really needed when most engineering of songs & albums will be done out house anyway
Click to expand...
.

My ppl be wasting money in Professional Studios so now I'm hustling in another aspect as a boss...
Click to expand...


ummm...isn't that a bit of a contradiction? First you say that most of the recording will be done "out of house"...and then say your "ppl" be wasting money in Professional Studios"..

Could you clarify that? It doesn't make any sense.
 
chronicle said:
ummm...isn't that a bit of a contradiction? First you say that most of the recording will be done "out of house"...and then say your "ppl" be wasting money in Professional Studios"..

Could you clarify that? It doesn't make any sense.
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I think he means he's not going to mix in an out house any more. :eek:
 
jimmys69 said:
Since a new guy brought it up again, I will agree; The KRK Rockit line is not ideal for mixing IMO. They are just not 'clear'. Great for cranking it out for the guys while tracking drums. I don't rely on them anymore for mixing tho...
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I mix on them all the time...theyre not perfect but nothing in that price range is, more important to know your monitors than worry about whats the best in the sub $500 market imo
 
kcearl said:
I mix on them all the time...theyre not perfect but nothing in that price range is, more important to know your monitors than worry about whats the best in the sub $500 market imo
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I agree, though the Yamaha's HS series are usually quite touted for being the best speakers for mixing in their price range, by far. I don't really love the sound of them, but people crank out mixes on them all day. I just replied about the KRKs from my own experience. I owned them for 4 years, definitely understood them and cranked out many mixes on them. But, truth be told - when I got new monitors, my mixes instantly translated with much less fuss..just my own experience.
 
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