Group tracks

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davecg321

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When I set up a group track should it be mono or stereo?

Thanks
 
davecg321 said:
When I set up a group track should it be mono or stereo?

Thanks
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Do you mean something like an aux or summing bus or lots of other names. My DAW doesn't use that term, so perhaps a little more info about your DAW and what the "group" is comprised of would help the less universally omniscient respond...

FWIW, generally anytime you send/sum multiple tracks to any other output you'd make that stereo so you could retain or add panning to the individual tracks. (In case that's what you are doing.)
 
'Tell ya something interesting I learned -in Sonar but I suspect it might be fairly typical.
All track and bus paths, are dual path. i.e. stereo capable. Even if they're "mono".

Once you think about it, how stereo inserts act on a mono track act for example..
In your (other) DAW's do you have to 'pick mono vs stereo on a bus?
 
mixsit said:
'Tell ya something interesting I learned -in Sonar but I suspect it might be fairly typical.
All track and bus paths, are dual path. i.e. stereo capable. Even if they're "mono".

Once you think about it, how stereo inserts act on a mono track act for example..
In your (other) DAW's do you have to 'pick mono vs stereo on a bus?
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In Vegas Pro an audio track can have mixed mono and stereo audio clips. The inserts are dual path even if you there's no stereo audio clip.

In Pro Tools a track is either mono or stereo. If you add an insert that has stereo output the path becomes stereo from that point and the track controls reflect the change (from one to two pan knobs). It's a pain because you can't change the order of the plugins if it means moving a mono effect to a position after a stereo effect.

In PT when setting up an effects loop or submix group you have to specify whether it's a mono or stereo path.
 
In Cubase, my groups are stereo - because they come after the pans, but I only use them when I intend adding processing, otherwise I now use VCAs
 
rob aylestone said:
In Cubase, my groups are stereo - because they come after the pans, but I only use them when I intend adding processing, otherwise I now use VCAs
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I'm using Cubase too. So use stereo if panning has been applied to the tracks being sent to the groups?

How do VCA and Group tracks differ?

tah
 
VCA controls tracks before they're mixed together. Submix groups let you control or apply effects to a group of tracks after they've been mixed together.
 
I use the VCA tracks slightly differently. I tend to have the individual tracks EQ'd, perhaps with some dynamics and different reverbs, plus panned appropriately. My kind of stuff means that I'll have maybe 20-30 tracks - I'll probably have 6 or 7 drum tracks - but also blocks of woodwinds, brass and strings. When I'm mixing, I've got a nice balance between say the violin1 ,violin2, violas, cellos and basses - plus sometimes different articulations - so maybe some scratchy stuff and tremolo strings. All balanced together sounding nice - BUT - at various points in the song, I want to mover that cluster of faders up and down together - retaining the balance of the section. In Cubase, you just highlight the tracks in that cluster, then allocate them to a VCA group. A new fader appears, and pushing the fader up or down, physically moves the faders in the selected tracks. Very handy. No audio routing of any kind - just an extra fader that can move all the individual faders up or down together. Groups are similar - but take the audio from each channel, as balanced by the Pan control, and sum these into a shared fader that has audio running through it - which means you can slap overall reverb onto it to process the entire number of channels grouped to it. On live sound mixers, VCAs are very useful for the same reasons. Lots of novices can't work out why they cannot insert dynamics and eq onto VCAs - as they seem to do pretty much the same as groups. I just treat VCAs as remote controls for other faders.
 
Ah. A VCA is like a "folder stack" in Logic Pro X (which is what it says in the manual, now that I've read it :rolleyes:). I always use summing stacks, which are like groups. I guess I don't see a reason not to...
 
davecg321 said:
I'm using Cubase too. So use stereo if panning has been applied to the tracks being sent to the groups? ...
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When you add or make' a new bus in Cubase does it ask yoo to pick (or require to pick) if it's 'mono only or stereo'?
 
On an analog console VCA means voltage controlled amplifier. The faders didn't pass audio, they controlled voltage to a voltage controlled amplifier that did the attenuating. You could assign a channel to a VCA group. A master fader would control all the faders in the group, acting as a voltage multiplier. The channel faders could all be adjusted by a given dB value. The advantage of a VCA group over a mix group was that it was upstream of the post-fader aux sends, so your reverb would respond in a natural way.

In a DAW VCA is often referred to as a virtual control amplifier. In Pro Tools there's a group function, which I think is just called group, not to be confused with clip grouping.
 
In Cubase, I wouldn't see any need for a 'MONO' group myself. Yes, there is the option though.

Usually I will use a group for say all acoustic guitars. There may be several groups before the main group. They can be routed to multiples.

Like say the Drum group may only have the kick/snare/toms/routed to it to send to a parallel compression FX bus. But you wouldn't likely want that on your overheads. But you can then still add another group channel after that has output from oh's and the drum group so you can control the whole level of the kit at once. Just send the groups to the new group.

Hope that made any sense....
 
Toastedgoat said:
I’ve never used a mono group track, in a DAW.
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I neither. Anytime I send to a group, it is because I want it to be stereo. I find it annoying that the default comes up as mono.

Though I am sure that is a totally different animal when using a mixer and outboard gear.
 
Yeah I never use a mono group personally and I can't think of a time where I would. Maybe all the lead vocals or something?

I was actually so used to not having VCA faders that I never incorporated it into my workflow, however I know how they work and why I should be using them. lol
 
Guitargodgt said:
Yeah I never use a mono group personally and I can't think of a time where I would. Maybe all the lead vocals or something?

I was actually so used to not having VCA faders that I never incorporated it into my workflow, however I know how they work and why I should be using them. lol
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BTW, I am kind of liking C10. Had to remove the program fully once because opening of a older file only gave me option to open with C8 or C10. No C9 option. That freaked me out.

Upon second download of the software that hasn't happened. But still have 5 projects that I will finish in 9 before I move forward. Maybe 9 months....:)
 
jimmys69 said:
Though I am sure that is a totally different animal when using a mixer and outboard gear.
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I've been messing with a Behringer X32 with my cousin, they are upgrading thier house of worship system (because what they have is serious garbage). Mono mix groups seem like a good idea to me for monitoring live situations where you are limited on physical outputs. So yeah they have thier place definitely.

I can't believe I actually REALLY like a behringer product. We were going to get the version 3 Presonus 24, but it was $500 more and quite literally everyone I asked and he asked recommended the X32.

The thing is so damn good I kind of want to snag a Xtouch compact for my home studio. The faders are miles better than the old Mackie control I had and all the controls feel pretty damn good (I had the old one, not the MCU pro which I'm sure is better).
 
jimmys69 said:
BTW, I am kind of liking C10. Had to remove the program fully once because opening of a older file only gave me option to open with C8 or C10. No C9 option. That freaked me out.

Upon second download of the software that hasn't happened. But still have 5 projects that I will finish in 9 before I move forward. Maybe 9 months....:)
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm not upgrading anytime soon, I really like to wait for the first or second update. The initial release always feels like a beta.
 
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