compression starting spots

[nate_dennis]

So I know you all hate it (as do I) when people say "how do I sound like 'insert famous band with huge budget here.'" But I do wonder about how you chose where you are going to START with compression. You know, do you start at a specific ratio when you are recording acoustic and then alter it as needed? Or are you starting flat and trying to find the "sweet spot" from scratch each time? In other words: I know there are no magic settings that work for all, but do you have a generic ballpark that you start at each time? The question isn't acoustic guitar driven, that was just an example. Thanks for you input.

 

[Daniel | Davis]

I'd also like to know the answer to this question. The common response is "there is no answer," and I understand that, but I'm curious to what people's personal preference is to start out with-given on the situation.

 

[Erockrazor]

You guys should take the time that you spent posting this and go fiddle with your compression settings on your DAW.

Load any track and figure out what you want to do using the compression. Then experiment and see if you can hear how each parameter functions.

Do you guys know the functions of each parameter? That's a good place to start. Here's a primer for compression taken from the ultimate newbie thread.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/showpost.php?p=3143502&postcount=1

To figure out what settings to use, you need an intended purpose for the settings or else you'll be shooting for nothing. If you want to add a little more punch to a fast transient, start with a very low ms attack speed. If you want to fatten up a sustained sound, try making the release longer and threshold lower (but not too low or else you'll begin to get distortion,unless you want that!).

Compression is not easy to hear at first, so don't be discouraged. Keep listening and it will start to click.

There are some presets that can give you an idea for how some particular instruments compression parameters may be set. But I think it bears saying, if it doesn't sound good without compression .. chances are it won't sound good with it.

Good luck, Eric.

 

[legionserial]

I start with whatever settings the compressor is on when I start and go from there. I know that's not much of an answer, but I just twiddle the knobs until it does what I want it to. Obviously it helps that I know what the knobs do and I have a rough idea what I want to do with it otherwise I wouldn't use the thing, but.....

I think the best way to decide what to do and where to start with your compressor is to ask yourself why you think the track needs it.

I generally try to avoid using compression. Not that I have anything against it, just that way I only use it when it needs it. The only thing I compress every time without fail is bass guitar, but I'm sure there'll be an occasion when I don't .

 

[Greg_L]

So I know you all hate it (as do I) when people say "how do I sound like 'insert famous band with huge budget here.'" But I do wonder about how you chose where you are going to START with compression. You know, do you start at a specific ratio when you are recording acoustic and then alter it as needed? Or are you starting flat and trying to find the "sweet spot" from scratch each time? In other words: I know there are no magic settings that work for all, but do you have a generic ballpark that you start at each time? The question isn't acoustic guitar driven, that was just an example. Thanks for you input.

Why do you think you need compression? If you don't know what it does or how it works, then it's best to stay away from it. I think compressors are the most misunderstood and over-used tool in the box. Spend a lot of time playing with a compressor's different parameters until you can clearly hear and understand why it works the way it does. Only then will you be able to use one effectively.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

But I do wonder about how you chose where you are going to START with compression.

I think you gotta start with IDing exactly why you are applying the compression to begin with; i.e. what is the problem you are trying to solve? Answering that'll give you half the answer right there; you'll already have a pretty good idea of whether you're going to want/need to limit, generally re-shape the sound, or apply some gentle peak control, giving you an idea of general threshold settings and ratio ranges. From there you can fine tune.

It's similar for the A&R settings; knowing how to set those is entirely dependent on knowing the resulting sound or effect you want. but a common start line is either "medium" or "auto" settings for each, moving on from there.

Of course this requires understanding the compressor and compression to the point of knowing which kind of general ranges for each control work well for what kinds of effects. I'd start by reading "Compression Uncompressed" on my website, and then continue and finish with lots and lots of hands-on practice.

G.

 

[nate_dennis]

If you don't know what it does or how it works, then it's best to stay away from it.

I understand what they do and, in general, how they do it. I guess I was just more looking to see where other people start. I've never used one. I own one, but haven't messed with it yet, and honestly, I'm not sure I'm going to use it much, but I'd like to know how to effectively use all of the tools at my disposal.

Thanks for all they responses.

 

[Dogbreath]

My thoughts are...

Read the section in Glen's tutorial like he posted above and then start twiddling.

When I started learning comp, I'd just twist knobs to their extreme and listen to what it did. That's about the best advice I can give.

Compression, when applied right (imho anyway) won't be something you hear. If you hear it pumping, it's too much. I try to keep my comp as more of a glue instead of an effect. Which is not to say that alot of real pro type dudes don't use it as an effect. They do. They just understand it better than me.

Twiddle baby!

 

[Simman]

My thoughts are...

Read the section in Glen's tutorial like he posted above and then start twiddling.

When I started learning comp, I'd just twist knobs to their extreme and listen to what it did. That's about the best advice I can give.

Compression, when applied right (imho anyway) won't be something you hear. If you hear it pumping, it's too much. I try to keep my comp as more of a glue instead of an effect. Which is not to say that alot of real pro type dudes don't use it as an effect. They do. They just understand it better than me.

Twiddle baby!

I agree with you. But, I find the final mix always ends up sounding better when you start with everything turned all the way to the left

 

[mixsit]

.. If you want to add a little more punch to a fast transient, start with a very low ms attack speed..

Hmm. To accentuate attack, I think 'open the attack to let the transient through, then clamp down.
But then 'punch can mean different things at times.

 

[TimOBrien]

Starter article with more info that we can give you here:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/dec00/articles/adcompression.htm

(You should have the SOS Techniques/Articles bookmarked and READ them...)

 

[legionserial]

I understand what they do and, in general, how they do it. I guess I was just more looking to see where other people start.

You start by listening, and ascertaining if it needs compression or not. Not listening with a mind for compresing it, but listening to see what needs doing overall. You might say "shit, that needs a bit of compression, the dynamics are all over the place and I don't want them to be." Or you might not. You might decide it needs less low end. Or none of the above. Or both.

If you do indeed decide a particular track needs compressing, then you will already know why. Once you know why, you'll already have a good idea of what settings the compressor needs.

The best thing to do is read up on what each of the controls on a compressor do. what's attack, what's release, what's threshold. Once you've got that nailed, you'll know when something needs compression, what sort of compression, how much, and generally what to do with your compressor.

It's like putting salt on a meal. Until you taste the food, you won't have any real idea whether how much salt to use, or even whether to use salt at all.

I know that sounds like a bit of a gay answer, but like many aspects of recording/mixing, there are no absolutes.

The best starter setting for a compressor is 'off' until you know why you want to use it. Seriously, knowing why is a large part of knowing how or where to start..

 

[Daniel | Davis]

I think the biggest problem for me, as stated before, is being able to hear it exactly whenever it's used. I've read multiple articles and a few books on the topic but most of the time it's just redundancies of explaining the parameters. It's also a good thing for me to see what other people prefer to use an amount of it with certain instruments i.e. on bass guitar or opting to use none or minimal with organic sounding acoustic instruments.

 

[mixsit]

For 'ear training, and the biggest 'this-does/sounds like that' examples, in my opinion play with attack first. Beginning with a moderate ratio and relatively slow attack and some reduction, watching and listening to the reaction while reducing the attack time is very revealing. A huge part and character of reduction IMHO is in those first 0-50 ms or so (or more with mixed material) in that transition from 'peak to avg. response.
This tac' (way of looking') has led me to being open to (extensive? more ofthen than not.. ) use of very low ratios.

 

[XLR]

I second the recommendation to read the Sound On Sound article.

Understanding compression goes hand in hand with understanding the sonic characteristics - attack, sustain and decay - of the particular instrumental or vocal sound the compression's going to be applied to. Looking at close-ups of the wave forms in your recording app and getting a feel for the length in milliseconds of the attack, sustain and decay of an individual guitar pluck, drum hit, vocal articulation, etc, is a good place to start. Then the numbers on the compressor's attack and release controls will make sense.


Visualizing it graphically is good but you only really learn to use compression by listening carefully while experimenting.

 

[89gtsleeper]

I'm going to give you a few different scenarios in which I would use compression. Explain roughly how I would set the compressor, and why those settings will achieve the desired result. Keep in mind, I typically use compression as transparently as possible. These suggestions won't help you much if you want to use it otherwise.

1) Individual track is too quiet on the softer parts of the song, but is just right in the louder parts of the song. Goal: Bring up the soft parts to appropriate volume.

a) Find the average volume of the track during those quiet parts (Do this with the compressor off please). Set the threshold somewhere just above that level, so basically, the soft part of the song won't be compressed. Afterall, the whole point is to make that part louder, right?

***Here's a great tip on checking yourself. Turn the compressor's ratio to it's highest setting. Playback that soft part of the song in its entirety. If you see even the slighest amount of gain reduction, you need to raise the threshold. Raise it 1 db at a time until the compressor is no longer doing anything during that part of the song.

b) Use lower ratio. Likely around 1.5:1. To set this, consider two things. You have to know about how many db you are hoping to raise the volume of the soft parts of the song. Essentially, you want to see that amount of gain reduction during the loud parts of the song. To make the soft part 3 db louder, the loud part must be reduced by 3 db due to the compressor. The other thing, remember that the higher the gain reduction, the more likely it is to sound compressed, which probably isn't a good thing.
c) Fast attack.
d) Long release.
e) Set Make-up gain to match highest amount of gain reduction during the loud part of the song.

2) You need an entire track to be louder, but there are some nasty volume spikes that cause the track to clip out briefly, even though the track overall is still not loud enough in the mix. Any louder, and the clipping gets worse.

a) Set attack very fast. Possibly as fast as it can get.
b) Probably a medium ratio, say around 3.0:1
c) Identify loudest peak in song. Set threshold so you get enough gain reduction to raise the overall track volume to optimum levels, with no clipping.

3) Kick and snare are fighting in the mix. The drums sound great by themselves, and even with the guitars/vocals/keys are added... but once the bass gets added in. The kick disappears in the mix. Let it be said however, that the bass is not simply too loud, it's where it needs to be, but the kick just falls short once the bass starts playing. Let the sidechain brief tutorial begin...

a) Place a compressor on the bass track. Use the sidechain feature to sidechain the kick's input signal into the bass compressor.
b) Set a pretty fast attack.
c) Set the release medium-fast, as you don't want it to totally crush the bass volume, just merely to open a little pocket for the kick.
d) Use a lower ratio, like 1.5:1 or 2:1. Go to the part of the song where the bass overshadows the kick the most. Adjust Threshold to get maybe around 1-3 db gain reduction.

***What you have achieved here is simple, once the kick hits, the bass volume quickly drops a few db, then pretty quickly goes right back to where it was. Since the kicks' is a punchy, quick attack instrument, it only needs that pocket to open up in the bass for a very brief amount of time. If it's open longer, you're no longer leaving room for the kick. You're simply just killing the bass volume after the fact.

 

[mattr]

Its already been said, but the important thing is to know in your head what you are aiming to achieve with the compression. Imagine how you want it to alter the signal and it shouldn't be too difficult to set it up to do what you want. If you don't know what you are trying to achieve then ask yourself, why do I even think I need a compressor on this track? Is it simply because I've heard other people talk about them and feel its what I should be using to improve the sound? A compressor is a tool just like EQ, which you have to understand to use effectively. Imagine if you fired up an EQ plugin and just played around with things without knowing what you were doing


When I was starting out I found it easier to understand what the compression was achieving if I used a plugin with one of the graphs that showed the relationship between input and output (and the signal's position on that graph, making it easier to set the threshold).

e.g.

 

[mixsit]

..When compression begins to replace 'mixing.

1) Individual track is too quiet on the softer parts of the song, but is just right in the louder parts of the song. Goal: Bring up the soft parts to appropriate volume. ..

..With the caution- if or when large chunks, or significant portions of the track are of this 'low problem- consider volume automation. (Often even better, pre-'gain envelopes feeding into the comp) rather than comp.
Spending long amounts of time not releasing, or having to go exceedingly slow release to get it to act like it's riding the fader' could be a heads up.

 

[89gtsleeper]

You're absolutely right about that. But I think you also understood that my intent was merely to demonstrate an example in order to teach how a compressor can work. I'm not neccessarily saying it's the best way to fix these problems. More good advice from you, nonetheless.

 

[mixsit]

You're absolutely right about that. But I think you also understood that my intent was merely to demonstrate an example in order to teach how a compressor can work. I'm not neccessarily saying it's the best way to fix these problems. More good advice from you, nonetheless.

Yes, understood. Context!