Good Reverb for Classical Voice Track?

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JonPaulP

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I'm using the reverb that came with Cubase Essential but was wondering if there was anything better to use for a classical tenor voice. Any recommendations?

Thanks!
 
For an easy to use reverb, try Classic Reverb.

Glaceverb is amazing as well.
 
JP,
If you're on a Mac, there's a decent collection of free plugins at ApulSoft that you can try.

SSL also gives out some freebies from time to time on their
Plugin Download Page. I didn't see any reverbs up this month, though.

David
 
Thanks for the great suggestions guys!

Seafroggys, I just bookmarked the sites to download those reverbs. Can't wait to try them out. Are they much better than the standard reverb that comes with Cubase or other DAWs?

David, unfortunately I use a PC so I probably can't get any of the stuff from ApulSoft to work, but that SSL site looks really cool. I'll keep an eye out for any interesting plugins they might release.

I also remember someone recommending a convolution reverb. Any good plug-ins for that? Is it really a big difference from a 'regular' software reverb?
 
JonPaulP said:
I also remember someone recommending a convolution reverb. Any good plug-ins for that? Is it really a big difference from a 'regular' software reverb?
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Convolution, or impulse-based reverbs are IMGO the best of the bunch, for something as demanding as classical.
Check out the SIR reverb along with some impulses for it from Eventide and Lexicon (available at www.noisevault.com.)

G.
 
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I download SIR1 and some impulses on Noisevault a while back, but haven't seemed to find the right impulses for the right sound. Which impulses do you recommend? Thanks.
 
JonPaulP said:
I download SIR1 and some impulses on Noisevault a while back, but haven't seemed to find the right impulses for the right sound. Which impulses do you recommend? Thanks.
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Quality impulses from the Lexicon 960 are probably my generic go-to when I do use impulses. There are lots of great room, chamber, hall and plate impulses from the 960, depending on your need and taste.

There's also a "warm hall" from the Eventide H3000 which I tend to like on some vocals. I don't know how well that may or may not work for your instance, but it doesn't hurt to have it lying around.

G.
 
i just got an H3000. what flipping bargain those things are lately. agreed on the reverbs or dense room algorthms in them.

Mike
 
bigtoe said:
i just got an H3000. what flipping bargain those things are lately.
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Just out of curiosity, and if you don't mind my asking, Mike, just what kind of bargain are we talking about these days?

G.
 
One thing I find myself doing with classical is fairly substantial but gentle compression of the reverb. 1.1 or 1.2:1, 50ms attack, maybe a half second to two second release depending on the verb and the "hall" you're trying to create...

Make a verb that sounds very nice and "overdo it" just a bit on the loud passages, insert the verb and set the threshold for maybe 6dB of gain reduction on those loud parts. Readjust the threshold to taste.

The point is to "push the verb out of the way" during the louder parts, but (A) it keeps the verb a bit more "lush" for the softer parts and (B) allows the verb to "blossom" after vocal transients - Not unlike what your ears would distinguish** in a hall setting.



** How your ears & brain react - Not what's actually happening in the hall. This is what I've always done to "mimic" that wonderful anomaly.
 
If none of the Noisevault impulses work for you, you might want to check out some of the ones created by Morevox. They tend to sound very lush. I find myself using the Larry Seyer Large Hall impulse in Gigapluse alot. It sounds pretty natural to me.
 
Massive Master said:
The point is to "push the verb out of the way" during the louder parts, but (A) it keeps the verb a bit more "lush" for the softer parts and (B) allows the verb to "blossom" after vocal transients - Not unlike what your ears would distinguish** in a hall setting.
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Very interesting tip, John. I've always been afraid to compress reverb because of the tendency to change the spectral response of the verb, and also because I always tended to prefer not enough reverb to too much reverb, and the concept of "overdo" on the reverb has been kind of counter-intuitive for me. That said, though, I admit I never set it up in the manner you describe, and I can imagine by your description what you're aiming at there. I'll have to give that a try, it sounds very interesting.

In the past when I've tried addressing a similar effect, I automated the reverb to slightly change the wet/dry mix, drying it up a bit in the louder passages - or rather, keeping the relative amplitude of the verb fairly constant while the envelope of the dry track goes up and down. Thinking about it now, that's probably fairly similar to what you're doing with compression, but your method is a lot easier to set up and execute. D'oh. :o

G.
 
Good Reverb for Classical Voice Track?
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A concert hall??:confused::D

I gotta get me a simple mobile rig. I work in some of the best concert halls in the world, and record in my crowded living room.:(

The difference is HOW you approach it. In a hall, you just play/sing differently. You belt it out, enjoy the luxury and take more chances. In my living room, I play everything safe and it sounds sterile, no matter what kind of processing I do.

Most colleges have several halls, and are nice to people who are nice to them. If you can get a laptop, some phones etc, try it sometime. Go in at nite and act like you belong there.:D You'll sing differently, trust me.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Just out of curiosity, and if you don't mind my asking, Mike, just what kind of bargain are we talking about these days?

G.
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i've seen the later versions for as low as 650... i got my D/SE for 9 something a couple months ago.

Mike
 
Massive Master said:
One thing I find myself doing with classical is fairly substantial but gentle compression of the reverb. 1.1 or 1.2:1, 50ms attack, maybe a half second to two second release depending on the verb and the "hall" you're trying to create...

Make a verb that sounds very nice and "overdo it" just a bit on the loud passages, insert the verb and set the threshold for maybe 6dB of gain reduction on those loud parts. Readjust the threshold to taste.

The point is to "push the verb out of the way" during the louder parts, but (A) it keeps the verb a bit more "lush" for the softer parts and (B) allows the verb to "blossom" after vocal transients - Not unlike what your ears would distinguish** in a hall setting.



** How your ears & brain react - Not what's actually happening in the hall. This is what I've always done to "mimic" that wonderful anomaly.
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Thanks, that sounds like the type of sound I've been looking for! Problem is, I'm still a newbie and was wondering if you or someone wouldn't mind explaining how to achieve this.

I'm using Cubase Essential 4 and just realized that I have a limited version of Roomworks Reverb with not a whole lot of options, so I'm going to try to achieve this with the SIR1 plug-in or Classic Reverb plug-in. Let me know if there's a better plug-in I could get that would achieve this.

Below are the screenshots of the two plug-ins:

SIR1: http://www.knufinke.de/sir/pics/sir5_big.gif

Classic Reverb: http://www.kaosaudio.com/images/software/kjaerhus-classic-reverb-vst.jpg

Should I put the reverb on an FX track and then compress it by 1.1 or 1.2:1?
 
DavidK said:
The difference is HOW you approach it. In a hall, you just play/sing differently. You belt it out, enjoy the luxury and take more chances. In my living room, I play everything safe and it sounds sterile, no matter what kind of processing I do.
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This is an important point. Many home recordings sound like home recordings because that's where they are recorded . . . and the vocalist knows it. They know they're singing in a bedroom or a living room . . . they know that someone one is cooking something in the kitchen, the baby is asleep upstairs, there's a dog yelping its head off in the backyard somewhere and that the garbage truck is due to rumble by in a few minutes.

The consequence is that the vocal is inhibited, self-conscious and lacking in the sheer joy of singing.

It does require no mean feat of skill to push all that aside and sing as if you were in front of 15,000 people in a big concert hall; somewhere where you can lean against the energy of the venue to get those big notes happening.

I record vocal tracks dry. But I am quite happy to feed some reverb into the singer's headphones if I or they feel it will help them conjure up that concert hall feeling.

My general purpose reverb is a Timeworks plug in. It's getting on a bit in years, and I'm sure there are better ones around, but it suits most of my applications.
 
i find the complete opposite is true.

my clients play like they're on fire because they ARE at home and comfortable. no doubt about it.

i'm sure it goes both ways.

i'd never think to record a classical performer in anything but a hall or a church though...maybe that's just because that's how i always did it when that was my main gig.

Mike
 
gecko zzed said:
someone one is cooking something in the kitchen, the baby is asleep upstairs, there's a dog yelping its head off in the backyard somewhere and that the garbage truck is due to rumble by in a few minutes.
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Everybody now:
Our house, in the middle of our street
Our house, in the middle of our...

Huh? Oh, sorry, I thought zzed was starting a Madness sing-along there.... (Damn, now I can't get that song out of my head :P)


Back to the real madness...

The one thing I would caution whatever verb you choose or method you use to implement it, don't overdo it. It can be real easy to try and overdo a reverb, especially one meant to sound as if it were in a huge space. Think of it this way; just because a reverb is lush and full doesn't mean it's gotta be loud or dominant.

This is one of the advantages behind Massive's technique (if I understand it correctly) that it slightly throttles the volume of the reverb during the louder vocal passages.

There's an old platitude in audio that says, "If you consciously hear the reverb, you have too much reverb." While that may be a slight exaggeration in this case, it makes a very good general point.

G.
 
@ JPP - The verb isn't the important part - The routing is. You'd put the compressor on the aux, post-verb. It's that simple.

THAT SAID: A quick look at one image (SIR) makes it look like you're running the verb as an insert -- which I would highly NOT recommend in pretty much any case.

@ Glenn (etc.) - Although I find this almost a "necessity" for adding verb to classical recordings, I tend to do the same to a varying extent more times than not. Rock, pop, metal - Even live FOH work. When you really want to "hear the verb" on those quiet parts, it can quickly screw up the whole mix on the louder passages. Compress it pretty hard and you have that "blossom" where there is actually room for it and a tight, controlled verb that automatically "moves out of the way" where there isn't.
 
Massive Master said:
@ Glenn (etc.) - Although I find this almost a "necessity" for adding verb to classical recordings, I tend to do the same to a varying extent more times than not. Rock, pop, metal - Even live FOH work. When you really want to "hear the verb" on those quiet parts, it can quickly screw up the whole mix on the louder passages.
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Agreed. Which is probably a large contributor to the platitude about too much reverb.
Massive Master said:
Compress it pretty hard and you have that "blossom" where there is actually room for it and a tight, controlled verb that automatically "moves out of the way" where there isn't.
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Which - until now :) - I have addressed mostly through automation on the reverb return. I admit I probably haven't used it as much as you mention, probably because my way requires extra work (as if adding a whole 'nother track that requires mixing.) Mostly on low-density mixes with a dominant lead vocal where the reverb on the vocal can really stick out like a sore thumb (example: Buddy Guy's "It Feels Like Rain"), but for something like that it can be real helpful for keeping the verb from getting out of hand.

As I said, I never really considered using compression for that task until now. I admit, it's partly because I am a nut for level automation, I use it more than you're average ITB fader jockey; but partly also because I have been afraid that the compression would change the timbre of the reverb; i.e. it seems to tend to sustain the high frequencies in the reverb tails longer than natural. But that's probably because I have had either the ratio too high or the threshold too low.

I definitely can't wait to give your technique a try. :)

G.
 
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