Which Preamp do I need? AUDIENT or TRUE SYSTEMS

A

alessandrosaita

New member
Hello all,

First of all, I apologize for the long thread but I thought it best to explain exactly what I am doing to get the best advice. Bear with me for a moment please!

I am wandering the web in search of answers to my quest for the best solution.
Let me lay down the recording set up I have in mind.
I bought a lot of great mics (Shure KSM 32x2, Shure Beta 98 DSx5, AKG D112, Shure SM81, Sennheiser MD421) with a plan to record drums for my band.
These would go to through the preamp into the audio interface out the Firwire into Logic Pro 7.
After editing I would send all channels back through ADAT optical to the HD24 and while our guitarist/engineer mixes it on his Soundcraft 6000 I'll process the sounds on Logic with a number of plug ins. In the end the idea is to mix the "raw and analogue mix" with the "digitalised & processed mix"

Now the time has come to get the rest of the gear needed. Coincidentally Macintosh came out with the IMAC G5 so that's going to come home with me equipped with Logic Pro 7. After debating months over about whether it would be Protools or Logic, I decided it would be Logic. (because I am not the kind of consumer who will be forced into brand fidelity a-la-Protools!)
RME audio came out with the Fireface 800 which looks just as good as the MOTU 896 and has the extra Firewire 800 output that could come in handy in the future. I admit I haven't done a lot of research in the area of audio interfaces. I chose to concentrate on the area of preamps.
Preamps!!!I have wandered the web for the past month or so and basically what it comes down to is:
"Want to be serious and uncompromising get Grace design, Millenia, API, and the likes"...or at least that is the impression I get from reading reviews and threads throughout the day...
I have a budget that does not allow me to get those USD4,000+ preamps and I have finally brought it down to 2 choices:
AUDIENT ASP008 and TRUE SYSTEMS Precision 8. The choice is purely driven by a "money" factor as I have no experience with these preamps (or any other...) Of course I would have a choice of Presonus M80 or Digimax LT in a similar budget but I was advised to forget about Presonus if I wanted a clear sound without too much of a character to it.
TRUE SYSTEMS' Precision 8 has some good reviews but opinions are mitigated in most threads I read. As for AUDIENT ASP008, I haven't found anything about it!!
My questions are these:
1. What is a good preamp for this price range (up to USD2000) that has 8 channels? Is AUDIENT any good?
2. Do I need 8 channels of the same preamp to record drums or can it be 4+4, 6+2,etc..? (it strikes me I probably do not need the same preamp for the kick as for the snare or overheads, because the sound sources are so different in character. What do the pros do?)
3. If Millenia or API are as great everyone says they are shouldn't I be investing into those instead of some temporary (not so great...) solution that I will want to replace?
4. Any suggestions for an audio interface other than the usual MOTU 828 or 896?
A thousand apologies for the long thread but I need help :confused:
Thanks!!!
 
The Audient stuff doesn't get talked about much, but is quite good - I've heard some of their consoles and they're excellent.

I asked Fletcher about the True Systems stuff and he wasn't at all impressed...
 
Thanks Blue Bear!
Looks like either my thread is boring or too long...
What do you think of recording drums using several types of preamps rather than just one type of preamp. (example API 4channel + Millenia 4channel)? Perhaps the kick needs a different type of preamp to bring out it's own character (same for the snare or OHs)
 
If memory serves correctly, in the newest issue of TapeOp there is an ad with Ricky Skaggs endorsing the True 8 channel preamps for both live and studio use. If this is what he actually used on his bluegrass recordings, they are stellar units. But, who knows...

Terry
 
alessandrosaita said:
What do you think of recording drums using several types of preamps rather than just one type of preamp. (example API 4channel + Millenia 4channel)? Perhaps the kick needs a different type of preamp to bring out it's own character (same for the snare or OHs)
Click to expand...
That's exactly how you should be approaching it... the right tool that gives you the right sound for the job...

The Millenia Media stuff is excellent -- I have an SST-1 channel strip on my budget list......
 
Blue Bear Sound said:
That's exactly how you should be approaching it... the right tool that gives you the right sound for the job...

The Millenia Media stuff is excellent -- I have an SST-1 channel strip on my budget list......
Click to expand...

The Pendulum "Quartet" [IMNTLBFHO] eats the STT-1 for breakfast and shits it out before lunch.

As for the original question... I'd have to say "C; None of the above"... the two channel "True Systems" sounded OK until you hit in the "high gain" switch and all of a sudden to sound got quite narrow and kinda had almost a ringing sound to it in the like 3-4k range... quite odd, not musically pleasing at all [which was pretty much how the multi-channel unit sounds on it's best day]. The Audient... it was less offensive than the True Systems... but not by much.

For a rather nice version of "clean" [like what the True and the Audient are both trying to do], the best I've heard in that price range weight class is the Speck Electronics 5.0]

The tone is very clear and open, the function superb... and the really cool thing is that as you add more, you can connect their "mix node" so you can turn them into a 2 channel mixer... so say you have two mics on a guitar and want to sum them to one track... you have the exceptionally good sounding buss from the Speck unit rather than whatever other summing amp you might have in your joint.

In my place I have like 4 different summing systems [API, Phoenix Audio, a class A discreet Yamaha PM-2000 and a Speck LiLo]... the Speck summing system gets used most when I'm looking for a kinda "audiophile" clean thing... the Phoenix gets used most when I'm looking for some attitude.

Hope this is of some assistance

Peace.
 
Fletcher said:
The Pendulum "Quartet" [IMNTLBFHO] eats the STT-1 for breakfast and shits it out before lunch.
Click to expand...
Really? First time I've heard a knock against the SST-1.... I'll to try and set-up a comparison between the two.......!
 
You're joking aren't you? The GML 2020 and 2032 bury it, the Quartet and Quartet II bury it, and if you go section by section, it definitely ain't rocket surgery to find superlatives on an item by item basis... but as always, YMMV.
 
Fletcher said:
You're joking aren't you? The GML 2020 and 2032 bury it, the Quartet and Quartet II bury it, and if you go section by section, it definitely ain't rocket surgery to find superlatives on an item by item basis... but as always, YMMV.
Click to expand...
Must be the crowd I'm hanging out with..... ;)

But it's true that I hadn't actually heard any negatives from anyone on the Millenia unit, so I was a bit surprised by the comment...... as I said, I'll have to get a couple units in here and compare......
 
Thanks for the posts and opinions!!
But huh....I am looking at 8 channels of drums, any of the above multiplied by 8 is way over budget!!
8 channels of GML of 8304 would be USD6500 (on Mercenary)! I cannot even start to think of 8 channels of Speck or Pendulum !!!!
On our first recordings we used 7 dollar per channel pres the aim is to better it. The pro studio quality will be for later. There must be some solution between 7 dollars a channel and 900 dollars a channel!!!
I do like the idea though of having different pres for different sound sources.
Ahhh....These threads are great!!!!!
 
Fletcher said:
...
Hope this is of some assistance

Peace.
Click to expand...

Fletcher,

Can Mercenary Audio ship to Japan? If I am going to invest seriously, I could start off with 4 channels of API 3124P (or do you recommend the mixer version perhaps?...) ;)
 
Sasha, not a problem... we have many [many!] friends in Japan... I would generally recommend the 3124MB+ unless you have a great sounding console in which case, while the Mix Buss in the 3124MB+ will sound different, it could very well be redundant to tools already in your posession. If you're running something along the lines of a "Ghost" or an "Allen & Heath" etc. then I have a feeling the "Mix Buss" option will be of excellent assistance in supporting the integrity of your audio.

Alessandrosaita; as for 8 channels that are somewhere between $7/channel and $6,500 for the collection... we just retired our old Yamaha PM-1000 desk [we replaced it with a Speck Electronics "LiLo"]. It's a 16x 4 with 4 sends, and while it is currently set up as a 4 buss desk [8 buss if you count the aux sends], it ain't rocket surgery to have direct outs added after the mic pre section for the option of using the internal summing busses or running it as 16 stand alone mic pres.

The mic pre's in that desk are fully discreet "class A" stuff running on 48 volt rails which translates to "headroom for a month"!!! Finding pre-amps with that kind of depth and dimension in this day and age will run you at least $900/channel!! no shit. It's a great little tool, we just grew out of it.

The desk has been gone over fairly recently, I would say it's in like "B+/A-" condition... at any rate, I reckon I'm kinda spamming... but we're looking for $1k cash [as in green and gray pieces of paper with an illustration of a dead guy on the front] for it. It's kinda heavy so if you need it shipped it might run as much as a couple hundred bucks... the modification thing should only run you a couple hundred more... which even if it puts you at $2k for the whole thing its still dirt cheap for that many pre-amps of that kind of quality [with 8 excellent sounding busses as an addition].

Sorry if this went in too commercial a direction.

Peace.
 
D'oh!

I just realized that "alessandrosaita" and "Sasha" are one in the same person... my bad, not enough coffee... shipping to Japan on the PM-1K would be significantly more than "couple hundred dollars"... between crating and getting it onto a Nippon Express flight it [and I'm guessing here] will be around $500-$1,000 USD.

FYI, Nippon Express is without a doubt the best for doing heavy shipments... FedEx is best for a simple box or two, but for things like consoles, even small ones, Nippon Express rules.
 
Hey Fletcher!

Yes Alessandro & Sasha are the same person!!
Thanks I'll give it a little thought for the 3124MB. How much is the retail? 2500?
PM1000, Nice deal but really I can't be bothered hawling it over here.

To everyone:
My local dealer called me tonight and says he can get me a Precision 8 DEMO for the weekend and will lend me a Audient ASP008 for a week. Great!! I'll be doing a variety of tests on snare drum vox acoustic guitar with a number of the microphones I have.
Any ideas for the tests? (I mean how I should conduct them?).
I'll be recording to ADAT HD so whatever result hopefully I can post somewhere for people to listen. I'd be happy to hear recommendations on how to conduct the tests...

Ciao for now.
 
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