i don't know how to mix...just don't get it..

wes480

wes480

New member
I am coming a long way in tracking. Now, I have cool stereo tracks of guitars, good "fat" bass sounds...kick drums are there...etc. etc. etc.

When I listen to the "mix" though (on my HR824s), everything feels like it has a lot of space, like it is open, etc.

I used to think hey, this is great...this will sound awesome on my stereo or in the car. But, when I listen to it there, it just sounds "live" and "amateur" - like there really is no "mix" to it.

Then, I listen to good commercial recordings on the monitors - and they sound really bland, or even "dull". Then you put them in the car and boom, they come alive.

So obviously, I need to get my stuff to sound "dull" down there. How do I do this?

Also, the commercial CDs come together so "closely" where all of my tracks still have this sense of space...how do I get everything to just mesh like that?

Make it sound like it was done in a recording studio - not like a live sound.

I have other mix issues...but this is the big one, for now.

-wes
 
also, does anyone have an opinion on the HR824s in terms of what kind of sound character they have?

I like them...very detailed...but I am still having problems interpreting them - is "dull" what i need to go for?
 
Chances are Wes, you will never get that finely polished sound from home, especially if there not mastered. I know the feeling though. It takes a lot of good and bad experiences and practice to get a really good mix. Keep working at it and read up on some good mixing articles and tecniques. Spin pointed out one in another post.

http://www.studiocovers.com/articles.htm
 
well, it isn't that i want to sound "polished" - i just don't want it to sound "live".

i mean, really i don't care if the thing sounds kind of dirty...or like it was done in a basement or whatever...

but right now I feel like I am just getting tracks stacked on top of each other, and there is no mix at all..

I just want it to sound like a mix beyond just level balancing....

ok, I'll read the article and go from there.
 
Maybe you need to mix on more than just your Mackies.

Lots of good sounding mixes were done on NS10's which are considered by most (even users) to be crappy sounding speakers. Often studios with the best monitors will have a crappy pair of speakers to check how their mixes translate to "the real world".

Since I don't have a good pair of near-fields I check my mixes on three sets of speakers (4" singles, 8" 2-way & 12" 3-way) and 'phones. When it sounds decent on all those I put a fork in it and move on.
 
Watch your reverb/delay settings and your instrument placement in the stereo field too.

A little of the above can go a long way.
 
I was just making an alesis joke. Normally compression "tightens" things up a bit, as far as I know. Perhaps Tex could clarify for you, for he is by far my superior in this realm...;)
 
BuildingStudios said:

... Subtractor... could you or someone else clarify what the use of a compressor would do to help. I'm curious of your thoughts??
Click to expand...

A lot of the differences between older albums, live recordings and newer studio recordings is the use of compression. If you listen to older rock albums there is a lot less compression used on the drums and bass and the rythm section while being more dynamic can also sound a bit pushed back.

Listen carefully to drums and rythm guitars on older recordings (especially pre 70's Who, Beatles, Stones etc.) and you will hear how the sounds hit you on the peaks but then drop off pretty quicky. It's very obvious on cymbals. On acoustic guitars you will only really notice the hard accent strums and the rest gets a little lost. I'm not saying that any of that is bad but that is just some of the characteristics.

Compare that to more modern recordings and you will notice that the high hat is in your face, you hear every bit of bass (even fret buzz in some cases) and acoustic guitars are very up front even on quieter picking parts. That is what compression does.

Usually most people will associate 'polished' with a lot of compression. Using an analog console to add a bit of color to an entire mix can also provide a bit of sonic glue to help everything seem to fit together better. Just make sure you use super glue and not Elmer's.
 
Just some random thoughts.

There seem to be many different approaches in commercial music to get the depth that so many of us seem to seek. But there isn't anything that seems very universal.

The two albums I've been listening to and comparing are Ween's 12 Golden Cowboy Greats and the new Weezer, Maladroit. What's interesting about these mixes is that on the Ween album the vox are double tracked and panned HARD L&R like 80% (7 and 4 o'clock). On the Weezer cd the guitars are doubled/tripled etc and panned into those spaces with the vox coming though the "center" of the mix.

I've been playing with both of these mixes with my own stuff and finding lots of new sounds and aural space.

My greatest breakthough this week was pulling down the levels across the board! The amount of overall distortion taken out was stunning!
 
tex - as far as the older classic recordings...

hrmm, interesting. I always thought a lot of the drum sounds on something like Abbey Road were very much due to compression....

Or the bass guitar on the White Album...

but, really I would love to have a mix like the Beatles (wouldn't we all...and I know it has to do with 8 million things).

But, when my stuff isn't compressed - it sounds very bright and crisp etc...spacious that's really the sound I want to get rid of.

If I was doing some kind of jazz recording...the sound I have might be kind of cool...

but for rock and roll it's just too "perfect". So I am looking for a way to make the recording sound more focused....more "glued" - but not more "polished".

I really don't want to have to buy a mixer - becuase my Aardvark card does everything I need it to do - but do you think that mixing in analog could be the ticket to this sound perhaps?

Like, if I recorded everything digitally into the Aardvark, and then ran the outputs of that back into something like a Soundcraft Spirit M8...(those are supposed to have good EQ..)

and then back again into the Aardvark. So, you'd have an extra step of digital conversion...

At this point i am not worried about signal integrity really....but I just want some color to my sound....and I need some help with the glue!

I have an RNC...I'll play with that more...see what I can do.

Hrmm....thoughts on getting a Spirit M8 tex, or anyone?
 
tex - as far as the older classic recordings...

hrmm, interesting. I always thought a lot of the drum sounds on something like Abbey Road were very much due to compression....

Or the bass guitar on the White Album...

but, really I would love to have a mix like the Beatles (wouldn't we all...and I know it has to do with 8 million things).

But, when my stuff isn't compressed - it sounds very bright and crisp etc...spacious that's really the sound I want to get rid of.

If I was doing some kind of jazz recording...the sound I have might be kind of cool...

but for rock and roll it's just too "perfect". So I am looking for a way to make the recording sound more focused....more "glued" - but not more "polished".

I really don't want to have to buy a mixer - becuase my Aardvark card does everything I need it to do - but do you think that mixing in analog could be the ticket to this sound perhaps?

Like, if I recorded everything digitally into the Aardvark, and then ran the outputs of that back into something like a Soundcraft Spirit M8...(those are supposed to have good EQ..)

and then back again into the Aardvark. So, you'd have an extra step of digital conversion...

At this point i am not worried about signal integrity really....but I just want some color to my sound....and I need some help with the glue!

I have an RNC...I'll play with that more...see what I can do.

Hrmm....thoughts on getting a Spirit M8 tex, or anyone?
 
The Beatles albums you mentioned were early 70's albums weren't they? Whichever, I am referring more to early Hard Day's Night kind of stuff where it really had more of a live sound as oppposed to their later stuff which really sounds more polished.

From what you have been saying I really think compression is what will help. It's hard to say without listening but when you talk about jazz, high end and 'air' those are usually characteristics of very uncompressed recordings.

Try running your entire mix through the RNC as an experiment. Set the threshold very low (-20 to -40) set the attack the fastest and the release the slowest. Set the ratio around 10:1. This should compress the hell out of the mix.

Speed up the release for more punch.

Slow down the attack for more clarity and air.

Adjust the threshold and ratio to taste.

See if you start getting more of the sound you are looking for. Using the M8 may help but it's hard to say if that will really give you what you are looking for.

Post an MP3 if you can just to make sure we're talking about the same thing and not way off with the advice.
 
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