V67 or v77 for Double Bass?

Chris F

Chris F

New member
I've been recording Jazz duos for quite a while now, and thanks to the MXL 603's I bought, I'm getting some good sounds from the piano and guitar players I've been playing with...but my bass mic needs to be replaced. My...er....um..."financial advisor" has just approved a Large Diaphragm mic purchase, and I can afford either the MXL V67 or the V77. The sound I'm looking for can only be described as more "open" and "transparent" than the sound I'm getting now, which can (I hope) be found through the following link:




The sound on that recording isn't terrible, but it has a boomy resonance to certain notes and ranges of the instrument that I'd like to get rid of without sacrificing the ballsy sound my current mic gets out of the upper end of the range.

So does anybody have any suggestions about which mike will give me a better acoustic sound? I've never used a tube mic before and don't know if they color the sound a great deal, or in what way. Any advice will be appreciated.

Thanks.
 
Chris,

To my ear, the V77 sounds more "open, neutral, and transparent" than the V67G. The V67G has a slightly "warmer, thicker" sound by comparison.
 
I bought three V67Gs in spring this year, Harvey, based on your
comments, in your forum that you had on your web site, about the
V67`s sonics - I have never regretted my purchase. Based on
what you say now, Harvey, I don`t think I`ll need a tube based
mic for the time being. I think I`ll buy me some dynamic mikes and a Royer ribbon.
I also have two Crown DM700 electret-condensers and
two Audio-Technica 4049 omni condensers. (sometimes used with
a Jecklin Disc). I record mostly acoustic music like traditional Nor-
wegian music, or Folk music that we call it here, which isn`t Folk
music in the American meaning of the word - that is a more contemporary music, I think.

Ola
 
Harvey Gerst said:
Chris,

To my ear, the V77 sounds more "open, neutral, and transparent" than the V67G. The V67G has a slightly "warmer, thicker" sound by comparison.
Click to expand...

Harvey,

If you were going to record a Double Bassist in an all pizz jazz situation and had only those two mics to chosse from, which would you reach for first? By the way, I LOVE the 2 603's that I bought on your recommendation...they were just the ticket for what I'm doing. Thanks.


Warlock,

The guitar was recorded using 2 MXL 603s mics: one on the f-hole (it's a Buscarino archtop), and one about 9" from the cone of the speaker cab of the amp. The bass was recorded using the only other mic I have at the moment, a plain old vanilla SM58. I think the 58 does an OK job, but it picks up some resonant frequencies that make the recording "bottom out" in certain ranges of pitches. The bass itself has only one "wolf tone", which is the open D, but when recording, everything within a perfect 5th of that note sounds boomy with the 58.
 
Harvey Gerst said:
Chris,

To my ear, the V77 sounds more "open, neutral, and transparent" than the V67G. The V67G has a slightly "warmer, thicker" sound by comparison.
Click to expand...

The V67G also has a warmer thicker sound in comparison to the SE5000. I think an SE5000 will get you close to the sound you're looking for.

Here's a short .wav clip of a rough mix of a mariachi band I've started recording in my living room. This is a clip of a rehearsal. SE5000 on a big acoustic bass guitar, into a soundcraft M8 with a digital out straight into a Teac consumer CD recorder. And, yeah, I know the acoustic guitar is too loud and wanked over to the left channel ... I DID say it was a rehearsal, afterall ;)

www.escape.ca/~kellyd/bassclip.wav
 
Chris,

There is a world class Jazz bassist who has many albums out. I do not know his name, but if you call Sound Pure in Durham, NC at 919-682-5552, he can tell you all about this guy and what he uses for recording and live. From what I understand, this guy is a very well know artist.
 
Kelly Dueck said:


The V67G also has a warmer thicker sound in comparison to the SE5000. I think an SE5000 will get you close to the sound you're looking for.

Here's a short .wav clip of a rough mix of a mariachi band I've started recording in my living room. This is a clip of a rehearsal. SE5000 on a big acoustic bass guitar, into a soundcraft M8 with a digital out straight into a Teac consumer CD recorder. And, yeah, I know the acoustic guitar is too loud and wanked over to the left channel ... I DID say it was a rehearsal, afterall ;)

www.escape.ca/~kellyd/bassclip.wav
Click to expand...


Kelly,

That's a pretty transparent sound alright...the only problem is, I have to admit that what I know about the way an acoustic Bass Guitar is supposed to sound would fit on the head of a pin. Who makes the SE5000, anyway?

And where should I be shopping for a good price on a V77?


Alan,

I get to work with some world class bassists each summer at the Aebersold camps...each one has their own preferences of mics based on the sound they're going for. I'd almost rather hear the advice coming from an engineer, as it seems the bassists I know are all looking to color their sound with the mics. I'm really just looking to capture what's coming off the bass, although I do have to admit that I like to tweak the EQ a bit during mixdown. I do know that everybody recommends Large Diaphragm for DB, but beyond that, the guys I get to talk to in the summer (Rufus Reid, Lynn Seaton, John Goldsby) are all using mics in the $2000.00 range, and only Goldsby's recorded sound comes close to what I'm looking for. It's kind of a booger, since nobody around here carries the brands being discussed around this board.

Thanks,

Chris
 
I tried to update the link in my original post, but the "edit window" had expired. Anyway, the current one is:


"Day in the Life of a Fool" (excerpt) - hosted by Xavier G.


I'm probably going to try the V77 for this (when the old "financial advisor" gives a green light, I've found that it's never wise to wait too long), just because I was so happy with the other MXL mics, and because if I understand things right, a tube mic won't need phantom power (is this right?).

On another note, I'm wondering if I'm even asking the right question here...should I be looking to the mic as the source of the "tubbiness" of the bass sound on this recording, or should I instead be looking towards some sort of graphic or parametric EQ option? And if so, should I be posting THAT question in another forum?

Any input appreciated.:cool:
 
Chris F said:
I understand things right, a tube mic won't need phantom power (is this right?).

On another note, I'm wondering if I'm even asking the right question here...should I be looking to the mic as the source of the "tubbiness" of the bass sound on this recording, or should I instead be looking towards some sort of graphic or parametric EQ option?
Click to expand...


The tube mic will need phantom power but it'll come with it's own external powersupply in order to ensure that it does get all the power it needs.


As for the other note . . . It's going to be a combination of the mic and mic placement (not to mention the pre). You might even try using two mics. The 77 on the body and the 58 up the neck somewhere. Al Schmitt aparently double mics the bass reguarly on Diana Krall sessions (check out his past forum on artistpro.com) He uses all tube mics -- however in his case it's U47's and C12's.
 
Kelly,

Thanks for the information. As far as the pre goes, right now I'm just using the Yamaha pres on my 4 track. Do they sound funky to you? I've never used any higher end stuff....I've been dealing with the mic placement thing for a long time, and Harvey has been very helpful. I've been assuming that the 58 is not an ideal instrumental mic, and that the tubbiness was probably coming from there. I don't get it with the 603s, but with them, I get too thin a sound and too much string noise. I guess I'll have to experiment with placement with each new mic...

Thanks again,

Chris
 
ever thought of an earthworks sro? I hopefully will get mine next week (finally!) and be able to record a contrabass player soon, if possible, i'll post the result here!
 
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