so bob katz owes me money

I

ikon

New member
not really...but i bought his book cause everyone keeps telling me that his book is the book to get to get to the next level...so i droped 40 bucks on it.....nothing in it was anything i havnt learned through other books that i have bought.....but the thing that got to me was towards the end of the book it says you can master yourself but it will take longer, then goes right onto sayin send it out to someone with experience for faster results....now the annoying part of that is...if you do mastering yourself and can acheive results over time, isnt that the same thing as being an experienced me or (sequencer) as bob katz calls it...

i dunno i just feel his book was full of stuff that ened up contradicting itself alot...i suggest other books =\
 
ikon said:
not really...but i bought his book cause everyone keeps telling me that his book is the book to get to get to the next level...
Click to expand...

You aren't likely to get to 'the next level' by reading a book. Books and the internet will tell you the fundamentals, but the rest is down to your ears, your judgement, and practice.

As far as sending it to an outside engineer goes... What he's saying is the absolute truth. You'll get a quicker result sending it to a good professional mastering engineer than learning to master and then doing it yourself, because it takes a long time to to get to that kind of 'level', and the professionals already spent a whole bunch of time doing that.
 
im sorry dude but i dont believe that.....i strongly believe if someone can grasp the concept and the knowledge if mastering and can practice enough they can get one the same level as any pro ME....not everyone but to me thats liek saying dont even try cause you will never achieve it.....it aint about your plugins and the price of them or what gear you have...its about what you do with them....just because you went to school to learn how to paint dont mean you paint better then a 12 year kid who has the grasp of it without schooling
 
ikon said:
im sorry dude but i dont believe that.....i strongly believe if someone can grasp the concept and the knowledge if mastering and can practice enough they can get one the same level as any pro ME....not everyone but to me thats liek saying dont even try cause you will never achieve it.....it aint about your plugins and the price of them or what gear you have...its about what you do with them....just because you went to school to learn how to paint dont mean you paint better then a 12 year kid who has the grasp of it without schooling
Click to expand...

I never said any of that. I never said that you can't be a mastering engineer. I said it takes time to learn. What you think you can pick up a book, read it and suddenly be able to do the job a pro can?

Simple fact, sending a record to mastering engineer to get it mastered, will take a few days. Learning to master as well as that guy will take a few years. What part of that do you 'not believe'?

Yeah, anyone can do it with the right amount of dedication, that's pretty much what I said. If someone has shitty ears and poor judgement, they aren't going to be able to master good record. But they can train their ears and their judgementand get better.

I'm sorry, I really just don't understand in what part of my post I said "dont even try cause you will never achieve it". Or where I said that it was about the plugins or the gear you have. Christ, I'm running a cheap as fuck setup myself, with 1 preamp, 1 mic, a computer, a whole bunch of (legal) freeware plugins, and some busted monitors, and I haven't had the urge to spend any money on improving it beyond getting my monitors fixed. And I'm a fucking amateur...I've been fucking around with this stuff for around 6 years. I've improved massively in that time, but I'm no pro. I don't have the experience with anything but my own music and my own vision for starters.

You will improve massively too in time if you keep at it. It is a craft, like anything else. If you keep at it, and stay dedicated, then "you can do it", as they say. Just don't expect overnight results.

Fact is though, it still takes time to learn and train your ears and gain experience to do it at a pro level. Sending a record to a pro doesn't. It all depends on your agenda. If your working on a fun project for home, then do it yourself, might aswell. If you have to get a record out because of some kind of deadline, or whatever, if you have the budget, send it out to an ME.

Aside from that, the bonus of sending it out to an ME, is that you get a second set of ears.
 
ikon said:
im sorry dude but i dont believe that.....i strongly believe if someone can grasp the concept and the knowledge if mastering and can practice enough they can get one the same level as any pro ME....not everyone but to me thats liek saying dont even try cause you will never achieve it.....it aint about your plugins and the price of them or what gear you have...its about what you do with them....just because you went to school to learn how to paint dont mean you paint better then a 12 year kid who has the grasp of it without schooling
Click to expand...

I don't think you addressed one thing Legion said, and you twisted around anything you came close to addressing. What he stated was fact. You COULD become a ME, but at this point, it would be FASTER to send it out. That's all he (and BOB K) are saying.

What part of that do you disagree with???:eek:
 
im sorry i must of misread what he was saying....if it seemed i was being on the offensive i wasnt meaning too....im not expecting to read a book and boom im a pro lol.....but i am expecting to read a book that is so pricey to give more content for a better understanding then a "book for dummies" is.....the book dont even go through pro's and con's of sending it our or doing yourself other then...you can do yourself but it will take forever. i would of glanced through the book before purchasing it but my wife bought it without me there.

though the free poster is nice =]
 
ikon said:
just because you went to school to learn how to paint dont mean you paint better then a 12 year kid who has the grasp of it without schooling
Click to expand...

It's more like brain surgery. Some people have to go to years of school for it, and some people just get it at 12 years old.
 
i think the op is just stating the book wasn't that good.
just because its bob katz, doesn't mean the book has to be good.
i never read it but at $40 and agree with the op, it better be damn good!
i can get a mastering magazine for $6 or online for free.

did the book speak of anything interesting?....the gear and monitor setup, do they use the 3ft triangle or is it more of a larger far distance type monitoring?

IKON sounds like your wanting to be an ME which is why the $40 was dropped on the book?

so how does one learn?...first guess is read about it, learn. so one drops $40 and expects some really really good info.

wonder if there's any good DVD's on this Mastering stuff, targeted for HR?

Or!! ? save up a few G's and then go sit in on a real Mastering session?:D
 
I don't understand how anybody can buy a reference book on *any* topic without flipping through it either physically or electronically first to figure if it's what they need or not.

For me, it's directly analogous to buying loudspeakers without listening to them first. A book that works for this person doesn't work for that one, and vice versa; different people like different writing styles and/or are looking for a slightly different set of information with a different specific focus. Some are looking for a training book, others for a desk reference; this guy wants the tech detail, that one wants high concept only, and so on. This is why there are so many different but successful models of loudspeaker and why there are so many different popular and bestselling books on just about any given topic out there.

If one has to get a non-fiction reference book home and read it before they can discover if it's "worth it" or not can't blame anything but sloppy shopping skills for wasting their money.

G.
 
Well, the original poster proved that you can't become an accomplished mastering engineer from reading books.

He said the Bob Katz book didn't offer him any new information that he didn't already know. So that means he should be as good as Bob Katz, right?

Audio engineering is not just an intellectual pursuit where you memorize a bunch "facts" gleaned from books and message boards. It is an art that lives in the realm of music and sound, an art that cannot be conveyed by words alone.

Describe a Beethoven symphony in words. Not as good as the real thing you listen to, is it?

So the *only* way to learn mastering and reach a high professional level is to apprentice with a mastering engineer who is at the top of their game. It will be the very rare mastering engineer that can reach mastery of their craft without having an extensive background (also known as experience) in music or professional recording studios. Sitting at home by yourself with your plugins does not count.

We learn from others, knowledge is passed from one person to the next in the context of "doing". You have to see the techniques used in action and then the audio result to really be able to put the picture together.

My advice to the original poster, if he is truly interested in learning to be a mastering engineer, would be to get a job assisting a mastering engineer. More will be learned in an hour than by reading ten books.

Bob Katz does not owe you forty dollars.
 
MadAudio said:
I think y'all missed this part.....
Click to expand...
Then I don't get what he's complaining about. He didn't even buy the book, it was a gift. Not to mention it was a thoughtful gift from his wife who probably looked upon it with the same lack of interest and disdain that most of us guys would look upon going to see the "Sex In The City" movie.

Hell, I think just knowing that he has a wife who did that for him is worth more than $40 right there, even if every page in that book were blank.

But it still remains that Bob Katz didn't twist anybody's arm to buy or even like that book. It apparently was was useful enough to enough people to be recommended to ikon, and ikon apparently expressed enough desire in owning it that his wife took his lead and bought it for him.

Not only do I not see where any of that is Bob Katz's fault, but I don't see where there is any fault anywhere because I see nothing wrong anywhere in that situation.

G.
 
glad i got some good responses from everyone.....i understand that i cant learn everything from readings books. but i can learn alot from reading them and testing them out and expirementing the stuff i read.......

now the book wasnt a total loss for me...i just want to have that said......the part that i was upset about was is that it didnt offer any more technical information then much cheaper books....though it did offer alot more history behind the title of what an ME is and how it all started...for that knowledge i guess the book makes it worth.....

or maybe i just felt duped into wanting it because of the name on it......

eitherway,
i would like to thank everyone who posted there opinions in here aswell because i honesty think i have learned more from you guys and trying out your suggestions more then any bought book or magazine......i may not have alot of post per time i been registered but i read and appreciated all the info you guys give!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top